Dino Duva, President of Duva Boxing and promoter of WBC #1 contender Samuel “The Nigerian Nightmare” Peter says he’s enraged by even the speculation of the WBC ordering a rematch between Peter and James “Lights Out” Toney.
Peter scored a close but entirely legitimate split decision win over Toney in a WBC elimination bout on September 2. While the bout was competitive, there are no solid grounds for ordering a repeat other than Toney’s camp being unhappy with the outcome.
“(Toney’s promoter) Dan Goossen has filed a protest with the WBC, regarding the fight and requesting an immediate rematch be ordered. And from what I hear, the WBC is putting it to a vote. This should never happen. This should not even be put to a vote for several reasons:
The WBC would be taking the scoring out of neutral officials’ hands.
The fact is the scoring was not that close. Two judges had it scored by five points for Peter
James Toney’s character, or lack of, shouldn’t be continuously awarded by the WBC.
In a recent poll of respected boxing writers, an overwhelming majority indicated that regardless of who they thought won, a rematch should not be ordered by the WBC and it would not be in the best interest of boxing or the WBC.
Infuriated by having been forced to deal with the volatile Toney and his continuously unprofessional antics, Duva says the WBC would be making a huge mistake by acquiescing to Goossen and Toney’s refusal to accept a legitimate loss, “also, on a personal level, he continually makes disparaging remarks about people and their personal lives and he’s not only a disgrace to boxing but also a disgrace to the human race. If the WBC gives him another opportunity he doesn’t deserve, they would be lowering themselves to his level.”
Duva says that Toney’s behavior has always been detrimental to boxing and that he’s flabbergasted at how many opportunities he continues to receive. “James Toney has continually behaved this way throughout his whole career. He crosses the line into people’s personal lives and says a lot of things that make boxing look bad. He made a ton of hateful remarks to Sam and his camp before the fight and even made disparaging remarks about a respected WBC official in a recent interview. James Toney shouldn’t even be in the picture. The WBC should start taking character into account and James Toney has none. Enough is enough. This kind of thing cannot be rewarded and it would be a disgrace to the boxing business.”
The division needs Peter or atleast think they do because hes a big strong guy who can punch but his people seem to be very neglegent about things, Pops Anderson doesnt know shit about boxing and instead of paying of judges Duva and Gotzev need to hire a good trainer who will give Peter some technique because he will not get far fighting the way he is..
So did Peter.
I had it close, too, but a Peter win. Truthfully, I would rather have seen Toney win, but not out of great love for Toney. I think Peter has been brought along far too fast and will never have time to develop the skills he will need to be a champ because of it. His career has been sacrificed so we could have a heavy puncher in the limelight of the division. The problem is, he's never been taught to properly set up the punches, or even how to throw them consistently. While he has great power, he damned neaar has to get lucky to hurt you with it because of this.
Of course it's also entirely possible that he could never be taught good technique as well.
He can still improve: He needs a new team around him...get rid of everybody because none of them seem to care about him, if they did, they would have hired a new trainer...or maybe not since if they had a person that knows what they are doing that person might tell Sam to get rid of everybody...the right trainer would tell him to get his fat ass down to 230lbs, and then they would teach him to acutally "box."
That is why I respect Jermain Taylor: even though he had been with his trainer for a long time, he decided it was best for himself to search for new ways to improve.
I wouldn't have Sam fight for the title for another year...see if he can improve, if not, then go after the title and cash in.
I agree all the way. Basically, I don't care particularly for either fighter as neither are particularly notable heavyweights.
Toney is indisputably great for his sheer talent. He is in the wrong weight class and the wrong age now. He has had two chances at belts neither of which he has capitalized on. His primary appeal is his persona. A deserving champion wins in a manner that brooks NO dispute. The only disputable decision is in a great fight with another true champion. Toney has not done this in any fight since Holyfield. Now that was a superb fight but with a very faded Holyfield.
