Would Calzaghe go through RJJ's resume undeafeated?

Props to the threadstarter for creating a thread that evokes the best and worst. In this case, it's reading these feeble explanations as to how Calzaghe would beat a 2003 John Ruiz. Impressive stuff. What's the old saying? Beating Tiger Woods doesn't make you Tiger Woods? Well, Joe Calzaghe is not Roy Jones Jr. He'll never have that luster, never have that record. Get over it. These "fantasy" wins won't do much in the big scheme of things because...they never happened. And no matter how much you try to convince people that John Ruiz is no different from Jeff Lacy (I guess Jermain Taylor would win big at heavy too?) no one is buying it...not even you.

BHop, Hill, Ruiz, Griffin n Toney wouldve beat him 4sure and i wouldve given Eric Harding, Richard hall n even tarver a good shot also!!!

Watch Calzaghe vs Lacy to see Joe nuetralise a slow plodding puncher. And Lacy is more talented than Ruiz. Joe is a much better counter puncher than he is a "come forward" fighter. Yes it would depend on how Joe carries the weight. But if he carries it well enough to move round the ring, he would embarrass Ruiz. Lacy is a 168 pound fighter...trying to compare him with John Ruiz who is about 6'2, 225-240 is a joke. Ruiz carries more power in his left jab than Lacy does with the hardest shot he throws. I do understand what you are trying to get at, but it doesn't work. Lacy is overrated; I said this a while back before the Calzaghe fight. Joe's not that great at moving around the ring; he's not really the "athletic" agility type. He's decent; we'll leave it at that. I still see Joe losing because of the way he fights. But it's not that big of a deal; Ruiz is a HW. Joe's still a great in his weight class.

Roy made sure to keep his distance against Ruiz. Against Lou he started to slack, kept his guard down and turned his head. You could see Roy felt like an idiot. Ruiz knocked down Holyfield as well. Ruiz's power is much greater than anyone Joe fought. I'm not sure Joe can fight another way. He comes forward and throws punches in bunches. Ruiz also throws body shots so that could be damaging to a smaller framed fighter like Joe. Like a said before; a forearm punch isn't that bad...but he did seem to catch Joe on the nose so that is a stinger. Ruiz may have not been the greatest of HW Champions, but he was Champion and a top guy no matter what anyone says. Even if he is deemed "average" for a HW, that's like saying he is an average NFL player...but put him back up against the High-School kids, which in this case would be below 200 pounders, how would he do; other than Roy? Watch Calzaghe vs Lacy to see Joe nuetralise a slow plodding puncher. And Lacy is more talented than Ruiz. Joe is a much better counter puncher than he is a "come forward" fighter. Yes it would depend on how Joe carries the weight. But if he carries it well enough to move round the ring, he would embarrass Ruiz.

So what? Can Ruiz fight on the backfoot and throw a perfect right hand counter? Would Calzaghe be stupid enough to rush at Ruiz? Dont ever compare Bernard Hopkins to John Ruiz. The punch had little to do with power or Joes chin anyway. It was just a great shot, Joe was off balance. Roy Jones knocked him down with a forearm. Its like saying "Jones got KDed by Del Valle, hows he gonna hold up against Ruiz" Roy made sure to keep his distance against Ruiz. Against Lou he started to slack, kept his guard down and turned his head. You could see Roy felt like an idiot. Ruiz knocked down Holyfield as well. Ruiz's power is much greater than anyone Joe fought. I'm not sure Joe can fight another way. He comes forward and throws punches in bunches. Ruiz also throws body shots so that could be damaging to a smaller framed fighter like Joe. Like a said before; a forearm punch isn't that bad...but he did seem to catch Joe on the nose so that is a stinger. Ruiz may have not been the greatest of HW Champions, but he was Champion and a top guy no matter what anyone says. Even if he is deemed "average" for a HW, that's like saying he is an average NFL player...but put him back up against the High-School kids, which in this case would be below 200 pounders, how would he do; other than Roy?

maybe ruiz could have beaten joe. i think joe beats hopkins any year. toney in 94 wouldve had a chance vs joe. then theres mccallum and a prim etarver (his prime lasted one punch) so no joe probly wouldnt have gone undefeated, either would any other fighter ever

