Who has the better two victories.

kessler and lacy are not half the fighters hopkins or toney was

On paper it is Roy Jones. But at the moment of fighting it is definitely Joe Calzaghe. Calzaghe was the underdog against Lacy when Roy Jones was expected to batter the unknown Hopkins. Roy Jones fought a lot of the top fighters on his resume when they were either young and green or old and shot. Calzaghe fought his in their prime. :haha::haha:

Any biased poster will admit that Calzaghe's wins are more legit and overall better. I agree with this. :banana: His opponents were far more accomplished than the green Hopkins or the weight trouble Toney. On paper, Jones has the two best but Calzaghe has the best overall. Besides, who knows what Lacy or Kessler will accomplish in the future. Toney was much more accomplished than Kessler and Lacy were. Even when Toney used to be weight-drained, for example against Mike McCallum the 2nd time, he still won the fight. I don't think Hopkins was one of RJJ's greatest wins though.

Any biased poster will admit that Calzaghe's wins are more legit and overall better. His opponents were far more accomplished than the green Hopkins or the weight trouble Toney. On paper, Jones has the two best but Calzaghe has the best overall. Besides, who knows what Lacy or Kessler will accomplish in the future. Sweet

To tell you the truth, it's a tie to me. For Jones, the Hopkins win, although true and deserved, was not a prime Hopkins and was nothing overtly impressive. Toney had INCREDIBLE weight difficulties and didn't show up in peak condition. With Calzaghe, he dominated Lacy, but he's an ordinary fighter and has looked like it ever since. Kessler was simply a solid win against a very good solid fighter. Out of the four wins between the two, that ACTUALLY might be the most impressive. I'd go with a tie, however because Lacy really doesn't impress.

Jones wins hands down for all of the reasons mentioned even though there's really no need to debate it.

Whilst Joe deserves credit for beating Eubank, it's worth making the point that that that Eubank wasn't anywhere near the one that snatched victory from the jaws of defeat against Watson. Before Watson Eubank was rock solid defensively AND an extremely dangerous puncher. Prime Eubank vs prime Calzaghe - similarly tough to pick.

jones .........

I think Kaynan has mentioned this but I believe Jones was the underdog going into the Toney fight, so people knew about Toney's weight problems but still thought he was going to win and he was in the top 3 in most people's pound for pound lists.

Toney was weight-drained, yeah, but lets face it he was almost always 'weight-drained' around that time, he was certainly tight when he fought Prince Williams the fight immediately before Roy. Does it take away from Jones' win? Well, sure we'd love to have seen them both fight each other at their very best, but Jones kept his end of the bargain. Toney was unbeaten, a two-weight champ, he had the world by the balls and he screwed up the biggest fight of his life. He's gonna regret it for the rest of his life. But for 3 years Toney had wiped out his opposition whilst battling the bulge, he'd got away with it. It caught up with him against Jones and he paid the price, bottom line.

Toney was not the best fighter in the world (Whitaker and JCC were rated higher) but he was one of the best fighters in the world (#3 p4p) and the best fighter around the MW, SMW and LHW weight classes. He had been given some gifts in his past fights though. Toney was known to be inconsistent in his performances and went on to lose his next fight against Montell Griffin. But the way Jones handled Toney did not leave much doubt about who was the better fighter. Bernard Hopkins went on to become a great middleweight but I wouldn't consider the win over Hopkins the 2nd best win of Roy Jones. I would rate the wins over Virgil Hill, John Ruiz and Antonio Tarver above it. Calzaghe has good wins over Kessler and Lacy but it's hard to put them in the same class as someone like James Toney. Lacy had some decent wins as a SMW, held a belt and had the hype behind him but he was quite one-dimensional and has not been the same since. Kessler was a unified WBA&WBC champion with good skills. He could still be the top SMW but that remains to be seen. In that case it would make Calzaghe's win over Kessler even greater. Another good win for Calzaghe was Chris Eubank. Eubank was not the same since his two losses to Steve Collins but he remained competitive and gave trouble to cruiserweight champion Carl Thompson afterwards.

Toney was weight-drained when he fought Jones, and Hopkins had not yet reached his peak. Lacy and Kessler were both at their peak and best fighting weight. Read through the thread before saying that stuff. I already commented on Toney's weight.

Jones', obviously. He beat Toney, who at that time was among the pound-for-pound elite (maybe only behind Pernell), and Hopkins, who while green was still a very capable fighter and wouldn't lose for 12 years afterwards, cleaning up the middleweight division. Calzaghe beat Lacy, a great win, a magnificent performance, but in my opinion anyway Lacy wasn't a pound-for-pounder, and in truth hadn't really beaten any substantial fighters. Kessler - another solid win but doesn't compare, in all honesty, to Hop or Toney

I don't know how the P4P best fighter in the world could be considered untested, lol. IMO, that win alone eclipses Kessler and the overhyped Lacy. Kessler was the second best SMW in the world. Toney was the best fighter in the world, period. Preach......Preach......There it is the unspun truth with the exception that I give Calz more credit for the Lacey win than most but it in NO way compares to JT or Hopkins.

But......So were Hopkins and Toney at the time they fought Jones. actually toney was an undefeated champion when jones beat him.

Roy period.

And two draws as well Yeah one was early and I haven't seen it, but he avenged his draw to Mccallum..

LMAO ownage the the full extent of the law. I don't know how the P4P best fighter in the world could be considered untested, lol. IMO, that win alone eclipses Kessler and the overhyped Lacy. Kessler was the second best SMW in the world. Toney was the best fighter in the world, period.

He was 44-0. And two draws as well

:owned: :D :lol1: Thanks..... Nah, Rae. We all fuck up on this place sometimes.. It's all good bro. You better take it while it's Hot Kanyan......I don't slip often.:D