Manny Pacquiao Or Marvin Hagler. Who's Greater?

Hagler was outboxed by a washed up,inactive welterweight who spent a good three years snorting coke.If Hagler was faded,then what the f*ck was Leonard? Hagler was always overrated.He came along in a weak era of middleweights and called out fighters who were two divisions below his and was running scared when Qawi and Spinks wanted a piece of him. I'm no Pacquiao fan,but his resume is far superior to Miss Marvis Hagler's. Is Hagler as great as Joe Frazier?

just shaking my head at the knee jerk analysis of marvin hagler's greatness: "he knocked out hearns" no way pacquiao can come close to that greatness. they all have racist tunnel vision. no way some asian guy gonna overtake marvelous. no way!!! case closed. he lost to a returning from retirement ray leonard coming up in weight to his best weight & his most other notable win was vs a past his prime & past his best weight fat roberto duran. Hagler's career sort of reminds me of joe calzaghe. calzaghe could have gone up at 175 to face prime roy or gone down to face prime bernard but instead he stays at 168 & weights for fighters to come to him. hagler could have gone up to 175 & taken on a great 175lb class or NOT RETIRE when mike mccallum, julian jackson, milton mccrory, donald curry, & gerald mcclellan were there for him to fight. THAT COUNTS AGAINST HAGLER. Using your logic, Carlos Monzon was not a great fighter because he never moved up. Moving up is not the end all and be all of greatness. Especially if the fighter is winning alphabet titles without fighting the best fighter in the division. And comparing Hagler to Calzaghe is just stupid. Hagler knocked out Hearns but you think he would have proved more by knocking out the less skilled McCrory? And McClellan and Julian Jackson were no where near Hagler's era. Donald Curry was only a welterweight with NO fights above 147 at the time. But you count that aginst Hagler?You're really trippin now.

this poster below me is exactly what im talking about. another black guy whose feelings got hurt & his mental thinking got affected. It's interesting how you would single out a black guy when a lot of boxing fans from all colors and walks of life rate Hagler over Pacquiao. If you didn't have a problem with black fighters and black people in general maybe you would to. The only person race baiting here is you. Your act is easy to see through.

I meant i admit to distorting the facts slightly due to laziness. Thats what i meant by flaming. ME flaming YOU. 1 fight in 5 years and that fight was over 2 years at a lower weight before fighting Hagler. Davey Moore had only 12 pro fights before losing to Duran. How was he a solid fighter? Who had he fought to cause u to make that statement? Or are u lying to support ur argument?? LOL Ayub Kalule 40-1-0- former world champion who's only loss was to Ray Leonard Tadashi Mihara (world champ) Charlie Weir (number 1 contender at 154) Moore won those fights impressively by KO over top fighters which made him a solid fighter and some even felt he would beat Duran at that time.. Considering that you obviously have no clue about what you're talking about I'm sure you would think I'm lying. You weren't being "lazy" when you omitted facts. You just lied. You're just another person that looks at numbers as if the tell the whole story. You saw Moore's number of fights without even knowing who his opponents were. Go read a book.

Hagler was outboxed by a washed up,inactive welterweight who spent a good three years snorting coke.If Hagler was faded,then what the f*ck was Leonard? Hagler was always overrated.He came along in a weak era of middleweights and called out fighters who were two divisions below his and was running scared when Qawi and Spinks wanted a piece of him. I'm no Pacquiao fan,but his resume is far superior to Miss Marvis Hagler's. LOL, my fav poster is back. For those who don't know check out my posts in the history board with Donkim, PrincebattofomKAzooz, or whatever her name is now. Gee after 18 bannings she is back with vengence.

Pac's win over Barrera, Morales, and Marquez is enough to stablish greatness over Hagler.

Hearns is really like 6 feet 2 and i dont know why he is listed as 6 feet 1 as PW. PW is taller than Pavlik it became apparent in their press conference. Hagler gave 4 inches in height and reach many times. ODLH was really the only opponent much taller than Pac. In fact, he wanted no part of Yuri Foreman due to the major height differentials. Pac was knocked out two times and had two draws. In addition, he had the infamouse fight with Hussein where he was given a long count and saved by fellow pinoy ref Carlos Padilla. That dosent even include his rematch with JMM that many thought he loss including fellow Pinoy Kuya Nonito Donaire. For those who say Pac is much better than Hagler let me know when he ever was knocked out? Also his first two losses were hometown decisions in Philadelphia which he later would avenge by brutal knockouts. The fight with Antefuermo was a draw and later also would be avenge with brutal KO. The fight with SRL i had him losing by 1 point. I already talked about the stipulations on that fight. SRL had the glove size he wanted, ring size, and made a 12 rd instead of 15 rd fight. I myself have Pac rated slightly higher but to say he is much better is pure silly. good post, also keep in mind hagler was fading when he fought leonard and most likely overtrained. i first heard that theory in FNR4 acctually, but checked it out to see if there was any truth behind it. and there is, hagler had a 11 week training camp instead of the usual 6 he had for all of his other fights. and he did look overtrained. numbers don't lie. there's no doubt and as we all can see it's pretty clear amongst the boxing community that pacquiao is greater. lol.. look im not saying pac is or isnt better than hagler, thats not the point. i just find it funny u refer to NSB as a boxing community like there was any form credibility to what ppl here think. in that case floyd is the best ever since he wins every fantasy matchup, not really the case is it? most ppl who voted dont know first thing about boxing, the fact that u gave the poll as your only reason that pac is better leads me to believe u are one of them.

