Do you believe in trickle down economics?

[billeau2]

1bad already pointed out to you the harm that was done by very high taxes on luxury goods.

So give examples of the consumption you would tax and a what rates.

1bad pointed out an answer to question I posed about specifically luxury goods, but the question was not about a tax on consumption as a general rule replacing conventional taxes.

The second part of your post my dear friend Siablo is ridiculous.

[siablo14]

1bad pointed out an answer to question I posed about specifically luxury goods, but the question was not about a tax on consumption as a general rule replacing conventional taxes.

The second part of your post my dear friend Siablo is ridiculous.

How is it ridiculous?

You know consumption is already taxed.
So i am interested in the changes you want to make to it.

[1bad65]

Isnt that kind of what a tax on consumption is? Income that is disposable is income that is not needed, to be spent. I know that technically someone can save disposable income...Just saying if you think about it...

Only a miserable person would say another person owes his entertainment dollars to the government.

Yeah, let's all work just for the bare necessities so leeches can like him can exist.


Seriously, you're spinning your wheels with him. He's here to score Gotcha! points and win battle of attrition. Nothing else.

I'd ask you place him on ignore if we continue to talk in this thread.

It annoys me when he plays his stupid, pointless games with someone I'm trying to have an adult discussion with.

[1bad65]

1bad pointed out an answer to question I posed about specifically luxury goods, but the question was not about a tax on consumption as a general rule replacing conventional taxes.

The second part of your post my dear friend Siablo is ridiculous.

He proves my points about him without me even asking.

He cant help himself.

Gotta get that last word (even if its nonsense), or twist your posts up to you agreeing with him.


The Ignore button calls...

[1bad65]

LOl on the bolded.

I think as a proposal it has to be worked out and not simply used as another way to tax the rich. Something like Steve Forbes proposes, with an understanding of what revenue would be brought in and what affects it would have on the economy.

I remember watching a news report back then (when they did real news).

They were showing how yacht sales had slowed since the Luxury Tax was implemented.

Then they interviewed a small businessman who owned a owned a company that made outbound motors for yachts.

He was explaining how his income was down, and he'd laid off several production workers since orders were down.

The next small businessman they interviewed owned a company that made hulls for the yachts. He was closing shop after he finished the few hulls he had currently in production.

The report also showed how electricians who wired up the yachts had lost jobs, how wood workers, plumbers, and other blue-collar jobs that relied on yacht manufacturing and assembly were lost as a result of lessened yacht demand by the rich people.

Again, it was such a failure Bill Clinton (and the Congress that had just recently passed the Luxury Tax legislation) went and repealed.

The tax was exactly what the superfans (including the base troll here currently rattling off talking points) want now.

It hit those dastardly rich guys guys by taxing the toys they didn't deserve. Plus it would generate all kinds if new revenue.

It sounded so good. But failed so quickly and epically.

And here you have idiots telling us how those same policies would work if we just tried them.

Stupid, stupid, stupid.

[billeau2]

I remember watching a news report back then (when they did real news).

They were showing how yacht sales had slowed since the Luxury Tax was implemented.

Then they interviewed a small businessman who owned a owned a company that made outbound motors for yachts.

He was explaining how his income was down, and he'd laid off several production workers since orders were down.

The next small businessman they interviewed owned a company that made hulls for the yachts. He was closing shop after he finished the few hulls he had currently in production.

The report also showed how electricians who wired up the yachts had lost jobs, how wood workers, plumbers, and other blue-collar jobs that relied on yacht manufacturing and assembly were lost as a result of lessened yacht demand by the rich people.

Again, it was such a failure Bill Clinton (and the Congress that had just recently passed the Luxury Tax legislation) went and repealed.

The tax was exactly what the superfans (including the base troll here currently rattling off talking points) want now.

It hit those dastardly rich guys guys by taxing the toys they didn't deserve. Plus it would generate all kinds if new revenue.

It sounded so good. But failed so quickly and epically.

And here you have idiots telling us how those same policies would work if we just tried them.

Stupid, stupid, stupid.

How about that? Turns out the things those rich guys use...are made and manufactured by... less than rich peoples!!

