Manny PAcquiao versus Joel Casamayor at 130, who wins?

There's a reason that cliche's become cliche's. There's usually an element of truth. which truth? the truth that people can and will always try to rip a boxer's resume apart if they don't like them, particularly if that fighter just happens to beat some of their heroes/legends/favorites? or the fact that if for some reason you beat or are close to beating all odds, the same group of people will now try to call foul play without proof and list all your achievements as though they were proof enough of your supposed cheating? Was morales prime in either pac victory? Was Diaz a top LW? Was Oscar weight drained? Was Cotto at a catchweight? Was Clottey an eleite fighter? morales may not be prime on his first 2 matches with pac but he certainly wasn't shot either, he was more than a live opponent. diaz was already planned before and sure you can call it a tune-up if you want, or is pac not allowed to have them? i know i am arguing semantics, but no dlh wasn't exactly weightdrained . sure it's pretty convenient to use such a word but if you really want to discredit the win, you may as well say oscar "failed to rehydrate" which is completely different from being weight drained. the fight with cotto did take place at a catchweight (which cotto's team offered in the first place), so what? does this take most of the credit of the fight? i am one of the people who wanted the fight to take place at 147, but my reason was so that pac can get the belt without any dispute. pac fighting cotto at 145 was completely fine with me considering that is his 7th weight division to climb, my beef was entirely about the belt, not the weight. define your classification of elite. all i know is that clottey was on the top 5 boxers in the division when pac fought him, and let's say it was indeed a tune-up fight, do you think it was a terrible thing to do particularly after giving the fans big fights, after big fights just a few years ago without retiring? I'm not saying that those are excuses. they are not. All a fighter can do is beat the guy in front of him...and pac did that. But don't ask people not to notice. people will notice stuffs limited not to just one side, biased people will notice what they want to notice, simple people will notice what others say they notice.

Am more impress with the Pacquiao at higher weight than the one that fought at the lower weight, I would slightly favour Casa over manny at 130...Anything over 135 Pac destroys casa.

Joshua Clottey? Didn't knock him out but won the decision? I thought you considered yourself Bert Sugar Jr. I know what you talking about but I didn't know Clottey was a very smart boxer counter punching/technical skill ala Casa. That is what we were talking about. You just went a whole other direction. :lol1: @ Bert Sugar Jr.... Never do I consider myself that highly. Hell I don't even consider myself TheGreatA Jr. Both Sugar and the Manchine would forget more about boxing then I could ever learn.

ok????????? Joshua Clottey? Didn't knock him out but won the decision? I thought you considered yourself Bert Sugar Jr.

oh sorry, i forgot to mention when he fights punching bags as well. :lol1: ok?????????

Not necessarily Oh sorry, I forgot to mention when he fights punching bags as well. :lol1:

I am looking at it from both sides, and I'm still favoring the boxer with better boxing skills to beat Pacquiao. In this case Casamayor over Pacquiao. Yeah because in boxing anything can happen. Like I said earlier 9 times out of 10 he loses to a boxer counter punching/technical skill, that one time is where his athletic talent gets him is monster knockout. Not necessarily

The keyword there is almost right? Doesn't mean every time. And, this could be one of those times that athletic prowess would beat a smarter fighter or vice versa. I don't mind or care if you think that Casa would beat Pac. But, all I am saying is that you have to look at both sides. Don't just say well Casa style and IQ is too much for Pac. Or that Pac speed and power would KO Casa. You have to look at what both fighters bring to the table. In a fantasy fight Casa would easily beat Freitas and MAB beats Pac. But, that was fantasy not reality. You have to weigh the pro's and cons from both sides. Not just look at it from one side. I am looking at it from both sides, and I'm still favoring the boxer with better boxing skills to beat Pacquiao. In this case Casamayor over Pacquiao. In boxing anything can happen. Like I said earlier 9 times out of 10 he loses to a boxer counter punching/technical skill, that one time is where his athletic talent gets him is monster knockout. Someone with skill plans and acts their way to victory, adjusting as necessary, where as someone with such deficit relies too much on their athleticism to win, only few can pull that off in this sport.

A great fighter will give anyone fits. We're talking about technical skill vs. athletic prowess. A smarter fighter almost always wins. The keyword there is almost right? Doesn't mean every time. And, this could be one of those times that athletic prowess would beat a smarter fighter or vice versa. I don't mind or care if you think that Casa would beat Pac. But, all I am saying is that you have to look at both sides. Don't just say well Casa style and IQ is too much for Pac. Or that Pac speed and power would KO Casa. You have to look at what both fighters bring to the table. In a fantasy fight Casa would easily beat Freitas and MAB beats Pac. But, that was fantasy not reality. You have to weigh the pro's and cons from both sides. Not just look at it from one side.

A great fighter will give anyone fits. We're talking about technical skill vs. athletic prowess. A smarter fighter almost always wins. agreed and if for some reason the smarter fighter loses by sd, let's just call it a robbery, and cry about it for years... if by KO let's just call him shot, old, weight drained and/or credit the win to excellent matchmaking...

Ok, but Casa did have problems with Castillo, Freitas, and Corrales right? Now Pac doesn't fight like them but Pac was just as good as they were right" Or do you disagree and say Freitas was just a level above Pac? And, if Pac is as good as they were and they were able to give them fits. Is it far fetch to think that Pac with his style and attributes give Casa fits? A great fighter will give anyone fits. We're talking about technical skill vs. athletic prowess. A smarter fighter almost always wins.

Nothing Casamayor couldn't handle. Casamayor gives Pacquiao a good boxing lesson. Ok, but Casa did have problems with Castillo, Freitas, and Corrales right? Now Pac doesn't fight like them but Pac was just as good as they were right" Or do you disagree and say Freitas was just a level above Pac? And, if Pac is as good as they were and they were able to give them fits. Is it far fetch to think that Pac with his style and attributes give Casa fits?

People look at shit too one sided. Not only should you look at what problems Casa would give Pac. But, also the problems Pac would give Casa. Unless you think there is nothing in Pac style and attributes that would give Casa problems. But, that kind of thinking would be utter buffoonery Nothing Casamayor couldn't handle. Casamayor gives Pacquiao a good boxing lesson.

What a pussy then! Damn I don't even remember having anything with this prick! LOL It is really whatever, you ain't missing much. It will be the same shit everyday.

Hey! Why am I on ignore in your threads? I don't even remember having a conversation with you! Because, you're a Pac fan.

People look at shit too one sided. Not only should you look at what problems Casa would give Pac. But, also the problems Pac would give Casa. Unless you think there is nothing in Pac style and attributes that would give Casa problems. But, that kind of thinking would be utter buffoonery

People gotta recognize that this was the Pacquiao that lost to Morales and Marquez and got rocked by Oscar Larios. This is the same Oscar Larios who actually jumped 2 weight divisions to fight Pacquiao after getting destroyed by Israel Vasquez in 3 rounds. He went 12 with Pacquiao. Casamayor UD. Only unbiased, non-nut hugging, logical people realize that. 9 time out of 10 Pacquiao will get outboxed. That one time was either a catchweight or a huge right hook...lol.

People gotta recognize that this was the Pacquiao that lost to Morales and Marquez and got rocked by Oscar Larios. This is the same Oscar Larios who actually jumped 2 weight divisions to fight Pacquiao after getting destroyed by Israel Vasquez in 3 rounds. He went 12 with Pacquiao. Casamayor UD.

Too much technical skill for Pacquiao to handle.

I dont see joel winning this fight. Although, no one really has an easy fight with casamayor. Big chance "this fight" turned into a brawl. Casamayor can drop his defense and be reckless at times.