Mass shooting at gay club in Orlando, Florida

[Zaroku]

Dont think this has been posted. At 2:30 guy admits to holding a door closed. What a dumb phaggot

https://youtu.be/TGanSh93P68

That selfish phaggot caused additional lives to be lost.

Thanks for the video.

[The Big Dunn]

Was glad to seer President Obama point out that saying the words radical muslim terror doesn't do anything. They aren't magic words that suddenly make everything go away.

It's interesting to see so many posters focus on the fact he said he was an ISIS supporter on the 911 call while ignoring the other facts that show he clearly wasn't a "true" ISIS supporter.

I also think the FBI's decision to stop following him was interesting. I wonder if it was just about resources or they saw him hanging out at the gay clubs and just figured if he was gay that he wasn't likely to commit an act of terror.

I think this case is the exact reason why we need to ban assault weapons. Mateen clearly shouldn't have been allowed to buy a weapon given what we've read about his violent temper and the fact the FBI was watching him. However, he was (outside of his 1st wife's DV claims) a law abiding citizen that passed every background check.

[The Big Dunn]

The onus to prove an assertion falls upon the person making it. The concept is called the Philosophic Burden of Proof.

Prove or retract....



Conjecture is conjecture. You tried to tell us what went on in the minds of men dead for hundreds of years. If that's not conjecture, what is??



And I don't see the words "TV", "radio", or "Internet", so for the THIRD time (at least) I ask, does that mean the Government can ban those things?

Telling you're ducking that one. I've asked it to many people who made your same argument. Not one has touched it yet....



I'm not. you are.



Correct. You're ducking my questions and refusing to source your claims. When (or better yet, if) you do, the debate will move forward again.

I answered your question. If you can't understand the answer or do not like it, I can't do anything about that. Asking for a source to feign ignorance is what is slowing the conversation down.

Following our many discussions I have a good sense of who you are and what you believe. We just have a different perspective of what America is and what it should be.

Hopefully, if the polls are correct and stay the way they are, the America I want will come to fruition.

[BostonGuy]

Was glad to seer President Obama point out that saying the words radical muslim terror doesn't do anything. They aren't magic words that suddenly make everything go away.

It's interesting to see so many posters focus on the fact he said he was an ISIS supporter on the 911 call while ignoring the other facts that show he clearly wasn't a "true" ISIS supporter.

I also think the FBI's decision to stop following him was interesting. I wonder if it was just about resources or they saw him hanging out at the gay clubs and just figured if he was gay that he wasn't likely to commit an act of terror.

I think this case is the exact reason why we need to ban assault weapons. Mateen clearly shouldn't have been allowed to buy a weapon given what we've read about his violent temper and the fact the FBI was watching him. However, he was (outside of his 1st wife's DV claims) a law abiding citizen that passed every background check.

At a minimum, the FBI should have been alerted to Mateen's gun purchases. We need sensible common sense gun laws that aid law enforcement and help prevent the 'bad guys' from obtaining arms.

[The Big Dunn]

At a minimum, the FBI should have been alerted to Mateen's gun purchases. We need sensible common sense gun laws that aid law enforcement and help prevent the 'bad guys' from obtaining arms.

That feels problematic to me. I'd rather you not have them available for purchase then allow someone's purchasing history to be legally monitored by the government.

Now that America seems out of the "ground war" business, the gun manufacturers have thousands of weapons that will go unused if not sold to the public. I would hope we stop production of them and destroy the surplus we have, but that isn't going to happen.

I think the most sensible way to address the issue while protecting the 2nd amendment rights of all Americans is to not make guns that were initially manufactured for the military to be sold for purchase by regular Americans.

Society can't really stop the Roof's, Lanza's, Mateen's and Cho's from deciding to kill. What we can do is limit their ability to kill so many. restricting access to military style weapons may not have saved everyone, but in each case it would have reduced the amount of times each could shoot before reloading, which surely would have reduced the body count.

[Eff Pandas]

We need sensible common sense gun laws that aid law enforcement and help prevent the 'bad guys' from obtaining arms.