That is why these things have to be worked out. If we tax consumption it should be done with proper understanding and not half @33ed. If it turns out that the projections can show this would be a better alternative, and that is a big if.

I am willing to look at ideas that ultimately allow people to keep more of what they earn and to do what they choose to do with. The problem is when people create biases and make assumptions. What you state, your example, is an example of this problem.

I would also add: people often do not know how certain sectors function. So for example, if we were to hypertax precious metals, because they are percieved as luxury goods...well those mining sectors are already cyclical in nature. They are fragile in this manner, it takes a fortune to reopen a mine, staff it, and meet demand. Like you said about the production line for yachts, the whole industry in Northern Nevada could fall down, then it would be cows and Burning man lol!

Its just good to be thorough and look at precident, that is a great example you gave.

[billeau2]

How is it ridiculous?

You know consumption is already taxed.
So i am interested in the changes you want to make to it.

You asked for the type of numbers that someone who got paid a lot of money, or had a lot of money and a foundation to support him would produce...Like Steve Forbes. Why don't you read his understanding? I left you a link.

I also explained that I liked the idea of a consumption tax because it could potentially be a way to tax with total fairness...and IF you read the information projections have been done to show we would have plenty of revenue...

I also checked my own self and said, there were problems with this idea, Among them: what constitutes "luxury items." I mentioned this because under some theories these items would be taxed much more and this could be a problem.

Then you did something that probably upset IBad, won't speak for him just trying to answer your question...You made it appear he was checking me when he was responding and dovetailing on this idea...The post was done in the spirit of cooperation/conversation in that he came fourth with a great example of how this taxing of these goods was problematic.

Read up on Steve Forbes understanding, I don't endorse him with no caveats, but he has some good ideas and he has the economists, to crunch the numbers and the intelligence to produce an intriguing prospect.

Peace.

[siablo14]

You asked for the type of numbers that someone who got paid a lot of money, or had a lot of money and a foundation to support him would produce...Like Steve Forbes. Why don't you read his understanding? I left you a link.

I also explained that I liked the idea of a consumption tax because it could potentially be a way to tax with total fairness...and IF you read the information projections have been done to show we would have plenty of revenue...

I also checked my own self and said, there were problems with this idea, Among them: what constitutes "luxury items." I mentioned this because under some theories these items would be taxed much more and this could be a problem.

Then you did something that probably upset IBad, won't speak for him just trying to answer your question...You made it appear he was checking me when he was responding and dovetailing on this idea...The post was done in the spirit of cooperation/conversation in that he came fourth with a great example of how this taxing of these goods was problematic.

Read up on Steve Forbes understanding, I don't endorse him with no caveats, but he has some good ideas and he has the economists, to crunch the numbers and the intelligence to produce an intriguing prospect.

Peace.

Steve's article is only 4 paragraphs with no detailed breakdown. All he says is drop flat tax to 17%. i don't how much he says he will increase consumption tax by.

[billeau2]

Steve's article is only 4 paragraphs with no detailed breakdown. All he says is drop flat tax to 17%. i don't how much he says he will increase consumption tax by.

These two describe a flat tax and one rate, to simplify.


1) http://lobby.la.psu.edu/080_Internet...ATR/Forbes.htm

2)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevefo.../#72a7d7517e0e

This document gets into consumption tax issues specifically. Forbes plan has a simplified tax code, and consumption tax changes and while the above deal more with the flat tax this describes consumption tax changes if you read carefully. Look for "national sales tax."

https://www.ontheissues.org/Celeb/St...Tax_Reform.htm

[siablo14]

These two describe a flat tax and one rate, to simplify.


1) http://lobby.la.psu.edu/080_Internet...ATR/Forbes.htm

2)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevefo.../#72a7d7517e0e

This document gets into consumption tax issues specifically. Forbes plan has a simplified tax code, and consumption tax changes and while the above deal more with the flat tax this describes consumption tax changes if you read carefully. Look for "national sales tax."

https://www.ontheissues.org/Celeb/St...Tax_Reform.htm

i got the flat tax part- drop it to 17%.

i looking for how much will the various consumption taxes be raised to.