The Case For A Creator Documentary

[squealpiggy]

Lets see if I can have a conversation with you, where you don't mock the ever living **** out of the person you're debating with.


I can jump back and forth between sides, as both sides seemingly make some sense, and no sense.


Here's something that always interested me from a creation standpoint.


The ozone layer.


Seemingly the main point of it is what?... protection.


The entire idea of its sole purpose, seems like something that was "put there".


Is it impossible for you to see that side?

I'm reading Michael Shermer's "the believing brain" and one of the interesting things he points out is an almost universal tendency to see agency in things. That is to say there is a tendency to ask what things are "for", even when they very obviously have no intrinsic purpose. A child might say that a flat rock is "for" skipping it over the lake or that a long stick is "for" a dog to chase or that a cow is "for" milk.

So you say that the ozone layer is "for" protection, when in reality it isn't actually "for" anything, it's a consequence of light energy from the sun striking the O2 molecules in our highly oxygenated atmosphere and causing it to react to form O3 molecules. The same chemical process takes place with lightning strikes, you can smell the ozone after a thunderstorm.

[jkaisen41]

Not to be arrogant.

But, I believe I have the best answer that can possibly be given for either creationism or life by random chain of events.

That answer is.

I don't know.

No... you aren't ignorant *lol*

Well you know this is an important question - and you can never think about something like that long enough...

With you I have the feeling that you one day actually will find something... I think your on your way because you asking good questions... you can tell a lot about human beings if you look at their questions - I think you are on a good way

[jkaisen41]

I don't think it makes sense to believe in Gods - that are described through storytelling. It's a man-made word, to give a All-Powerful Creator of the Universe, a personality with Human characteristics. It's the same with imagining what Aliens would look like. Most of the time, they resemble us in many ways.

However, I understand the impulse to believe in more then just what's in front of you (I.E.The Big Bang did it). It requires a leap in the process. It's just a shame that it's expressed through fairy tales that only cover things that were within a 5 mile radius of the people who wrote it. Self-centered tales that focus on this Planet as if it were THE WORLD, the only world, and that the Sky & Sun was that place you go to when you die, and your spirit floats up. Tales of a Authoritarian power that requires us to be worshiping slaves, if we wanna live on, after death. When all of us would be better off if people just passed on the Holy Books and just used their imagination on the possibilities in The Universe that we do know exists, outside of our little Planet.

Since I believe in GOD I actually feel free - something I never did before

I don't understand that at all - even if you think that they are just fairy tailes I can't see how the world should be better without the examples of Jesus, Abraham and and and and... if you believe they existed or not - but what they have done what is told in ''fairy tales'' I feel is worth to be as well - aspire to be like that as well... I don't know why the world should be better off without ''role models'' like that

[jkaisen41]

There is a difference though. BBT is based on scientific observations, religion is just a leap of faith. A leap which was established thousands of years ago and has not and will not allow itself to change, no matter how much more we learn

Religion thrives and, dare I say it, encourages ignorance.

No need to look for answers because God IS the answer.

I still don't unerstand Mr. Thread-Killer why science is seeing as something opposite to GOD - everything that science proves and will proof doesn't stand in difference to GOD... no at all - even if a BIG BANG created this all what we know does that prove anything wrong what GOD said...

Of course you can call it ignorance - many ppl call it believing in GOD is like making a decision to believe in the good of yourselve - yin and yang and stuff like that - but nothing that science says or will prove will stand or prove anything wrong what GOD not already has said - of course there are a few things that you can speculate on or that are hard to understand but science is no difference at all...

What science believes yesterday will be proven wrong by science the next day - either wrong or they add new things to it and have another perspective on things with their new found knowledge - so science is something that is great and helps us in a lot of ways but it still doesn't change the fact that science changes all the time because they learn and FIND new stuff... again... they FIND new stuff and that brings us back to the beginning that every human being tries to find something in this world.

If you are happy in your life with science then that's ok - I don't knock you - Cup - Squeal or anyone for it - and I agree to a degree you can't win an argument with a believer because he is ignorant in that aspect that GOD knows it all and created it all - that's right - but I think as long ppl don't use GOD as a tool for war or enslaving ppl or oppressing ppl... I don't know why anyone should have a problem with someone who believes in GOD - I personally never found more peaceful and lovely human beings then GOD obeying human beings... it's just my experience and I have worked in a lot of different work fields etc.

So I guess everybody has his opinion... as long as we appreciate life and being happy with what we do nobody has to regret whatever happens after life or?

[Xercen]

Since I believe in GOD I actually feel free - something I never did before

I don't understand that at all - even if you think that they are just fairy tailes I can't see how the world should be better without the examples of Jesus, Abraham and and and and... if you believe they existed or not - but what they have done what is told in ''fairy tales'' I feel is worth to be as well - aspire to be like that as well... I don't know why the world should be better off without ''role models'' like that

Believing in a religion is not necessarily a bad thing. Having faith can improve your life in many ways psychologically.

Believing in a religion is like a person taking a placebo from a nutritionist, or medicine from a doctor; in which the doctor/nutritionist has stated that the placebo is actually multivitamin pills or some type of curative medicine.

Having a religion can make your life better, but that doesn't mean you should casually dismiss the views of those who don't believe in a god.

