Roy Jones - Poor amateur record

Anybody to tries to downplay the prime of Jones Jr... Is either Idiotic, overly Critical, or down right Moronic. Jones fought the top opposition at the time, and from what I remember Jones biggest Duck was McClellan. Fourtanitly damn near every Junior Middleweight/Middleweight were clearly frightened of McClellen. Jones although for from the greatest technician but his physical gifts made up for a lack of well rounded boxing technique. The man was a monster and beat damn near every top fighter in his weightclass. Agreed. Anyone saying that a man who fought and beat both Toney and Hopkins had sub par opposition is an idiot.

Anybody to tries to downplay the prime of Jones Jr... Is either Idiotic, overly Critical, or down right Moronic. Jones fought the top opposition at the time, and from what I remember Jones biggest Duck was McClellan. Fourtanitly damn near every Junior Middleweight/Middleweight were clearly frightened of McClellen. Jones although for from the greatest technician but his physical gifts made up for a lack of well rounded boxing technique. The man was a monster and beat damn near every top fighter in his weightclass.

So far all I know is that he was getting Down from 207 for Jones. Let's say that it's highly unlikely that he had to drop as much weight for Johnson as that was only 6 weeks after Nunn. But I await the proofs for Toney having to drop as much way for his other fights. Yeah. Ok. Point? I haven't been asked to. I asked YOU to provide the proofs for where he was 'flat out wrong' which you have failed to do. Well yes he did make excuses likely meaning that he didn't think that Jones fought a top fighter at that fighters toplevel. Provide me with proof that he didn't. Everyone knows Toney had to cut a load of weight for all of his fights back then. What's my point? Well you said "Toney looked better against Nunn than he did Jones" (debatable) implying that he was drained against Jones as opposed to Nunn what's your excuse for him looking terrible against him? I clearly have stated where he's wrong. He said Jones didn't fight any top fighters. WRONG. He said Jones didn't fight any A fighters. WRONG. Now before you tell me that he didn't say that because he changed his mind half way through that doesn't change the fact that he said it. So he's either wrong or a hypocrite. Pick one. Ok fantastic we have established that he's made excuses for his wins. Thank you. Sounds like he's very much "on target"

