Who is the Best Pound 4 Pound fighter in their primes ever?

robinsons the best p4p ever for me no questions asked btw i have seen alot of his fights and im not just going with his record i also fined it funny when ppl say mayweather could beat robinson what a joke that is

Naseem Hamed you should be shot

Hey Ninja ;P I was reading a few posts back and before my first post in the thread I failed to read up to where you were talking about Tyson. Complete coincidence that I mentioned Tyson in my first post, I wasn't referring to you with that. Ninja and Yogi you two definately know your fisticuffs, +k as for me, im a cheapskate, ppv on my laptop and showtime on the tv... hahaha okay, yeah I thought you were talking about me at first .

what about jack johnson Yes, his evasive tactics were certainly something else, that's for sure, at least when it came to meeting a 170 (or so) pound Langford in a rematch.

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It sounds to be accurate considering his ethnicity and how the times were back then regarding the controversial losses. That's a good quote from Johnson. as far as who I consider the best p4p fighter ever...I'm going to go with Willie Pep, what he did against sadder was unlike anything I've ever seen in a smaller man's defensive package. No doubt in my mind his defense is better than Mayweather Jr's... Well thanks for understanding the Langford situation(s) a little more, my friend, and no doubt, Willie Pep was something special and certainly a completely reasonable pick for this category.

It sounds to be accurate considering his ethnicity and how the times were back then regarding the controversial losses. That's a good quote from Johnson. as far as who I consider the best p4p fighter ever...I'm going to go with Willie Pep, what he did against sadder was unlike anything I've ever seen in a smaller man's defensive package. No doubt in my mind his defense is better than Mayweather Jr's... Good pick though No disrespect ment by any of this my main thing is I hate to see the same thing repeated in every thread i'm a big fan of Roy,Robinson and the rest also but damn every post and every thread looks the same so sometimes I look outside the box for my picks. I can tell you know your stuff though.

It sounds to be accurate considering his ethnicity and how the times were back then regarding the controversial losses. That's a good quote from Johnson. as far as who I consider the best p4p fighter ever...I'm going to go with Willie Pep, what he did against sadder was unlike anything I've ever seen in a smaller man's defensive package. No doubt in my mind his defense is better than Mayweather Jr's... what about jack johnson

this is a good one so many fighters that i love but roy jones jr in his prime to much power and way to much speed. i would put him up aginst anyone in history at the right weight of course

hagler 160 holmes 200 tyson 220 whitiker

What I don't get is okay so there is no tape to prove how great people say he was but UMmm there is also no tape to prove that he wasn't. I have seen the clips of him I have read every book I have found on him I've heard people talk about him I've seen his record ... I don't think he was the #1 best of all time but he was among them.

well... He drew with Walcott, not Johnson. He was dropped in the sixth vs Johnson and lost a decision. He also lost vs a guy who was 73-37 via TKO named Tut Jackson...Langford was also stopped by a guy named Bearcat Wright, who had a record of 55-17... The losses to Jackson and Wright also came about when he was literally blind in one eye, virtually blind in the other, fat, and around the age of 40, so unless you have a habit of holding late losses against a fighter. The draw against Walcott was also considered a bad decision from the contemporary sources that I've read on the fight, whether it be the NY Times, Police Gazette, New York Sun, Boston Globe, etc., who all stated that Langford deserved the nod in that fight. You'd also have to check out the contemporary writings of some of Langford's other fights where he was officially given a draw or a loss. For example, boxrec may tell you that Fireman Flynn deserved a newspaper draw aqccording to a source from nearly a year after the fight, but the day-afters from the fight's very location (I'll keep this as a brief description, but..."A little black middleweight, Sam Langford, beat the local heavyweight, Ji9m Flynn, in a ten rounds last night at McCarey's Naud Junction fight house." - LA Times, Feb 10th, 1910) You can also check out contemporary sources from his first two fights with Sam McVey, the draw and the the decision loss, and you'll see that the draw McVey got the first time around caused quite the scandal in France because they all viewed Langford as the clear winner, and the rematch wasn't without it's share of controversy either, as the the crowd reportedly again boo'd the decision given to McVey with the day-afters saying that Langford deserved no worse than a draw. Etc., etc., etc. There's plenty of fights and results of Langford's that don't nearly tell the whole story by simply looking at the result, like him being forced to retire from one of the Young Peter Jackson fights from earlier in his career because of a freak arm injury that left him inactive for quite a spell. And as far as Johnson knocking down Langford, yes he did, but if I may; "I found him (Langford) one of the toughest adversaries that I ever met in the ring. I weighed 190 pounds and Langford only 138. In the second round the little negro hit me on the jaw with a terrible right hand and I fell as if upended by a cannon ball. In all my pugilistic career, not before and not afterwards, have I recieved a blow that struck me with such force. It was all I could do just to get back on my feet just as the referee was about to count to "Ten!"."- Jack Johnson in his 1910 biography, Mes Combat Johnson seems to have sugared it up some from other descriptions of Langford reportedly knocking him down, but apparently Langford hit plenty hard and was dangerous enough to where Johnson went out of his way to avoid any rematch with Langford once Langford became a little more physically mature.

