Dear Sergio, P4P means challenging fighters up the weight ladder, not downward...

where are all the ppl who were calling foul when the same thing was said about donaire less than a month ago??:dunno: maybe you missed the fact that he said stop picking on smaller guys and move up.....donaire was moving up in that fight and will continue to move up and not fighting flyweights? but it's ok. Your a bit preemptive on this thread. next 2 fights if it's the same **** then we can bump this thread.

most people hate hopkins(especially judges) well, I pretty much hate him too, hes a jackass. I still can respect his abilities as a boxer however.

perhaps it wasnt the perfect example, but in hindsight most people look at Trinidad as a 'blown up' Welterweight, even though that isnt true and he was clearly doing very well at MW. I just decided to use it since most people would know what Im talking about. most people hate hopkins(especially judges)

Martinez fighting Pacquiao at 160 is too big a stretch to me though. I would need them to fight at 154 for me to give too much credit to Martinez. Oh no, I don't think they should fight at 160 at all. 154 would be ideal. Not just for Pacquiao, but it would be nice to see Floyd step away from his webcam, take a tune-up then swap blows with Martinez. Both of these guys.

I don't think anyone knowledgeable thinks that. Hell, Tito KO'ed Cherifi in four on his way out. The win is probably still the best of Bernard's career, so it doesn't seem to me that's the popular opinion. In any case, the fight determines what's right. Hopkins proved too good for Tito, not necessarily too big. And if Martinez fought Manny, the same would probably hold true. It isn't so much his as much as it is the skill that goes along with it. That's usually the case with elite fighters. Martinez fighting Pacquiao at 160 is too big a stretch to me though. I would need them to fight at 154 for me to give too much credit to Martinez.

perhaps it wasnt the perfect example, but in hindsight most people look at Trinidad as a 'blown up' Welterweight, even though that isnt true and he was clearly doing very well at MW. I just decided to use it since most people would know what Im talking about. I don't think anyone knowledgeable thinks that. Hell, Tito KO'ed Cherifi in four on his way out. The win is probably still the best of Bernard's career, so it doesn't seem to me that's the popular opinion. In any case, the fight determines what's right. Hopkins proved too good for Tito, not necessarily too big. And if Martinez fought Manny, the same would probably hold true. It isn't so much his as much as it is the skill that goes along with it. That's usually the case with elite fighters.

Agreed. But, to be fair, Hopkins being the bigger man wasn't forgotten. He was a heavy underdog because Tito had just flattened Joppy and destroyed the top two 154lbers prior to that. He even out-weighed Hopkins at the weigh-in. perhaps it wasnt the perfect example, but in hindsight most people look at Trinidad as a 'blown up' Welterweight, even though that isnt true and he was clearly doing very well at MW. I just decided to use it since most people would know what Im talking about.

trinidad was actually at middleweight and had just beaten the 2nd best middleweight in the world. pac, may and cotto have never even fought there. big difference. this is true, but I was assuming that Martinez for Pac, Floyd and Cotto would have come down to 154. and its not that I agree with it, but if Martinez beat Floyd or Pac, he would be rated #1 by most major boxing publications.

well, popularity maybe wasnt the perfect word, but all I meant was that amongst the boxing community he would have gained a huge amount of new respect, despite the fact he was the bigger man and everything. people can talk all they want, but in the end if Martinez KOed Pacquiao, he would clearly end up being rated p4p#1 by most major boxing publications. not that it makes Martinez a superior fighter p4p in terms of all time ranking, but thats just the way it works. Agreed. But, to be fair, Hopkins being the bigger man wasn't forgotten. He was a heavy underdog because Tito had just flattened Joppy and destroyed the top two 154lbers prior to that. He even out-weighed Hopkins at the weigh-in.

That's not really because they become popular, it's because it's a mega f*cking win, no? Legacy-wise. well, popularity maybe wasnt the perfect word, but all I meant was that amongst the boxing community he would have gained a huge amount of new respect, despite the fact he was the bigger man and everything. people can talk all they want, but in the end if Martinez KOed Pacquiao, he would clearly end up being rated p4p#1 by most major boxing publications. not that it makes Martinez a superior fighter p4p in terms of all time ranking, but thats just the way it works.

which is why Hopkins went flying up the p4p lists after beating Trinidad. p4p lists are mostly around popularity, and how good you seem at the time. if Martinez beat Pacquiao dominantly, I can pretty much guarentee Martinez would go up on people's p4p lists. trinidad was actually at middleweight and had just beaten the 2nd best middleweight in the world. pac, may and cotto have never even fought there. big difference.

which is why Hopkins went flying up the p4p lists after beating Trinidad. p4p lists are mostly around popularity, and how good you seem at the time. if Martinez beat Pacquiao dominantly, I can pretty much guarentee Martinez would go up on people's p4p lists. That's not really because they become popular, it's because it's a mega f*cking win, no? Legacy-wise.

which is why Hopkins went flying up the p4p lists after beating Trinidad. p4p lists are mostly around popularity, and how good you seem at the time. if Martinez beat Pacquiao dominantly, I can pretty much guarentee Martinez would go up on people's p4p lists.

