Kelly Pavlik - Have I missed something?

Pavlik is a fighter who delivers, that's why he's rated so highly. His KO/TKO percentage is off the charts, he shows up to fight, he's not one to duck somebody or run away from a challenge, he's the Middleweight Champion, and he's likeable. That's why we all love him so much, he's great for the sport. I'm probably one of Pavlik's biggest supporters but here are his negatives. His defense is shaky at best, his height and frame (tall and lanky) are sure to be a negative at some point, his speed isn't that great either. But when you factor in his work rate (he punches nonstop) and his almost granite chin, and the fact that he's never been one to disappoint that's why you see him being ranked so highly. In conclusion : In an era where most fighters are concerned with either public image or huge paydays, it's extremely refreshing to see a young, strong fighter who isn't afraid to fight the big fights or the fighters most people want nothing to do with. (Miranda may as well have been the plague when Pavlik wanted to fight him) No arguments, as I said I like Kelly Pavlik and he is a positive for the sport but he is being over hyped for the stage he is at in his career. He has beaten two or three good fighters and could possibly go on from here but so far he has in reality archived no more than win one 'big' fight. I hope he becomes more and if he does I will support his inclusion as a top ten lb for lb fighter but realistically he is not there yet and if you disagree I would question your judgement.

ummmmmm. I really don't get that one :ugh: A guy who can take a punch can get inside of Kelly and taller guys are generally more likely to go down off of a stunning punch than smaller guys.

ummmmmm. I really don't get that one :ugh: A guy who can get inside can offset that. Plus the fact that Pavlik needs distance to fire off his one two is another factor. A guy who can fight well inside is going to beat him senseless. He needs to be smothered to be beaten. A great counter puncher/boxer could beat him well too. Taylor failed to move his head or parry that right. Take note of Hopkins V Tito, exactly how to beat Pavlik. After the fight hopkins said "when a guy has a gun you get in close to smother him so he cant get a shot off" Exactly what hopkins did to tito and what should be done with Pavlik. Walk him down with lateral movement and push him around the ring pounding the body, using the overhand left and uppercut. Easier said than done of course but it can be done.

Pavlik is a fighter who delivers, that's why he's rated so highly. His KO/TKO percentage is off the charts, he shows up to fight, he's not one to duck somebody or run away from a challenge, he's the Middleweight Champion, and he's likeable. That's why we all love him so much, he's great for the sport. I'm probably one of Pavlik's biggest supporters but here are his negatives. His defense is shaky at best, his height and frame (tall and lanky) are sure to be a negative at some point, his speed isn't that great either. But when you factor in his work rate (he punches nonstop) and his almost granite chin, and the fact that he's never been one to disappoint that's why you see him being ranked so highly. In conclusion : In an era where most fighters are concerned with either public image or huge paydays, it's extremely refreshing to see a young, strong fighter who isn't afraid to fight the big fights or the fighters most people want nothing to do with. (Miranda may as well have been the plague when Pavlik wanted to fight him)

Kessler was a tested Champion, whats makes Pavlik any better than him??? Seriously? I think both are on the same level.

By the way this is not about having a pop at Pavlik because I like him, whats there not to like? but..... The guy is a good fighter with excellent power but nothing I have seen suggests that there is anything more, I mean he has a very upright type style, doesn't have great hand or foot speed IMO and his defence is not the greatest I have ever seen. Therefore why all the hype? Some of posts I have read have suggested that he is now a P4P top ten fighter, why? because he beat the man who beat man (an ageing version that is). Surely there are far better proven fighters who just don't currently hold a belt? There has to be more than that, please put me straight because I must be missing something? Micky, I was thinking this myself, Pavlik looks a decent fighter but hes just starting out. OK if he went on to defend the titles a few times then OK he should be considered, but so far all he has shown is heart and punch power. Lets see if he can even get past Taylor in the rematch.

He WAS losing. It doesn't matter. He won. Period. Kessler lost. Kessler may have more 'skills' than pavlik, but he just lost. If he beats Pavlik, then you can give it to him. Or, if he beats someone else big around that weight like Dawson, Hops, Winky, or whoever.

Wait, wait, wait... Kessler deserves to be ahead of Pavlik? Since when does a guy who just lost an 8-4 decision deserve to be ahead of a unified, lineal champion? Perhaps becuase he defended his titles. Pavlik KO'd his opponent during a fight he was losing, until he defends his title he is no better than a Rahman or Douglas is he?

Wait, wait, wait... Kessler deserves to be ahead of Pavlik? Since when does a guy who just lost an 8-4 decision deserve to be ahead of a unified, lineal champion?