Atheists can lead happy fulfilled lives without religion. If you want to believe in a religion and that god was a white man in white robes who apparantly rules over all races, then that's fine. Just don't expect everybody to think the same.

Atheists only speak the truth when they say there is no evidence of a god, which is very true. Religious people seem to have no evidence to speak of, and only say things like science hasn't proved that god cannot exist so therefore god must exist - which doesn't make sense.

One thing i don't understand is why vatican city is so damn rich. Why not spend some of that money on africa or other places in need! It's funny how the church is so materialistic.

[jkaisen41]

Believing in a religion is not necessarily a bad thing. Having faith can improve your life in many ways psychologically.

Believing in a religion is like a person taking a placebo from a nutritionist, or medicine from a doctor; in which the doctor/nutritionist has stated that the placebo is actually multivitamin pills or some type of curative medicine.

Having a religion can make your life better, but that doesn't mean you should casually dismiss the views of those who don't believe in a god. Atheists can lead happy fulfilled lives without religion. If you want to believe in a religion and that god was a white man in white robes who apparantly rules over all races, then that's fine. Just don't expect everybody to think the same.

Atheists only speak the truth when they say there is no evidence of a god, which is very true. Religious people seem to have no evidence to speak of, and only say things like science hasn't proved that god cannot exist so therefore god must exist - which doesn't make sense.

You must have misunderstood me - I never judge anyone after that - that's not up to me - even if there are signs that somebody is a Atheist to 99% I'm still not allowed to judge - only GOD does - I have to be respectfully to everyone - I through myselve have to be a good example - a good example of why GOD exist - so it's not up to me to judge anyone... and you absolutely right - if you are happy with your life the way it is all kudos to yourselve...

No I never said that - GOD isn't anything like that - we always want to think he looks like this or like that - but GOD doesn't have an appearance - he isn't white or anything... the only thing that is said that he created the human being after something like himselve - but it has never been said how GOD looks.

Why isn't there any proof of GOD? Because nobody has ever seen him? You ain't and will never see your soul as well but does that prove we ain't have a soul or what we call a soul? Again... I'm not knocking anyone or anything - I'm just saying that science isn't complete - it's like winning 8 rounds out if 12 - and now you are in the ninth - of course it seems like you winning but one right hand on the jaw and all of the sudden the result is different - it's the same with science - science always changes - not saying that it is false - but if you don't know everything how can you think you know the truth - and even after you found something out to be true it is only true until you find the next new stuff.

I really never said that - again - I'm just saying that with everything that science has proven it has never be proven that GOD or anything he said it is wrong - it only proves that everything GOD says it's true - science isn't an enemy from GOD whatsoever - I don't know who believes in something like that - GOD wants us to study - to be knowledgable - science doesn't stand in any negative or against GOD whatsoever - there are also enough scientists even though they can't prove it believe in GOD as well... so the one thing doesn't count out the other... I hope I have explained this now better :-)))))))))))))))))))))

[jkaisen41]

One thing i don't understand is why vatican city is so damn rich. Why not spend some of that money on africa or other places in need! It's funny how the church is so materialistic.

There you asking the wrong one dude :-) I'm not a christian - I'm sorry you have to ask somebody else about vatican...

But in general I want to say and there is a saying in Germany that goes like this: Do what the Preacher preaches - but don't do what the preacher does (in real life) :-) you can't fault GOD for human beings who do wrong... that has nothing to do with religion... it's like calling out a rapist for being an atheist or something - the atheists aren't the ones to blame for this rapist - human beings hurt human beings - human beings oppress human beings - human beings murder, rape and and and human beings... that has nothing to do with religion...

[cupocity303]

Since I believe in GOD I actually feel free - something I never did before

I don't understand that at all - even if you think that they are just fairy tailes I can't see how the world should be better without the examples of Jesus, Abraham and and and and... if you believe they existed or not - but what they have done what is told in ''fairy tales'' I feel is worth to be as well - aspire to be like that as well... I don't know why the world should be better off without ''role models'' like that

I don't need the teachings of Jesus, or the 10 commandment's to tell me, not to kill, not to rape. The fact that you have to have these written down for you to follow, when it should be natural, internal within you, is absurd.

Violent Prisoners often turn to Holybook's, while in the joint. That's fine, if it helps them become better people, and not a menace to society. However I'm doing just fine without the fairy tales, never been to prison, therefore no need for long, boring ass chapters on what I should or shouldn't be doing.

Whatever floats your boat, I guess.

[cupocity303]

even if a BIG BANG created this all what we know does that prove anything wrong what GOD said...

im just saying that with everything that science has proven it has never be proven that GOD or anything he said it is wrong

Said what? What are you talking about? There is no proof of a God, yet alone anything that you think God has said.

It's not up to Science to prove anything wrong that you THINK GOD SAID. It's up to you to prove it right.

Just stop, you're not helping your case.

[squealpiggy]

even if a BIG BANG created this all what we know does that prove anything wrong what GOD said...

It depends on how esoteric you want to make your definition of god. If your god is vaguely defined enough then sure, there's no clash between the possibility of god and the observations of science. But it quickly becomes a very pointless sort of god as the gaps close up and disappear.