What does B-Hop have to do to prove to you that he a top 20 ATG?

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One of the greatest fighters I've ever seen, suck mah balls. Roy is a bit above him yah. Only because of his pure ability and gifts. Never pay again for live sex! | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! | Chat for free!

I mean look at how people who fought bruce lee speak about bruce lee and how in awe they were of him. Green K sent:D

Seeing him lose to Calzaghe was stupid. Far too often in the sport, guys are only remembered for their final accomplishments in the ring (or lack thereof), especially by the generations of fans coming in. A sad ass De La Hoya losing to Pacquiao is all a lot of future boxing fans will remember him for, for example. Dumbass casual fans who remember stuff like that aren't the ones that rank the history. I don't care what a million casuals think about De La Hoya's achievements - those in the "know" are the ones who'll ultimately rank him. Calzaghe for example didnt stay too long and, despite his detractors, fought a lot of tough guys, had a long championship run, and came out clean. Whatever people want to say, they cant take that away for him. I disagree with the "lot of tough guys" thing, but okay. I don't see what he has to do with the discussion of fighters past their primes, though. As for the Roy Jones thing: Remember that thread a few months ago where fans were voting who was a better fighter of the decade; Pac or Jones? All anyone wanted to talk about was Jones getting KOd. So what does that prove? Pacquiao's been sparked out, too. All that proves to me is that Manny nurhuggers (mostly casual fans) don't know anything about Roy or his legacy. And I knew that to begin with, because they're not REAL fans. They're fans of a fighter, not fans of the sport. And like I said - they don't get to write the history. How did you sit through Jones Hopkins II and not feel sad??? I sure as hell did. Naturally I felt sad. Two dudes I grew up watching. The two dudes who if it weren't for their presence - I probably wouldn't be watching. But that's not what they'll be remembered for. The same way Ali isn't remembered for being picked apart by Holmes. The same way Pernell Whitaker isn't remembered for losing to Bojorquez. It doesn't work that way because WE (the real fans), are the ones who keep the score. Some guys staying in the ring as they get older can really show us how good they are, but it usually shows us just how bad they can get. So what? We're all human. Even a finely tuned machine like a well built stock car breaks down, eventually.

At this point, therre's nothing he can do if he's not already in it. However, if he does clean out the light heavyweight division at 40+... I don't see how he wouldn't be

This is something I never get - why "retire a few years ago"? What is it about fight fans who have this belief that when a guy sticks around long beyond his prime, it somehow diminishes all the accolades he'd earned up to that point? Everybody sticks around too long, in this game. Does Ali fighting Holmes have any negative impact on his overall legacy? What about Roy Jones still fighting it out today? Does that diminish all the amazing things he accomplished during his reign? It's just a lame train of thought, IMO. Seeing him lose to Calzaghe was stupid. Far too often in the sport, guys are only remembered for their final accomplishments in the ring (or lack thereof), especially by the generations of fans coming in. A sad ass De La Hoya losing to Pacquiao is all a lot of future boxing fans will remember him for, for example. Calzaghe for example didnt stay too long and, despite his detractors, fought a lot of tough guys, had a long championship run, and came out clean. Whatever people want to say, they cant take that away for him. As for the Roy Jones thing: Remember that thread a few months ago where fans were voting who was a better fighter of the decade; Pac or Jones? All anyone wanted to talk about was Jones getting KOd. How did you sit through Jones Hopkins II and not feel sad??? I sure as hell did. Some guys staying in the ring as they get older can really show us how good they are, but it usually shows us just how bad they can get.

Retire a few years ago, for starts. Fight Calzaghe in 2001. Some other ****. This is something I never get - why "retire a few years ago"? What is it about fight fans who have this belief that when a guy sticks around long beyond his prime, it somehow diminishes all the accolades he'd earned up to that point? Everybody sticks around too long, in this game. Does Ali fighting Holmes have any negative impact on his overall legacy? What about Roy Jones still fighting it out today? Does that diminish all the amazing things he accomplished during his reign? It's just a lame train of thought, IMO.

Go watch some Ward fights before saying this. I have bro, he sinks the head in his opponents like it's part of the game, it isn't. You a fan of his too? I was actually impressed by what B-Hop did to Pavlik, his tactics in the fights with Calzaghe and Jones were disappointing however.

Retire a few years ago, for starts. Fight Calzaghe in 2001. Some other ****.

Whom you admitted failed to do his job regardless his identity . Cameras should be used to overrule referee's decisions . Hopkins benefited an ancient bug in the sport A lot of fighters do, Andre Ward is another. They have to live with their behaviour however as far as their legacy is concerned, tarnished.

Thats why there's a third man in the ring. that never stopped him...

Hop found a way to win and keep on winning, he didnt have the fastest hands, the fastest feet, nor the strongest punch, but he found a way to win, I like that. just too bad it wasn't within the rules...

I think their talents are equal. Discipline levels, not so much. I agree. To say Hopkins has more talent than a Prime Toney is a little too much for me. They are comparable in talent.

Start over. :rofl: Bernard would have to clean out Light Heavyweight to be in the top 20 IMO...and maybe even win a title at Heavyweight...I don't have an ATG list in print to say for sure...

Post your list before I even try replying to you. Off the dome so if its sloppy forgive me. But its damn sure more credible than having Tyson, Crys Byrd, Orlin Norris, and James Toney as Top 20 ATG's. 1.Ali 2. Pep 3. Armstrong 4. Louis 5. SRR 6. Benny 7. Johnson 8. Wilde 9. Dempsey 10. Langford 11. Gans 12. Greb 13. Wilde 14. SRL 15. Ross 16. Ketchel 17. Walker 18. Tunney 19. Charles 20. Saddler

I think their talents are equal. Discipline levels, not so much. Solid point. I disagree with the talent portion, but definitely a great point.

What? lol I have no clue what that even means. for the clueless, it means you thought i wouldn't catch you in your own s**t.. F'ing internet dorks. takes one to know one..... Ali fought smaller men, end of story. says who? you? get the f**k outta here.....quite sure ali fought more natural heavyweights than bernard fought natural lightheavys....please don't get owned twice Bernard Hopkins is a top 50 ATG fighter right now. yeah in nard ballicker world.....lol

His may be more based on a skill type ATG list I guess. Orlin Norris man, Orlin Norris. His brother was more skillful and has a better resume than Orlin Norris man. Come on.

Hopkins has more talent than James Toney ever had. Even now, shot to shit as he is.