Yes they are. http://www.boxrec.com/media/index.php/The_Ring_Magazine%27s_Annual_Ratings:_Pound_For_Pound--1980s 1989 was a long time ago. It has been years since a natural heavyweight was even in the p4p ratings. It is perfectly reasonable that when you beat the man, you become the man. I don't care if you had one pro fight...if you beat Bernard Hopkins in your 2nd fight, then you should be a top ten p4p fighter. Pavlik coming from 'obscurity' is a questionable argument. p4p status should not be based on how well you are known...if that was the case, DLH would never number one every year. Like I said, this is a fair system, because if Pavlik really doesn't 'deserve' the spot, then he will lose shortly. :duh:

By the way this is not about having a pop at Pavlik because I like him, whats there not to like? but..... The guy is a good fighter with excellent power but nothing I have seen suggests that there is anything more, I mean he has a very upright type style, doesn't have great hand or foot speed IMO and his defence is not the greatest I have ever seen. Therefore why all the hype? Some of posts I have read have suggested that he is now a P4P top ten fighter, why? because he beat the man who beat man (an ageing version that is). Surely there are far better proven fighters who just don't currently hold a belt? There has to be more than that, please put me straight because I must be missing something? Im sorry mate, but this is nearly spot on, i saw the miranda fight and didnt see the hype in this guy, his defence is okay, he took big shots he didnt have to, he seems to good throwing in straight lines, nothing more, im by no means an expert on pavlik, but when i saw him i didnt really rate the guy.

Pavil beat and ko'D THE CHAMPION. THE CHAMPION... Kesseler wasnt THE CHAMPION.. pAVLIK is. No but he held two belts and defended them on several occasions. Pavlik hasn't even defended his titles yet?

first of all he did not knock Taylor unconsious. He had a bullshit TKO when he was winning the fight according to the judges. I know nobody's goanna agree with me, but i think Taylor got slightly robbed in that fight. Bullshit TKO?? Taylor was motionless and slumped, they gave him smelling salts, then he snapped backed. You don't get smelling salts inside the ten count. You need to rewatch that. If the ref didn't wave it off, Taylor would not have moved a muscle.

He's performed very well in two big fights, knocking the #1 andf the champ unconscious. That's enough to get him close. first of all he did not knock Taylor unconsious. He had a bullshit TKO when he was winning the fight according to the judges. I know nobody's goanna agree with me, but i think Taylor got slightly robbed in that fight.

He's performed very well in two big fights, knocking the #1 andf the champ unconscious. That's enough to get him close. But I agree with you Mickey, he's not top ten material just yet, and he has noticeable and obvious flaws in his game. He gets nervous when hit. How could Pavlik possibly be ahead of Wlad Klitschko? That makes no sense. Kessler should be ahead of Pavlik. Cotto should be ahead of Pavlik on longevity and number of championship fights. Hatton definitely needs to be ahead of Pavlik, this is not in question. Hopkins, Wright, etc. go without saying. Pacquio, Marquez, ahead of Pavlik. Maybe around #15, with Chad Dawson and Ruslan Chagaev.

Heavyweights are never on the p4p list anyway, for whatever reason. An example would be Hatton's upset of Tyszu. BOOM...instant p4p status. It's well deserved, and if the fighter isn't that good, then eventually he will get beaten and lose that status (as Douglas quickly did). Yes they are. http://www.boxrec.com/media/index.php/The_Ring_Magazine%27s_Annual_Ratings:_Pound_For_Pound--1980s

Heavyweights are never on the p4p list anyway, for whatever reason. An example would be Hatton's upset of Tyszu. BOOM...instant p4p status. It's well deserved, and if the fighter isn't that good, then eventually he will get beaten and lose that status (as Douglas quickly did). Lewis and Tyson certainly were? Hatton was actually a long reigning Champion albeit a Micky Mouse one, Pavlik has come from almost obscurity?

Pavlik is deffinitley not top ten P4P, and if he manages to lose Pavlik-Taylor II he is screwed. IMO, beating Taylor doesn't mean much and when Taylor runs around the ring and punches here and there, Pavlik will not be able to win. If it wasn't for the KO, Pavlik probably wouldn't have won the Taylor fight to start with.

:ugh: ...ummmmm what? Kessler was a tested Champion, whats makes Pavlik any better than him??? Seriously?

Heavyweights are never on the p4p list anyway, for whatever reason. An example would be Hatton's upset of Tyszu. BOOM...instant p4p status. It's well deserved, and if the fighter isn't that good, then eventually he will get beaten and lose that status (as Douglas quickly did).