I think religious beliefs should be one of the questions on forms for gun permits and gun purchases. I contend anyone with magical beliefs should be deemed ”a little crazy" at very least and along with other borderline issues should be enough to keep a gun out of your hands legally. I think that minor charge would do a solid job at lowering mass killings in the US.

Not sure how easy or hard it is to confirm someone is part of a religion, but it seems like this inform comes out quick when there is an incident like this one so I can't imagine it's that hard to figure out.

I'd probably even go further if I was President Eff Pandas and not allow guns to anyone who believed in any magical entity type religion as I feel like that's proof of them suffering from a mental illness that still allows them to be a functional member of society most of the time.

[The Big Dunn]

I think religious beliefs should be one of the questions on forms for gun permits and gun purchases. I contend anyone with magical beliefs should be deemed ”a little crazy" at very least and along with other borderline issues should be enough to keep a gun out of your hands legally. I think that minor charge would do a solid job at lowering mass killings in the US.

Not sure how easy or hard it is to confirm someone is part of a religion, but it seems like this inform comes out quick when there is an incident like this one so I can't imagine it's that hard to figure out.

I'd probably even go further if I was President Eff Pandas and not allow guns to anyone who believed in any magical entity type religion as I feel like that's proof of them suffering from a mental illness that still allows them to be a functional member of society most of the time.

EFF P you can't do that because we are allowed to believe in whatever religion we want. One could argue anyone that believes in a God has "magical" beliefs. that would kind of limit guns to atheists.

[1bad65]

Just like the PP shooter happened to be Christian, except that we don't have any current Christian militant groups to blame.

As I showed, that attack was called terrorism. Not sure why you keep bringing up considering that.

Plus, you didn't address my point that radical islam played a huge role...

The next 2 being proper human beings with balls to call it what it was, except no other major publications called it such. That doesn't make it an establishment stance.

You said "it wasn't called a terrorist attack". I cited 3 incidents, including the Mayor of the city it happened in, calling it just that.

You were wrong. Accept it and move on. It wont kill you admit you were wrong once in awhile.

LOL @ your shots though - cries when fired at you, not afraid to fire them out. It seems like there I've already explained that radical Islam is a problem, however when crazy people try to use it as a justification for their actions where there are more underlying problems, yeah, I'm going to take everything into account. Unlike other people. If you're delusional enough to think that his self hate for his sexuality played no role whatsoever, that it was purely Islam, sorry bro. Agree to disagree. I'm done here.

Lots of strawmen there.

I'm still waiting for the full story before I make the call if his sexuality played a role. I've not said it played no role whatsoever. But based on what we know, radical islam did without a doubt.

[1bad65]

Asking for a source to feign ignorance is what is slowing the conversation down.

No, it is not slowing it down. Again, it's Debate 101.

What's slowing it down is your obfuscating. Like I said, you must have seen it somewhere, unless you made it up. Just point me to where you saw it. You can, unless you made it up.

Following our many discussions I have a good sense of who you are and what you believe. We just have a different perspective of what America is and what it should be.

Fair enough, but just dont make assumptions. If you're unsure, ask.

Hopefully, if the polls are correct and stay the way they are, the America I want will come to fruition.

Well if we elect enough socialists, we will end up like Venezuela. That's hardly an example of 'coming to fruition', unless massive crime, inflation, and food and toilet paper shortages are your definition of 'coming to fruition'.

[The Big Dunn]

No, it is not slowing it down. Again, it's Debate 101.

What's slowing it down is your obfuscating. Like I said, you must have seen it somewhere, unless you made it up. Just point me to where you saw it. You can, unless you made it up.



Fair enough, but just dont make assumptions. If you're unsure, ask.



Well if we elect enough socialists, we will end up like Venezuela. That's hardly an example of 'coming to fruition', unless massive crime, inflation, and food and toilet paper shortages are your definition of 'coming to fruition'.

I make no assumptions. Your words are enough for me to form an opinion.

That's ridiculous. It is utterly preposterous to be afraid the US would become Venezuela. There is no evidence to suggest this could possibly happen.