F-LO TAKEDOWN: Mayweather Versus 10 Of The Greatest Welters In History

I agree with what most of this article says BUT, most of the guys that Mayweather is being compared against here have WW as being the best division of their careers, while 147 is absolutely not the best division of Floyd's career. If you want to make it a better argument put Floyd against the best 135lbers of all time. Exactly a very rational comment, especially the bolded. The article was made in response to another article where the writer had claimed that Mayweather would beat all 10 welters mentioned.

If someone had a gun to Floyd head and told him to fight these guys I think he would do ok. But the truth is he would never fight these guys if they were in their prime.

I agree with what most of this article says BUT, most of the guys that Mayweather is being compared against here have WW as being the best division of their careers, while 147 is absolutely not the best division of Floyd's career. If you want to make it a better argument put Floyd against the best 135lbers of all time.

What irony are you talking about? There were 4 bouts, with the Mosely ones being split if you want to give Oscar the benefit of the doubt.

Irony. Crap article. What irony are you talking about?

all articles like this are crap, i could easily write an article saying why mayweather would beat all these guys and no one could disprove either of us, besides all of these guys lost to guys less skilled than mayweather in one fight or another so why couldn't mayweather beat them on any given night? Because all these fighters are ATG welterweights and welterweight is not Floyds natural weightclass.

all articles like this are crap, i could easily write an article saying why mayweather would beat all these guys and no one could disprove either of us, besides all of these guys lost to guys less skilled than mayweather in one fight or another so why couldn't mayweather beat them on any given night?

People are entitled to their own opinions. I hate when people talk about boxing history and who would beat who so "matter-of-factly" because they think they're some great boxing mind. The bottom line is you can dissect any fighter from any era, and, match up any two guys you want, and it doesn't mean crap, because you can't prove any of it. That is why I really hope the Mayweather-Pacquiao fight comes off, because if it doesn't there will be a generation of idiots arguing how it would have went down and who would have won

Written by Frank Lotierzo part 1 Maybe the fact the author included Oscar De La Hoya as one of the all-time great welterweights in history tells us all we need to know about how limited his scope is pertaining to professional boxing. Just in case anyone is not sure - Oscar De La Hoya was not a great welterweight. As a fighter there's not one thing he did great. Sure he was tough and fought the best of his era, but never did he once separate himself from the three best welterweights he fought, Pernell Whitaker, Felix Trinidad and Shane Mosley. Giving him the benefit of every doubt he went 1-1-1 in those bouts. Irony. Crap article.

great.... :thanks: Your welcome, I wanted to see what people over here in NSB would think about it.