well... He drew with Walcott, not Johnson. He was dropped in the sixth vs Johnson and lost a decision. He also lost vs a guy who was 73-37 via TKO named Tut Jackson...Langford was also stopped by a guy named Bearcat Wright, who had a record of 55-17... Your right, A draw with Walcott is still great . So he drew with one of the best of his time at his own weight and then went 15 with one of the best heavyweights of all time in most ppl's eyes. A lot of these were also NEWS PAPER old recs don't always mean very much .

Mayweather Jr. Jones Jr. Hopkins Ali Leonard

Tyson a top 20 All time HW on your list? He was great, but I can think of 20 greater hw's. Film only exists of Langford fighting Fireman Jim Flynn and Bill Lang...and those aren't even full fights. It's like saying Greb is the best middleweight ever, when we have essentially zero footage of him. He got a draw with Walcott before losing to Johnson, who was KO'd by Willard, a guy Dempsey humiliated in the first round. I don't know I don't make list because it's pointless. There is no tape of Robinson in his prime either ;) I know what you mean but understand that this is a hypothetical title there for hypothetically from what we know about Langford I can hypothetically say he was a good p4p fighter . You think a draw with Johnson isn't great ? That was like James Toney today drawing with prime Lennox Lewis.

uh, because they are better. they got guys on here that think bruce lee could compete with world champions and contenders. and guys who think tyson was a top 10 atg hw. Anyway, no need to get defensive, not sure why you thought I was going to call you a kid, but anyhow...gratz on being older than me. He might not have been a top 10 that's up to you and you have that right but if you mean that he wasn't a great fighter then you just need to stop watching boxing because you just don't understand it. I couldn't care less and am not defensive just wasn't sure who you were speaking on. I understand your point now with the Bruce Lee topics and agree that some pople get a little caught up in the hype but that also works for boxing as well . There are martial artist who would beat some boxers as well as boxers that would beat martial artist it's a boring played out du8mb ass topic. And Langford was beating the best of his time when far past his prime at a weight far above his own why would I need anything else ?

Human physics also say that because he would be smaller, he'd lack the power that his body once had. Therefore, the speed wouldn't matter AS much. True but it is well known that he has always had abnormal strength from a young age before he had the build. There is no way to know for sure but I think he would have been even more amazing if he was smaller.

This is fucked up...You got a guy here who owns quality memorabilia and obviously has a huge love for the sport, and his fuckin' bar is red...They got kids on here that think Tyson/Floyd are god, and spew nonsense...Yet they have green karma bars... People do have a right to their own opinion what makes you think your ideas are so much better then theirs ? Really I don't think just one person is the best and I can give you a link to my thoughts on it but most of the time i'd say Robinson,Jones,Toney,Leonard,Langford ect . But That is what everyone says so sometimes I like to add a new face to the topic .Oh and btw i'm older then you are so save the kids comment.

Human Physics ....;) Human physics also say that because he would be smaller, he'd lack the power that his body once had. Therefore, the speed wouldn't matter AS much.

Would he? Didn't know you had the power to know that. Human Physics ....;)