Peter has primarily faced fighters that aspire to be journeymen but aren't good enough. He knocked Klitschko over a few times and still lost!!! He won this decision over Toney in a very close match. He may take the belt off Maskaev (if Maskaev still has it) due to Maskaev's advancing age but if he is not willing or able to develope boxing skills by now, it is unlikely that he ever will. He is fun to watch but I find it hard to get excited by him.
I'm far more interested in Calvin Brock, Lyakovich and Klitschko. I don't think they are great but they are boxers with potential to advance heavyweight boxing.
...knock the other fighter down.
Toney did promise he would.So did Peter.
I had it close, too, but a Peter win. Truthfully, I would rather have seen Toney win, but not out of great love for Toney. I think Peter has been brought along far too fast and will never have time to develop the skills he will need to be a champ because of it. His career has been sacrificed so we could have a heavy puncher in the limelight of the division. The problem is, he's never been taught to properly set up the punches, or even how to throw them consistently. While he has great power, he damned neaar has to get lucky to hurt you with it because of this.
Of course it's also entirely possible that he could never be taught good technique as well.
I don't particularly care if there's a rematch or not.
I watched the fight rooting for neither fighter. I came out with a tight points victory for Sam Peter. I would have also bought a tight win for Toney. The judging was wild but I don't dispute the decision. When Peter punched I could hear the impact. If they were missing then I don't know where the sound was coming from.
I'm sorry for those who really support Toney. He did some lovely things in the fight, some good fast flurries and some sweet defense but he didn't do enough for the indisputable win.
To take the decision away from the judges, knock the other fighter down.
Toney did promise he would.
EVERY TIME Peter landed his jab, it pushed Toney off balance and he missed with his counter. This is what is called an effective punch. Toney's punches may have looked pretty neat to you but they did absolute dick to halt Peter's advance. He was the aggressor all night (which you need to reward in scoring, otherwise why the fuck would anyone EVER advance against a counter puncher, all boxing matches would be two guys covering up, feinting, and looking for opportunities for 12 rounds, you need to encourage aggression by including it in the scoring) and physically knocked Toney around every time he landed. This isn't rocket science, the judges are going to score the fight for the guy who snaps his opponents head back in dramatic fashion every time he lands over the guy who lands more punches that have less effect. It's easy to see who's scoring, and it just plain looks more impressive in the judges' eyes.
VB, you said not one single punch ever affected Peter. But there was a round were Peter looked to be stunned, I'm positive of it. Just not sure what round it was...
My eyes are fine. I just don't get emotionally involved in love or hate of a fighter, so I have no problems with bias.
And it was me and 3 other people.
I got the impression the majority of people didn't like Toney, so to imply thats the reason so many people thought he won, is a bit confusing.
you and one other person had peter winning, check your eyes.
My eyes are fine. I just don't get emotionally involved in love or hate of a fighter, so I have no problems with bias.
And it was me and 3 other people.
i hope the rematch is made, i think the wbc is thinking in the best interest of boxing because they know james was robbed. when a guy is robbed like that you have to order a rematch, let peter win it fair and square this time
Effectiveness is determined by how your punches, well, AFFECT your opponent. Not a single punch landed by Toney had any visible effect on Peter. Not once did Toney stop Peter from coming forward and swinging. The one time it looked like he stunned Peter, Peter was off balance and tired. Peter visibly shook Toney on several occasions throughout the fight and had Toney moving backwards. Toney can't punch moving backwards.
how about how sam peters face was bloodied up after the fight, i'd call that a 'visible effect' :rolleyes: . and peter didnt have him SHOOK during the fight, once or twice he was stunned but please, thats 2 rounds out of a 12 round fight. getting stunned in one round doesnt win you the next 3 rounds. neither does just coming and NOT LANDING PUNCHES. even if toneys punches werent haymakers which is obviously what judges like you look for, he tagged peters face with the jab all night and landed the cleaner punches. jabs and clean flush punches are worth something to :rolleyes: especially when the other guy barely lands any.
Sorry, but you're no boxing expert.