Obviously not, he’d suffer an L to Ruiz. But considering when RRJ fought certain fighters, he’d get past Hopkins with a UD similar to that in which Roy gained, toney would be tough but Calzaghe would do it fairly comfortable against that weight drained version. He’d struggle with Griffin, Johnson & Harding (unsure about that Hill though) though I’m confident he’d beat them all.. And on Ruiz, we should never forget, back then he was at 220-225, had good stamina and had wins over Johnson, Hoylfield and Tucker. Now you could say tucker was a can ( a lie), Tucker was shot (true) and Holyfield was shot (partly true). Remember Holyfield had come off 24 rounds with Lewis, while many agree he lost the first (117-111 by my card), in some peoples eyes, he won the second (in which I agree, 115-113), so while he was a fighter fighting in ill health, he was still a legitimate fighter amongst the division, probably top 5 (though despite my praise of Ruiz, I did score Holyfield the first and third fight but Ruiz was great in the second, I do think those 36 rounds took a lot outta John.)…

Ruiz is the most overrated win on Roy's record. Ruiz was one of the worst heavyweight champions that I've ever seen. He was a towering mediocrity. Slow, plodding, average power at best, and a crybaby to boot. Roy beat the only heavyweight champion he could beat, and then made a very quick exit from the heavyweight division. Call it a one fight tour. The Toney win was 10 times more impressive. IMO I hate Ruiz as much as the next guy but the bottom line is that he was a legitimate HW champ with a very decent resume including wins over Holyfield, Rahman and Kirk Johnson. For a guy who has fought at as low as 154 to step up and completely dominate a guy with those credentials is pretty impressive IMO. I agree that the Toney win is of greater significance as Jones was an underdog in that fight and Toney was rated at #2 p4p, but I don't think the Ruiz win is unimpressive.

So what? Can Ruiz fight on the backfoot and throw a perfect right hand counter? Would Calzaghe be stupid enough to rush at Ruiz? Dont ever compare Bernard Hopkins to John Ruiz. The punch had little to do with power or Joes chin anyway. It was just a great shot, Joe was off balance. Roy Jones knocked him down with a forearm. Its like saying "Jones got KDed by Del Valle, hows he gonna hold up against Ruiz" Ruiz is the most overrated win on Roy's record. Ruiz was one of the worst heavyweight champions that I've ever seen. He was a towering mediocrity. Slow, plodding, average power at best, and a crybaby to boot. Roy beat the only heavyweight champion he could beat, and then made a very quick exit from the heavyweight division. Call it a one fight tour. The Toney win was 10 times more impressive. IMO

calzaghe was dropped by bhop and roy in the first round. Neither is known as a ko artist. No way his chin holds up at heavyweight. Ruiz is at least a above average heavyweight, he knocked valuev down. I cant imagine calz surviing 12 rounds with him. So what? Can Ruiz fight on the backfoot and throw a perfect right hand counter? Would Calzaghe be stupid enough to rush at Ruiz? Dont ever compare Bernard Hopkins to John Ruiz. The punch had little to do with power or Joes chin anyway. It was just a great shot, Joe was off balance. Roy Jones knocked him down with a forearm. Its like saying "Jones got KDed by Del Valle, hows he gonna hold up against Ruiz"

calzaghe was dropped by bhop and roy in the first round. Neither is known as a ko artist. No way his chin holds up at heavyweight. Ruiz is at least a above average heavyweight, he knocked valuev down. I cant imagine calz surviing 12 rounds with him.

its hard to say, i can think of some opponents that would give Calzaghe trouble and maybe beat him but there is also other things that would play a part that you cannot factor in like injuries leading up to the fight, loss of form, little confidence at the time, personal problems so lots of intangibles that you cannot really account for if you were to put him in the situation being 100% and everything right on paper i think he could take most or nearly all of Roy`s opponents bar a few

A lot depends on which Calzaghe's coming to the ring. The Calzaghe of old had enough power to keep Ruiz (who I agree is a bum) off of him. As for Toney. If he turns up in the same condition as the night he fought Jones - Calzaghe wins. A focussed, weight-managed Toney may well beat BOTH Calzaghe & Jones. But it's all speculation. What I'm certain of is a) Calzaghe's a top class fighter and b) top-class fighters are rarely easy to beat. Toney, Hill, Tarver - whoever - they're not going to have it easy against a prime Joe. Anyone who thinks otherwise is living in a fantasy land.