How did I end up here? I can't believe it but I couldn't take this post..... I would LOVE to go through and tear this to shreds, which would be very easy, but you're clearly a complete waste of time. But let's add a few things you've left out.....first and foremost all your 'robbed' is your opinion based on either something Tarver said or you read. Jones didn't 'run for his life' from Hopkins. He won the first half easily, broke his hand, and still won very comfortably and Hopkins didn't do ****. If you watch McClellan and Benn in their tragic fight and think that they would be able to find Jones, let alone fend him off without getting beaten half to death, good for you. Jackson, not quick enough or big enough, was cleaned up by McClellan, and after Benn-McClellan, Benn, Collins and Eubank were all pretty much done. Very short periods of success by comparison and you don't have to be a genius to see why they fought each other in England rather than come here and get humiliated. Michael Nunn got KTFO by Toney and moved to 168 after that fight before Jones even fought Hopkins. Toney and Nunn were in the middle of setting up their rematch when Nunn lost and his next fight was above 190#. That led to Jones replacing Nunn and while Toney talked all kinds of ****, he won 2-3 rounds. Tops. NO INTEREST IN A REMATCH...... And Roy accomplished plenty at 175. McCallum at LHW was NOT a close fight. Jones carried him out of respect...........some people's brain-damaged children. He KO'd Virgil Hill and KO'd two guys that beat the heil out of Dariusz..... Also, before Jones went to HW where he hoped it would be Holyfield, both before and after, the guy he 'ducked', Daruisz, was making 1.5 million per fight. He was offered $5 M on 3 different occasions to come to the US and fight Jones...........NOPE. DIDN"T WANT IT, Same With Rocchigiani though the offer was less, still more than triple his usual salary. Jones v Hopkins 2 didn't happen because Hopkins thought he should get 50/50. Toney made damn sure to eat himself away from Jones the rest of his damn career. Jones beat Tarver the first fight. After that, and a 'horrendous' record of 121-13 in the amateurs, he was done. After a long period of time, punch tolerance drops, particularly after what Jones foolishly did to his body. Griffin gave him a rough night on a bad night. But Jones was in the middle of knocking his ass out and about to take the lead on the best possible scorecard for Griffin........did you see the fight? Anything that happened after Jones-Tarver 2 is not worth talking about. He had lost a split second of reflexes that separated him from every fighter in history. Dariusz got beat by Gonzalez, who Jones had dropped 3 times in a 12 rd UD after a punch count of 51% to 15% and 195-91 and a score of 119-106. Tarver isn't exactly the shiniest example of greatness himself. He talked **** about Jones and dropping weight, then used the exact same excuse against Hopkins. And you believe he should have given up all that weight to Lewis? That's a 'duck'..........that is absolutely retarded. No LHW in history would have considered it. They fought HW back in the day because their walk around weight was only about 10 pounds different than HW. Jones beat Ruiz who beat Holyfield who beat Tyson......not exactly his fault that his one and done ended up being the least interesting choice but he still did it and came back too quickly, but still beat Tarver. If he'd have been smart like he always promised he would, he'd have walked at 49-1, that 1 being a BS DQ, with 38 KO's and after McClellan-Benn, he asked the ref to stop many of those fights........he also could have knocked out others. Vassily Jirov? Get serious. Calzaghe was offered a fight. During the prime of both fighters, same as Hopkins. Nunn would have been KO'd the same way he was vs Toney. Take away the BS DQ and he just may well have walked at 50-0 w 39 KO's and I bet that would have KILLED YOU.......eh? You're basically left with a couple of standing 8's in the amateurs, which mean very little, a couple of close scores in a bad scoring system, Tyson, Lewis and Vasily Jirov. Becasue when did anyone clamor for the Jirov fight? Del Valle landed a bizarre temple shot, to which Jones jumped right up from. And when he beat Eric Harding as a mandatory it was because.......Oh yea, Harding beat Tarver and while Harding was an awkward opponent, he was behind on all cards when he retired on the stool....... He also made several future champions look like complete bums, including one he beat the hell out of Dariusz...... Who had a chance? Maybe McClellan but he was so used to going short rounds, he probably would have gassed early and got KO'd. The rest of this is garbage. The Jones in the first Tarver fight, let alone the second, third and the one who fought Johnson was simply not the same....... You're a clown. YDKSAB...........and I'd love to pull the documentation up to prove it, I don't have anymore time to waste on the UNDISPUTEDLY BEST FIGHTER FROM TONEY (arguably Hopkins 1) TO TARVER 1.......... So take this :slap: and this :bottle: before I really make you look like a :wank: with your cute little list........ and :****you: You can freely have Tiozzo, who made a career of beating up other Frenchmen, then KO'ing Dariusz after a comeback attempt 18 mos after losing to Gonzalez and after Jones had already lost. You can also have all the post Tarver 1 fights because it's tantamount to saying that after losing his 5th MW title, Robinson turned himself into a bum.....you are entitled to that opinion.......but you don't get to use opinion as fact and go unchallenged in your bias.........what next, he shouldn't have been awarded the Val Barker trophy? SMDH Go troll after someone else......check on all the guys Calzaghe didn't fight.....how about that? Or Benn? Any of the guys you mention.......have fun on your fool's errand, fool. nice post. lots going on :lol1:

When wasn't Toney that weight between fights during that time period? So far all I know is that he was getting Down from 207 for Jones. Let's say that it's highly unlikely that he had to drop as much weight for Johnson as that was only 6 weeks after Nunn. But I await the proofs for Toney having to drop as much way for his other fights. Oh ok Toney looking poor against Nunn isn't a fact :lol1: Ok. Yeah. Ok. What about Dave Tiberi is that a fact or opinion that he looked poor? Or was that one down to Dave? Point? "We" haven't been over anything. You have refused to adknowledge the posters blatant hypocrisy. I haven't been asked to. I asked YOU to provide the proofs for where he was 'flat out wrong' which you have failed to do. He also doesn't contradict his point of "he never fougt a top fighter" he doesn't change his mind on that one. That is flat out wrong. In conclusion; You agree with his post despite the clear and blatant bias and agenda because you share the same one. He's contradicted himself and made every excuse in the book. That's after making a ridiculous claim of "He never fought a top fighter" Well yes he did make excuses likely meaning that he didn't think that Jones fought a top fighter at that fighters toplevel.