How the HELL do you know the effects of Toney's punches. Has James ever punched you in the face. Stop acting like your name is Samuel Peter.
Obviously you know nothing of how the sport works.
blah blah blah
Maybe boxers should judge other boxers instead of blind old men who are looking for hand outs. I've been in and around boxing since you were still swimming around in the
mail man's nutsack, so please don't presume to judge what I might and might not know about the sport.
You, on the other hand, show your complete ignorance in your implication that because a punch might sting it is effective.
No, I haven't been punched in the face by Toney, and I hope I never do, but the fact that his punches may have hurt a little on Peter has no bearing on whether or not they were effective.
Effectiveness is determined by how your punches, well, AFFECT your opponent. Not a single punch landed by Toney had any visible effect on Peter. Not once did Toney stop Peter from coming forward and swinging. The one time it looked like he stunned Peter, Peter was off balance and tired. Peter visibly shook Toney on several occasions throughout the fight and had Toney moving backwards. Toney can't punch moving backwards.
If fights were judges solely on defense and the ability to make the other figher miss, Toney would have won easily. In fact, it was his slickness that gave him several rounds from me, but still not enough to win.
I think Toney is a shoe-in for first ballot HOF, and I love to watch him fight, but he still didn't do enough to win this one.
Maybe boxers should judge other boxers instead of blind old men who are looking for hand outs.I agree on this point.
Heh, why have a rematch?
The first fight was so lopsided, just like all those people said, Sam Peter knocked James Toney the f*ck out in the early rounds.
Oh wait, no he didn't =P.
/end sarcasm.
Douche Bag
How can you call Toney's punches effective when they had abosultely no effect on his opponent?
Sorry, but you're no boxing expert.
How the HELL do you know the effects of Toney's punches. Has James ever punched you in the face. Stop acting like your name is Samuel Peter.
Obviously you know nothing of how the sport works.
Writers, and boxing commissions don't want or feel the need james anymore. This is how you get a guy to go away, you give the victory to the young prospect and not the aging veteran that every sports writer hates.
I know James personally, yeah he is brash, but he deserves more respect.
Maybe boxers should judge other boxers instead of blind old men who are looking for hand outs.
Goossen responds to Duva!
September 21, 2006
James Toney's promoter Dan Goossen has responded to a statement released by promoter Samuel Peter Dino Duva in which Duva says he's enraged about speculation that the WBC will order a Peter-Toney rematch. "He couldn't possibly be as enraged as almost all of the media and fans, as well as James and I, were the night of the event," wrote Goossen in an email. "Out of 27 ringside media polled immediately after the bout, 25 scored it for Toney.
"The WBC, like many organizations throughout the years, have ordered immediate rematches based on controversial decisions. They are not changing a decision, only voting whether or not there is cause to order an immediate rematch. With the tremendous amount of outcry from the media and the fans its obvious the only fair decision is an immediate rematch."
Regarding Duva's comments on James Toney’s character, or lack of, Goossen wrote, "Character? It was Duva who first angered Toney and his wife and kids, when he said 'Toney was dumb' at the opening press conference. Character? Who was lacking character insulting James in front of his family?"
Finally, in regard to Duva's comments on Toney's antics being detrimental to boxing, Goossen wrote, "Disgrace to the boxing business is a controversial decision and not what is said by fighters (and promoters) during the heat of battle (preparing and fighting). The WBC should be applauded if they find it worthy to order an immediate rematch based on the uproar of an overwhelming majority of media, fans and the television on-air talent, who all had James Toney winning the bout."
-www.fightnews.com
How can you call Toney's punches effective when they had abosultely no effect on his opponent?
He did stun him once. I'm not lying, I don't remember what round it was...
I don't really care if Al Bernstein thought Toney won! Half of the press can be full of shit half of the time, but your right most people had Toney winning the fight and also 75% of the press had it for Toney.
I respect Al Bernstein's opinion, I think hes a smart guy and a knowledgable boxing analyst. Thats why I used him as an example.