ATG's List by McGoorty - A Hall of Fame

[McGoorty]

But why did Muhammad Ali leave?

LOL... the funniest post in ages... you sir are very quick witted.... KUDOS

[McGoorty]

I like your list. So much that I am treating with the maximum respect, and spending time on it: instead of looking for a name to argue it should not be there, I am thinking of who I would put there, and I do not see.

So far I would have added Chavez Sr, but I see in a comment you will take care of him in the small guys.

Truly impressive. Makes me want to look at the names I don't know!

I am not sure as to Chavez's best weight but of course he did enough to deserve it. thanks for your nice words, I have been following boxing history for about 20 years at least. I did have a few names I am still tempted to include in my two lists so far but not sure I could add anyone that could be a contender for the Top 100........ Griffo and Les Darcy and Peter Jackson are certainties to be in my top 100, Griffo will rank very high, indeed it will shock many but here is the rub when it comes to McGoorty.... mcGoorty pays great respect to old time experts, especially the fighter opinions of who they think were great and the trainers like Ray Arcel... so much so that I value their opinions higher than our revered posters here. Si keeping this in mind McGoorty wants opinions that are fair, I do understand we have many here who have very solid opinions but so do I...... I have been accused of being too big a fan of Darcy here but I can back up all my words on him with facts and I think he is not ever rated as high as he deserves but we all have our favourites, I know many here will wanna roast me if I dare to not have Duran or a Greb in my top ten or to rate Hagler a bit overrated.... BUT McGOORTY DOES DARE...... as for say.... hagler, I love watching him fight but sadly his resume is not as good as some others so I have a few names above him at Middleweight but hey... it is maybe the deepest division of them all.

You may not know this but 95 per cent or so of the names in those two lists were straight off the top of my head so I still have to look a bit deeper....... maybe a guy like Chuck Davey deserves to be on the list but if not he still deserves a mention...... <<<< and there it is... LOL........ oh yeah,,, BTW, in your opinion should I have included Aaron Pryor ?... i don't know that much about him except that he was a goer.

[soul_survivor]

It's quite good, at least one notable omission but i commented on that thread and you may not have heard of them so you can be forgiven, one of my major jobs is to get these two names back to their rightful place. Young Griffo was a giant of the sport around the turn of the 20th century, fastest and best defensive guy the ever has been and a gobsmacking record/resume

I've heard of Young Griffo (not sure what your comment was but I think I normally try to avoid ranking guys from the turn of the century, unless there is a lot on them and at the very least, a handful of fight clips). Griffo retired pretty much in the early 1900s if I'm not mistaken and I just can't justify him as a top 50 ATG.

Top 200, I can see it maybe, but going through and making a list like that is something I cant do right now lol That would require years of research and reading. I just can't name him above any of the 50 legends I have.

Btw, who's the second name?

[McGoorty]

I've heard of Young Griffo (not sure what your comment was but I think I normally try to avoid ranking guys from the turn of the century, unless there is a lot on them and at the very least, a handful of fight clips). Griffo retired pretty much in the early 1900s if I'm not mistaken and I just can't justify him as a top 50 ATG.

Top 200, I can see it maybe, but going through and making a list like that is something I cant do right now lol That would require years of research and reading. I just can't name him above any of the 50 legends I have.

Btw, who's the second name?

The second name is Les Darcy and there is film of some of his stellar short career. Griffo does deserve to be ranker in top 50, his career is stunning and being maybe the best fighter of that entire era (if not he is very close) does make him hard to overlook. In that era so many fights ended as draws if there was no KO and nearly every fight he had his opponents could only try to survive. Joe Gans makes nearly everyone's top 50 lists and therefore Griffo deserves the same, Gans got away with two draws against Griffo but they were hardly draws as Griffo schooled gans. Griffo schooled nearly everybody. He is regarded by many experts from that era as the greatest boxer, Benny Leonard and Gans and many more said so, Griffo was so good they could simply not land a punch on him. Now he was undefeated in his first 167 fights, in his 168th he was robbed in a terrible rort against the great Jack McAuliffe in a fight Griffo was easily the rightful winner. That is incredible to be undefeated over such a span, he also has the resume, so many great fighters he totally embarrassed in the ring. George Dixon three times, Gans three times, Frank Erne, Torpedo Billy Murphy several times, George Kid Lavigne twice, Jack McAuliffe, Pedlar Palmer, Solly Smith, Ike Weir, Jack Everhart, Tom Tracey, Young Peter Jackson and Honey Melody... that is some resume, more ATG's and greats than most fighters ever, yes Young Griffo is surely top 50. The thing about not putting guys like these into consideration is that ir makes a list not "all time' but a limited one like saying "from the 20's onwards oe the 50's onwards"/ I don't include the pre gloved era guys as that was a different sport.

[McGoorty]

The Little Blokes

The Little Blokes

[LEFT]Young Griffo
Terrible Terry McGovern
Jimmy Wilde
George Dixon
Sandy Saddler
Kid Chocolate
Pancho Villa
Willie Pep
Hiroshi Kobayashi
Benny Bass
Azumah Nelson
Manny Paquiao
Flash Elorde
Abe Attell
Vicente Saldivar
Salvadore Sanchez
Johnny Famechon
Battling Battalino
Sugar Ramos
Ruben Olivares
Jim Driscoll
Johnny Kilbane
Eder Jofre
Eusebio Pedroza
Jeff Fenech
Barry McGuigan
"The Scotch Wop" Johnny Dundee
Kid Kaplan
Baby Arizmendi
Jose Legra
Daniel Zaragoza
Tracey Harris Patterson
Wilfredo Gomez
Wilfredo Vasquez[LEFT]

Marco Antonio Barrera
Erik Morales
Manuel Ortiz
Fighting Harada
Jimmy Carruthers
Lionel Rose
Carlos Zarate
Sixto Escobar
Kid Williams
Jeff Chandler
Pete Herman
Joe Lynch
Benny Lynch
Lupe Pintor
Panama Al Brown
Pone Kingpetch
Vic Darchinyan
Peter Kane
Midget Wolgast
Khaosai Galaxy
Fidel LaBarba
Pascual Perez

[McGoorty]

That I think is 174 fighters and maybe there are a few more names to go, the flyweights and Bantams are tough to rate, obviously there are some names that are so bright they pick themselves, now I will have to go through and place them into their best weight divisions.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

That I think is 174 fighters and maybe there are a few more names to go, the flyweights and Bantams are tough to rate, obviously there are some names that are so bright they pick themselves, now I will have to go through and place them into their best weight divisions.

You have left off Juan manual marquez, and if darchiyan is on the list, then doņaire has to be on it..

Also some possible borderline guys
Tito trinidad
Donald curry
Wilfredo benitez

[McGoorty]

You have left off Juan manual marquez, and if darchiyan is on the list, then doņaire has to be on it..

Also some possible borderline guys
Tito trinidad
Donald curry
Wilfredo benitez

I thought they were still both active fighters, if they are retired they are automatic choices

[Sugar Adam Ali]

I thought they were still both active fighters, if they are retired they are automatic choices

I'm sorry, forgot it was only retired fighters...but you do have manny on the list who is still active

[McGoorty]

I'm sorry, forgot it was only retired fighters...but you do have manny on the list who is still active

yeah but Manny is a done dinner, we all know that, I put him up cos I don't wanna get lynched.. lol