Opinion. Don't mistake opinions for facts. Still you can provide facts here if you can somehow prove that Toney cut as much weight for everybody else as he did for Jones. Boxrec says: "Toney weighed 207 pounds when he started training camp, but he was able to get down to 167 for the official weigh-in." Opinion. Don't mistake opinions for facts. Some might have the opinion that Toney looked the way he did because he was fighting Michael Nunn. Which is a point we have already been over. Here's what he wrote Again: In conculsion you have not been able to show the cases where wpink was 'flat out wrong'. When wasn't Toney that weight between fights during that time period? Oh ok Toney looking poor against Nunn isn't a fact :lol1: Ok. What about Dave Tiberi is that a fact or opinion that he looked poor? Or was that one down to Dave? "We" haven't been over anything. You have refused to adknowledge the posters blatant hypocrisy. He also doesn't contradict his point of "he never fougt a top fighter" he doesn't change his mind on that one. That is flat out wrong. In conclusion; You agree with his post despite the clear and blatant bias and agenda because you share the same one. He's contradicted himself and made every excuse in the book. That's after making a ridiculous claim of "He never fought a top fighter"

1982 Florida Games - Gift Decision against Antonio Tarver in final 1983 Florida Jr. Olympics - Lost 1985 Florida Jr. Olympics - Lost He also Lost to Igor Ruzhnikov (Russia, 139, 1986), John Reid (Ireland, 156, 1986), Andy Liebing (Cuba, 156, 1986), Frank Liles (almost KTFO, US nationals, 156, 1988) and Gerald McClellan (US Golden Gloves, 156, 1988). Then, Jones got a gift to the 1988 Olympics when every sane person knows it should of been Gerald McClellan going to Seoul. Mediocre Richie Woodhall gave Jones a very close fight in the semi-finals. Then Park Si-Hun was Jones' 13th amateur loss. Also remember that Jermain Taylor looked better against Bernard Hopkins than Jones did and that Michael Nunn looked better against James Toney than Jones did. People should not forget the Schooling that Montell Griffin put on Jones. Let's not forget 40-year-old Mike McCallum giving Jones a really close fight. Let's not forget Lou Del Valle almost KTFO Jones. Let's not forget Antonio Tarver KTFO Jones. Let's not forget Glencoffe Johnson KTFO Jones. Let's not forget Antonio Tarver beat Jones four times - 1982 (robbed), 2003 (robbed), 2004 and 2005. Jones' best resume is the guys he avoided and ducked - Gerald McClellan, Lamar Parks, Julian Jackson, Nigel Benn, Chris Eubank, Michael Nunn, Graciano Rocchigiani, Fabrice Tiozzo, Steve Collins, Henry Maske, Dariusz Michalczewski, James Toney II, Bernard Hopkins II, Joe Calzaghe, Vassilliy Jirov, Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis, the list goes on. Reaching. Boxing politics son. You just came off a big hater. :op::lame::chairshot

He looked no more "lacklustre" than he did against Jones than he did any fights in that period and he also was cutting just as much weight. He was "drained" is a ridiculous excuse. He only looked any worse because he was fighting Roy Jones. Opinion. Don't mistake opinions for facts. Still you can provide facts here if you can somehow prove that Toney cut as much weight for everybody else as he did for Jones. Boxrec says: "Toney weighed 207 pounds when he started training camp, but he was able to get down to 167 for the official weigh-in." And Toney looked like sh*t against Nunn. Opinion. Don't mistake opinions for facts. Some might have the opinion that Toney looked the way he did because he was fighting Michael Nunn. That he didn't fight top fighters (laughable) That he didn't fight A fighters (laughable) Which is a point we have already been over. Here's what he wrote Again: not A fighters except for Hopkins and Toney. Oh but he actually he did fight A fighters, allow me to contradict myself there, but of course I've got these list of excuses ready for those wins. But "I don't believe in excuses" :lol1: In conculsion you have not been able to show the cases where wpink was 'flat out wrong'.