How is Pacman ahead in this vote? Holy shit this forum is dilluded. Lol, this shouldn't even be close. Pac was just greater in every way.

LOL. This shouldn't even be close. Pac was greater and it's not even debatable, pac was destroying guys bigger than him while going up in weight, hagler just stay on one division and wait for those great little guys to go up in weight. It's laughable to compare this 2.

This is funny as hell.

Lets wait until Mannys done before we start to examine his legacy....

I'm not sure if the loss to Monroe was filmed, but it has never been described as a hometown decision. By most accounts, Monroe clearly beat Hagler. The Watts loss was bullsh!t though, IMO. i am not sure if all three of his fights with monroe are available? I do have the last two in which he won by decision and the other by brutal KO. So he did beat him two times. Before Hagler fought in Italy a country that later he would move too he had a documentary hosted by SRL. In the documentary they just showed clips and talked about his career and desribed his both philly losses as "hometown cooking." During the documentary hagler pretty much said he wanted to end every fight with Ko and his fists because he was tired of the judges taking it away from him. So when he went to England he pretty much wanted to kill Alan Minter to get the MW title. After three rounds he murdered Minter who had enough blood to donate for 10 people at a Red Cross donation bank. He than would win 11 of his 12 defenses by KO; Duran being the only man to last the full 15 rounds.

but nah, I pick Hagler. he just fought fighters who are way better than Pac's.

Hagler has the better resume, but man...this is hard.

Hagler's opposition is better than Pacquiao's. Cotto and Barrera are lesser wins than Hearns and Duran, plus Hagler got robbed against Leonard.

Hearns is really like 6 feet 2 and i dont know why he is listed as 6 feet 1 as PW. PW is taller than Pavlik it became apparent in their press conference. Hagler gave 4 inches in height and reach many times. ODLH was really the only opponent much taller than Pac. In fact, he wanted no part of Yuri Foreman due to the major height differentials. Pac was knocked out two times and had two draws. In addition, he had the infamouse fight with Hussein where he was given a long count and saved by fellow pinoy ref Carlos Padilla. That dosent even include his rematch with JMM that many thought he loss including fellow Pinoy Kuya Nonito Donaire. For those who say Pac is much better than Hagler let me know when he ever was knocked out? Also his first two losses were hometown decisions in Philadelphia which he later would avenge by brutal knockouts. The fight with Antefuermo was a draw and later also would be avenge with brutal KO. The fight with SRL i had him losing by 1 point. I already talked about the stipulations on that fight. SRL had the glove size he wanted, ring size, and made a 12 rd instead of 15 rd fight. I myself have Pac rated slightly higher but to say he is much better is pure silly. I'm not sure if the loss to Monroe was filmed, but it has never been described as a hometown decision. By most accounts, Monroe clearly beat Hagler. The Watts loss was bullsh!t though, IMO.

Hearns is really like 6 feet 2 and i dont know why he is listed as 6 feet 1 as PW. PW is taller than Pavlik it became apparent in their press conference. Hagler gave 4 inches in height and reach many times. ODLH was really the only opponent much taller than Pac. In fact, he wanted no part of Yuri Foreman due to the major height differentials. Pac was knocked out two times and had two draws. In addition, he had the infamouse fight with Hussein where he was given a long count and saved by fellow pinoy ref Carlos Padilla. That dosent even include his rematch with JMM that many thought he loss including fellow Pinoy Kuya Nonito Donaire. For those who say Pac is much better than Hagler let me know when he ever was knocked out? Also his first two losses were hometown decisions in Philadelphia which he later would avenge by brutal knockouts. The fight with Antefuermo was a draw and later also would be avenge with brutal KO. The fight with SRL i had him losing by 1 point. I already talked about the stipulations on that fight. SRL had the glove size he wanted, ring size, and made a 12 rd instead of 15 rd fight. I myself have Pac rated slightly higher but to say he is much better is pure silly.

i think he was. he's about the same size as tito or oscar. i consider them big welterweights. small welterweights are like cotto. Cotto is tank. Hes not small. Hes just short.

Why do i get the impression when people say hagler, they are intentionally being spiteful towards Pac? Pac is greater.... and its not close. The question we all want to know is could pac have moved up and beat hagler at middleweight? Would have been a good fight, but Hagler would be favoured to beat Pac.

I'm gonna get blasted for this. But, if PAC and Hagler were both naturally the same size, I actually like PAC's chances of beating Hagler. On paper, Hagler should be the favorite. But, the fact that Hagler - Leonard happened. I mean, Leonard basically shoe-shined his way to victory over Hagler( don't get me wrong, it's was a cheap way to win). PAC's speed, may not be seen as great as Leonard's was, but he aint' that far. PAC has similar characteristics as Leonard, they both can jump in and out really fast and throw blistering combos with the side to side movement, and as I mentioned earlier, that's all Leonard had to do against Hagler and it worked. Is it too far-fetched that PAC can mimick the same gameplan if he would've fought Hagler ?? Keep in mind, this is if PAC was naturally the same size as Hagler. Also, I wonder if Hagler would've felt awkward in there, against another southpaw. It's not far-fetched to pick prime Pacquiao over prime Hagler in a P4P sense, but I don't think it's quite fair to use that version of Hagler. He had clearly declined in terms of his legs/movement and defense. He was getting tagged by slow Roldan with some frequency, and clearly did not show the effective head movement/parrying abilities against Mugabi that he had for so long in his career. As it is, Leonard had declined as well.