part 2 Although Mickey Walker was not as great a welterweight as Ray Robinson (no one was), he's the guy who, aside from possibly Hearns, would beat Mayweather most easily. And he'd have a great time doing it. Nothing in Mayweather's anemic offense would slow Mickey down for a fraction of a second. He would put more pressure on Floyd than Mayweather would believe possible. The guy who Walker most resembled offensively was Roberto Duran. He never let you rest, he mixed his combinations brilliantly, working the head and body, and he was a murderous puncher with either hand. And, unlike Floyd Mayweather, Walker loved to fight. Harry Greb, probably the second greatest fighter who ever lived behind Robinson, couldn't stop Mickey Walker (and he knew a lot more ways to cut up his opponents than Floyd Mayweather will ever imagine.) Heavyweight champion Jack Sharkey, a 200 pounder with real pop, couldn't do it either. Does Gavin Evans really believe that powder puff punching Floyd Mayweather, the guy who couldn't knock out a used up Oscar De La Hoya or an overfed, over-aged featherweight (admittedly a great one) in Juan Manuel Marquez would kayo a prime Mickey Walker? Among a long list of really stupid assertions, this one may be the dumbest. Mickey Walker routinely knocked out 200 pound men who weren't stiffs. And he would have knocked Floyd Mayweather loopy without the slightest problem. Does Evans realize what a life-taker Florentino Fernandez was? And Griffith had his way with him bettering him boxing and physically moving him around the ring wherever he wanted. Emile took the trilogy he had with Benny "Kid" Paret who was an aggressive fighter who could box and punch. But he couldn't handle Griffith's upper-body strength, pressure and hand speed. It's doubtful that Mayweather has ever seen the likes of a Paret, let alone suggesting he could handle a welterweight who not only was the first to drop Dick Tiger, but chased him up to light heavyweight. Tiger was so good he beat Jose Torres to capture the light heavyweight title and held onto it until he was knocked out at the very end of his career by Bob Foster. Griffth was an aggressive counter-puncher. He wasn't manhandled by middleweights the likes of Nino Benvenuti, Carlos Monzon and Dick Tiger. Emile was too strong for the great Luis Rodriguez to box for the duration of the fight. What does Floyd Mayweather posses in his arsenal to keep Griffith from walking him down and working him over? Nothing, based on his fights with Judah, Baldomir and De La Hoya. Mayweather's slight advantage in height wouldn't have mattered a bit. And for Evans to consider Mayweather the puncher in a match up with Griffith is laughable. Griffth threw straight punches and they were fast. He also could throw short powerful hooks and uppercuts inside. Couple that with his freakish physical strength and stamina, how does Mayweather hold off a fighter who he holds no physical advantage over? Fighting Griffith, as it would be the case with Basilio, Mayweather would discover early in the fight that's it's a lifetime different moving back on your own than it is when you're being forced to do it. Mayweather being forced back would be fighting to stabilize the fight and wouldn't be in control like he was facing the fighters he's fought. It would be impossible for him to win a decision over Griffith being forced to fight Emile's fight. As for Kid Gavilan - he would've reigned for years as welterweight champ had Sugar Ray Robinson not been fighting in the same division. As Evans correctly stated, Gavilan lost a disputed decision to Robinson the first time they fought. In the rematch for the title Robinson won a non-controversial decision over Gavilan. However, that was Robinson at his best. A welterweight who had a better punch assortment, hit harder, threw more of them and faster than Mayweather ever dreamed he could. Plus Robinson was mean and nasty and almost impossible to hurt at 147. If Gavilan can hang with Robinson and deal with a rough-house and tough guy like Carmen Basilio, what's Mayweather gonna do with Gavilan? I completely disagreed with Evans when he said Mayweather hits harder than Gavilan. He may hold the edge in defensive prowess, but he's not beating Gavilan with his defense. A motivated Gavilan would neutralize Mayweather's speed and defense. When Gavilan cut loose he put combinations together in multiples. If Mayweather engaged him he'd lose because "The Keed" would get there with more and wouldn't have to break off the exchanges. In order for Mayweather to beat Gavilan, he'd need to be at his best and catch Gavilan on a night where he wasn't fighting with a sense of urgency - and even at that it wouldn't be enough. If Evans only sees a split decision for Mayweather, he's telegraphing how unsure he is about the outcome. I'm not. Gavilan controls Mayweather inside and outside and wins a comfortable decision over a fighter who isn't a better boxer or strong enough to unnerve him. Imagine if De La Hoya was more aggressive and stronger on the night he fought Floyd. Oscar has no inside hook or right hand and had Mayweather stymied with his roughhouse tactics and a half hearted jab that he threw. If Basilio could drop Gavilan for a nine-count, and bull Robinson around the ring for fifteen rounds as he smothered him (and that was a middleweight Robinson), how on God's earth would Mayweather keep Carmen off of him? Some fighters are too strong to box - and that's what would've transpired had Basilio and Mayweather crossed paths at their welterweight best. Mayweather's seize the moment pot-shot offense doesn't match up with the real authentic swarmers like some of the greats from past eras. (There's a dearth of good attackers/swarmers fighting today). Basilio pushed a beast like Gene Fullmer back and forced him to fight in retreat. Mayweather's hand speed would keep him from getting totally overwhelmed, but he's never experienced the type pressure and aggression that Basilio would bring. Imagine Castillo three fold with more tenacity and power. When Mayweather let his hands go against Basilio, it would be out of need and he'd be rushing his punches, therefore he'd have even less on them. Floyd couldn't beat Carmen fighting in the mode where he's just trying to keep Carmen off of him. And he doesn't have the physical strength or power to keep Basilio from forcing the fight from bell-to-bell. Maybe Mayweather opens a cut on Basilio and the fight would be stopped, but even at that he'd be behind in the scoring. Again, some fighters are too strong to box, and Carmen Basilio was one of them. Mayweather wasn't nearly strong enough to outbox Basilio and would have to hold on just to make it the distance. At least Mr. Evans had the presence of mind to recognize that four of his top ten welterweights (Robinson, Leonard, Hearns, and Burley) would have beaten Floyd Mayweather. From there on, his sense once again deserts him: he believes that three of the four fights would have been close, with only Hearns potentially winning decisively. You don't get close to beating fighters of this caliber without a formidable offensive arsenal. Floyd Mayweather has nowhere near the tools to be competitive with any of these four. Three of them would have knocked Mayweather out effortlessly. Leonard might not have, but he would have completely controlled the fight from start to finish. But if forced to pick, Leonard would've had to have been pulled off of Mayweather the way he was Hearns the first time they fought. Floyd Mayweather doesn't have the strength or physical skill to defeat one of the ten welterweight greats Mr. Evans listed. Having Mayweather going 6-4 is a pipe-dream, 0-10 is more like it. And in case anyone is wondering, Manny Pacquiao equals Mayweather here as well, as he would also be shutout going 0-10 against the same field of welterweight greats.