From memory I think he looked more lacklustre against RJJ than against Nunn. So you saying that he is 'flat out' wrong' is based on opinion which makes your statement a contradiction. What are the other cases where he is 'flat out wrong'? He looked no more "lacklustre" than he did against Jones than he did any fights in that period and he also was cutting just as much weight. He was "drained" is a ridiculous excuse. He only looked any worse because he was fighting Roy Jones. And Toney looked like sh*t against Nunn. That he didn't fight top fighters (laughable) That he didn't fight A fighters (laughable) Oh but he actually he did fight A fighters, allow me to contradict myself there, but of course I've got these list of excuses ready for those wins. But "I don't believe in excuses" :lol1:

Lol the Richie Woodhall fight wasn't close wtf. 'Then Park Si-Hun was Jones' 13th amateur loss' :rofl: spends the whole time going on about gifts and then casually acts like he just lost fair and square. If he admitted Jones was robbed that would be the perfect chance to make his post balanced/disguise the hatred of Jones but that pretty much confirmed it was a troll post for me.

I didn't retract anything but thank you for not addressing anything I said. He's flat out wrong in implying that James Toney was any different against Roy Jones than he was in any of his other fights around that time period. But I expect that from someone who clearly has an agenda. From memory I think he looked more lacklustre against RJJ than against Nunn. So you saying that he is 'flat out' wrong' is based on opinion which makes your statement a contradiction. What are the other cases where he is 'flat out wrong'?

Thanks for the retraction. Now where is it that he is 'flat out wrong'? I didn't retract anything but thank you for not addressing anything I said. He's flat out wrong in implying that James Toney was any different against Roy Jones than he was in any of his other fights around that time period. But I expect that from someone who clearly has an agenda.

No point in trying to appeal to this hate driven threadstarter, anyone co-signing him is just a hater plain and simple.

Ok so he did fight A fighters. So why close the post with "Jones never proved it against A fighters?" then? Oh that's right maybe because he's conventintly got every excuse ready under the sun for those two wins. So it's either he didn't fight A fighters or he did fight A fighters BUT.. Clearly and obviously biased and just flat out wrong in some cases. Thanks for the retraction. Now where is it that he is 'flat out wrong'?

Re-read please. :pat: You are better than this. What if he has a very narrow definition of being worthy of the mythical ATG tag? Ok. Ok so he did fight A fighters. So why close the post with "Jones never proved it against A fighters?" then? Oh that's right maybe because he's conventintly got every excuse ready under the sun for those two wins. So it's either he didn't fight A fighters or he did fight A fighters BUT.. Clearly and obviously biased and just flat out wrong in some cases.

Ok so explain to me what this sentence means; "Yes Roy had great skills but he did not prove it against A fighters" Re-read please. not A fighters except for Hopkins and Toney. He's an ATG under any definition. Clear and obvious ATG and the #1 fighter of his era. :pat: You are better than this. What if he has a very narrow definition of being worthy of the mythical ATG tag? The poster clearly has a dislike for Roy Jones and is making excuses for every win he has. Ok.

Ok so explain to me what this sentence means; "Yes Roy had great skills but he did not prove it against A fighters" He's an ATG under any definition. Clear and obvious ATG and the #1 fighter of his era. The poster clearly has a dislike for Roy Jones and is making excuses for every win he has. I stopped reading when he said "Jones never fought top fighters." At that point it was nothing more than an agenda.

Which wpink never said. Depends upon his definition. Ok so explain to me what this sentence means; "Yes Roy had great skills but he did not prove it against A fighters" He's an ATG under any definition. Clear and obvious ATG and the #1 fighter of his era. The poster clearly has a dislike for Roy Jones and is making excuses for every win he has.

You're nut hugging a post that is nearly a decade old. So what is the point, btw? After dissing all of prime RJJr's wins, then what? Is this some kind of round-a-bout way of smoking Calzaghe pole? Or Kessler? Is that it? You are making the case that prime Kessler > prime RJJr? Or maybe it can be bent around to Kessler > Andre Ward? I don't get it...:thinking: Don't worry. It's ok.

Sounds more like excuses to me. Roy Jones never beat an A fighter? Which wpink never said. Not an ATG? Good joke. Depends upon his definition.