Training in the old days. With PICS (Jack Johnson, Benny Leonard, Battling Nelson etc

[Weltschmerz]

It is. Its from a newspaperclip long after his active career was over. Nelson was robbed by a gang of Chicago thugs. The story was that he beat them all up and chased them away. As you can see from the pic, he took some damage himself. So much so that his already tormented brain got completely wasted. He died a couple of years later as I recall it. In total poverty.

Anyway I love the picture. An old time prizefighter still posing as mean and tough is if he was prime.

His left ear looks badly messed up.

[ks001]

Would you put them in against today's athletes ?

[MMartialArtist]

Looks like a Rocky training montague.

[Anthony342]

Looks like a Rocky training montague.

MONTAGE! Team America style.

[BattlingNelson]

His left ear looks badly messed up.

When he was an active boxer, Nelson always wanted his Picture to be taken so that only his right ear was visible. His left ear was badly molested since his early fighting days. Yeah. Even fighters back then had some vanity.

I've seen several Pictures of him as an old man, where it is his left ear you can see. My guess is that he was so much out of his senses that he just let the photographer take the Pictures he wanted and of course he (the photographer) wanted to show the Wear and tear on old prizefighter.

[Weltschmerz]

When he was an active boxer, Nelson always wanted his Picture to be taken so that only his right ear was visible. His left ear was badly molested since his early fighting days. Yeah. Even fighters back then had some vanity.

I've seen several Pictures of him as an old man, where it is his left ear you can see. My guess is that he was so much out of his senses that he just let the photographer take the Pictures he wanted and of course he (the photographer) wanted to show the Wear and tear on old prizefighter.

These photos are allegedly of an old Nelson, his bad ear visible

[juggernaut666]

Would you put them in against today's athletes ?

Its my understanding you cant compare modern guys to past timers in this section...HOWEVER since its a post I DIDNT create...well the old timers are over matched severly more ways than one. Training is way more scientific and anyone who thinks wheel barreling is a science well....go to a real cross fit gym and learn the hard way.....I train daily and sorry but wwood chopping and such is just a small fraction of what they do now and they do such on a regimine that is way more exhausting...Now if you think less nutritioned tougher guys are better than smarter elite physical specimes that's on you....


as stated this section is not tailored to modern fighters so....................which is all good I respect the old guys who paved the way but I know reality from fantasy...Mental toughness is important and one who has to go through these modern regimes needs that as well,its subjective to the fighter,however a good athlete will defeat a good fighter almost always.

[Weltschmerz]

Its my understanding you cant compare modern guys to past timers in this section...HOWEVER since its a post I DIDNT create...well the old timers are over matched severly more ways than one. Training is way more scientific and anyone who thinks wheel barreling is a science well....go to a real cross fit gym and learn the hard way.....I train daily and sorry but wwood chopping and such is just a small fraction of what they do now and they do such on a regimine that is way more exhausting...Now if you think less nutritioned tougher guys are better than smarter elite physical specimes that's on you....


as stated this section is not tailored to modern fighters so....................which is all good I respect the old guys who paved the way but I know reality from fantasy...Mental toughness is important and one who has to go through these modern regimes needs that as well,its subjective to the fighter,however a good athlete will defeat a good fighter almost always.

What if the historic fighters had access to modern day training techniques and nutrition knowledge, etc.? Would they be better or worse vs say our contemporary fighters, or the same?

[juggernaut666]

What if the historic fighters had access to modern day training techniques and nutrition knowledge, etc.? Would they be better or worse vs say our contemporary fighters, or the same?

Well its a what if question how they would fare against fighters today ,they themselves would certainly be better ,more sharp/refined ,better diet ,training plans /preperations ,film/video footage to study ones opponent or style . I dont see say Marciano blowing out a Lewis type fighter at any point for instance ,what would rocky possibly do to a guy with Lewis's attributes or most sizeable good boxers unless you altered either Marcianos speed SEVERLY or made him at least 6'2 which falls under science fiction .

The old myth that just because someone didnt have access to things of modern times automatically says how badly they would defeat modern guys with the same availability giving to them is nonsense because Marciano still wouldn't be fighting the guys he mostly fought under 200 pounds that he should have blown out at times if he was actually as dangerous as he was made out to be ,and the goal post has changed dramatically in itself ,you cant know for sure how good past timers would actually do when they would be in real life having to fight bigger ,stronger better prepared guys ,particularly when most past time champs havent fought anyone that would fit those discriptions and looked like they had an easy time in their own eras doing so ,let alone the newer ones.

I used Marciano so i didnt have to waste time and use a solid past time fighter who was as good at being an in your faced ,hard nosed fighter,one who many stll think would defeat todays guys and i personally wouldn't even put Marciano over a Dwight Qawi ,never mind the likes of Klitchko,Tyson, Holyfield, Foreman, Lewis......etc .....etc ...... In short there is no guarantee how the likes of Marciano ,Louis or Liston does even if you made them better fighters post 60's and beyond most of the top guys they fought wouldn't even been relevant or ranked thereafter , they still have to move the goal posts themselves dramatically against better more dangerous opposition , i dont think anyone who boxed pre 70's would be of much significance unless you used the science fiction theory ,but i dont do that because its not real life.


I have made a list of top 50 guys that would be hardest to defeat at head to head that would certainly stir up smoke around here , particularly because its a SOLID reasonable list.....

[phallus]

Most of them may not have been as technically profecient, but their stamina (many fights were set for 20 rounds or more) and their toughness (fighting with 2oz to 4oz horse hair gloves, sometimes 3 and 4 times a month) cannot be questioned.

I've seen photos of Dempsey working the heavybag as well as other fighters doing roadwork, skipping rope, sparring, ect. IE things fighters do today. Just what do people think current fighters do that the old-timers didn't? Lift weights? I was under the impression that weightlifting still wasn't very common among fighters of today and for a very good reason: It kills your reflexes; something a fighter can ill afford to do. Of course those old-timers didn't take steroids so maybe THAT'S the biggest difference

Poet

Here's one for you Bat.

Just to show you how important the evolution of boxing training is: Robinson only knew to drink a dumb beeve's blood, whereas Marquez brilliantly knew to drink his own piss. A fighter drinking his own piss in those days would have been rushed by six guys in white jackets anyway.

These photos are allegedly of an old Nelson, his bad ear visible

jim Jeffries used to work as a boilermaker before he was hw champ, lots of those old school guys got big and strong from working as a laborer, compared to todays' fighters the old guys were tougher