Hopkins was green when Jones fought him. He struggled with dudes like Mercado following the Jones fight. His peak was when he destroyed Glen Johnson and the Echols fights. He became much more defensive but more seasoned after the Trinidad fight. Age can be a disadvatage to some (Roy) but an advantage to others (Hopkins). Why do you have to hurt someone to win a fight? Roy didnt beat Ruiz because of his power. But because he was simply a superior fighter. I did say it would depend how Joe would carry the weight but I still think its more than achievable. Ruiz is no murderous puncher, so even if he did catch Joe, its unlikely it would be with a finishing punch. I don't remember. Was it you suggesting Hop at 43 was better than Hop at 29? I know that Hopkins was better at 33 than at 29, but 43... different story, unless you are british I guess. And as you said, Hopkins gained in defense, but what he lacked in the JC fight was offense, possibly in the form of lead right hands, which Hopkins *always* had going for him. Certainly you suggesting Calzaghe would hurt him? As for Ruiz, Jones had enough power to let it know to Ruiz, Calzaghe has less power, so Ruiz could just walk through all the punches he wanted. You need to hurt someone to dissuade them from throwing or grabbing you. Joe would not stop Ruiz from do either. Finally I find it ridiculous that you think Calzaghe who wos put on his ass by 40 years old former middleweights, would not be hurt and finished by a 220+ man. That's called testiclehugging.

I know you did, it's just fun working you up into a US hating frenzy. US hating frenzy? Where did I mention the US? Are you alright mate? I havent been around enough to keep you in check. Hows the anger management going?

Joe would not have beaten Ruiz IMO. Not only is Ruiz a very underrated heavy, but there is no way Joe could feasibly carry the necessary amount of wieght to match Ruiz in terms of physical strength. Can you imagine how much Ruiz would use his superior strength on the inside to wear Joe down? It would be too difficult for Calzaghe I think. Jones' ability to put on all that extra weight and still be very effective at near 200 pounds after having fought at 154 early in his career makes him a pretty special fighter.

That's just his usual piss poor analysis. It's so dumb and off point there's little point in even laughing at him. Remember the guy thought Nigel Benn was more a harder hitter than Ruiz. Whats your analysis? Instead of bitching and moaning about everyone elses opinions, I wouldnt mind hearing yours once in a while oh mighty one. :wank: I actually said that P4P, Benn was a harder puncher. Ruiz was not a big puncher at heavyweight.

LOL @ the bold LOL @ the bold Punch output aint doing shit for Joe's at HW, because Ruiz would not even feel even remotely checked by those slaps. Jones' rights were enough to get attention stopped him in his track. A light hitting middleweight with a less than excellent defense, should not even think about keeping a high workrate at HW, because that means getting caught at some point. Hopkins was green when Jones fought him. He struggled with dudes like Mercado following the Jones fight. His peak was when he destroyed Glen Johnson and the Echols fights. He became much more defensive but more seasoned after the Trinidad fight. Age can be a disadvatage to some (Roy) but an advantage to others (Hopkins). Why do you have to hurt someone to win a fight? Roy didnt beat Ruiz because of his power. But because he was simply a superior fighter. I did say it would depend how Joe would carry the weight but I still think its more than achievable. Ruiz is no murderous puncher, so even if he did catch Joe, its unlikely it would be with a finishing punch.

i dont even see calzaghe as that talented, he does'nt seem cut out for sports, maybe running, cuz of his stamina, but the man has no body control, he could'nt play basketball or soccer or anything, he can hardly throw a punch as it is, throws it like a punk(not saying his a punk ofcourse) but anyway. Don't you have school tommorrow? Get your chores done and finish your homework. Leave the boxing to us.

I think only a retard would not agree on the bold, but Ruiz is still 220 pounds of fighter. Comprende? Comprende.