Just name one future hall of famer that Sergio Martinez has beaten???

Yeah. I was going to reply but then I read this below. Owned in an instinct. You haven't a leg to stand on! Who the fukk has Kelly Pavlik beaten?!? If there was ever a white hype job, he would be it. He's like the black Jermaine Taylor.

Moved UP to face Williams at MW. Fought a Pavlik that outweighed him by 11 pounds on fight night. Who is ranked ahead of him P4P? Mayweather and Pac. To be the man, you have to beat the man.....and right now the men to beat are Pac and Mayweather. What was Mayweather's reasoning for fighting the much smaller Marquez? He is ranked #2 P4P, so I'm fighting him. Somehow Floyd earned his #2 spot by beating JMM even though he made the dude climb up in weight and he still came in heavier than he was contractually bound to. Dude, I have no idea how you formulated the reasoning behind the statement that I embolded in your response......below are the numbers my man. And Martinez is older than every single opponent he has faced.....same can't be said for any of the other p4p fighters except Hopkins. Martinez' height = 5′ 10″ / 178cm Dzinziruk's height = 6′ 0″ / 183cm Williams' height = 6′ 1″ / 185cm Pavlik's height = 6′ 2½″ / 189cm Cintron's height = 5′ 11″ / 180cm Dude, look up boxrec and tell me what divisions it lists 4 of Martinez's last 5 opponents. THEY ARE ALL LIGHT MIDDLEWEIGHTS. Martinez is technically fighting guys in smaller divisions. The only one not on the list is the Ohio hypejob Kelly Pavlik, who got outboxed by Ol' Bernard. So suck on your stats and eat it!

Dear Sergio, So I heard you're trying to become P4P king. You just beat the junior middleweight king in Sergei Dzinziruk. Big fukkin whoop!!! Your a fukkin MIDDLEWEIGHT!!! You just beat a guy a whole weight class smaller than you. If you or your handler, DiBella, wants to see your name on the P4P top spot, you better fight like it. Instead of begging for a fight with smaller guys like Mayweather and Pacquiao, you should be moving up the weight ladder, not moving down! Why don't you go challenge one of the super six and fight someone your own size. You've been fighting in or around 150+ all your life, why don't you take yur skills and move up the ladder like p4p fighters do? I'll rattle off a couple of suggestions for you: - Challenge Margarito, he beat you, why not avenge that loss? - Lucian Bute, move up Sergio! Stop challenging 5-6 to 5-8 midgets and fight bigger challengers and you'll definitely deserve P4P. Yo Pappi Yeah. I was going to reply but then I read this below. u mean like when Sergio went up in weight and took the belts from the middleweight champion??? Owned in an instinct. You haven't a leg to stand on!

Well said LarryX2011 and good reference to that original post.

Moved UP to face Williams at MW. Fought a Pavlik that outweighed him by 11 pounds on fight night. Who is ranked ahead of him P4P? Mayweather and Pac. To be the man, you have to beat the man.....and right now the men to beat are Pac and Mayweather. What was Mayweather's reasoning for fighting the much smaller Marquez? He is ranked #2 P4P, so I'm fighting him. Somehow Floyd earned his #2 spot by beating JMM even though he made the dude climb up in weight and he still came in heavier than he was contractually bound to. Dude, I have no idea how you formulated the reasoning behind the statement that I embolded in your response......below are the numbers my man. And Martinez is older than every single opponent he has faced.....same can't be said for any of the other p4p fighters except Hopkins. Martinez' height = 5′ 10″ / 178cm Dzinziruk's height = 6′ 0″ / 183cm Williams' height = 6′ 1″ / 185cm Pavlik's height = 6′ 2½″ / 189cm Cintron's height = 5′ 11″ / 180cm funny how this post was ducked..lol

I thought Martinez beat the Ring champ at 160. A guy who had never lost at that weight. Lets not let facts get in the way.