Tyson Fury #1 HW on Boxrec, #2 p4p

[deathofaclown]

What Usyk done at HW to be rated 4??

Nothing but the points carry over from the previous division. That’s why their system never really works.

Same reason Gilberto Ramirez is ranked highly on LHW on their site when he’s had one easy fight there

Kell Brook is ranked at 3 at LMW despite never having a notable fight there

[Marchegiano]

They're updated every day, man, what they've done is rejigged their algorithms... again - I think this is about the 4th time in as many years, which is becoming kinda frustrating.

I think the idea is they're trying to make it a more accurate predictor of future outcomes and - as best I understand it - are now retroactively changing the points value of wins dependent on the subsequent performances of the loser... say you'd initially got 100 points for breating a dude but then he goes on to get KOd in his next 3 fights then that hundred might have been downgraded to 30 by the time he loses his 3rd fight.

Honestly has me scratching my head a little, though i understand the logic, but since I tend to use 'em mainly for comparative puposes anyway - usually just to get a rough and ready idea of the level of guys outside the top 20 or 30 then I'm sure I'll learn to adapt to the new system.

Although they can get things loosely right sometimes, or at least in the general region of what most folk think is right, Boxrec has significant drawbacks as a ranking system, and is particularly poor for P4P for a variety of practical reasons, although it at least eliminates many of the cognitive biases that plague other systems.

Thanks bud.

Unless this doesn't effect the inactive they ****ed up.

I have no issue with Tyson, that's fine, but I checked the ATG listing and man whatever they did to change stuff is ****ed.

I love Ezzard Charles, he's not the p4p goat though....****.

Charles
Moore
SRR
Louis
Greb
B-Hop
May
Armstrong
Conn


That's some p4p list that.

As a Marciano fan i'm like....cool...but as a fan it's pretty silly.

[Citizen Koba]

I remember their algorithm once had Eubank Jr ahead of Chocolatito when Chocolatito was coming off a loss

So yeah, their rankings can be skewed because there’s no rational thinking, it’s just an algorithm

That said, Fury is rightly the number 1 heavyweight by a mile and one of the best p4p.

I really wouldn’t use their rankings as anything more than a rough estimate of where fighters are in the division, give or take quite a few positions

This ^ Pretty much.

[Citizen Koba]

Thanks bud.

Unless this doesn't effect the inactive they ****ed up.

I have no issue with Tyson, that's fine, but I checked the ATG listing and man whatever they did to change stuff is ****ed.

I love Ezzard Charles, he's not the p4p goat though....****.

Charles
Moore
SRR
Louis
Greb
B-Hop
May
Armstrong
Conn


That's some p4p list that.

As a Marciano fan i'm like....cool...but as a fan it's pretty silly.

No problem, man, I like to just keep an eye on what they do over at Boxrec cos that damn thing's an absolute godsend to Boxing fans and scholars, but to use it effectively you need to at least have a bit of an understanding of the systems they use and the inherent limitations that are part of 'em.

Like I say Boxrecs an absolutely fantasitic and almost indispensible resourse in the interenet age, but as a ranking system it's far from perfect, especially when it comes to P4P. If I was more inclined in the direction of constructing a P4P / ATG ranking system I'd be thinking of some kinda of hybrid system which combined the best of both worlds, giving some weight to a consistent algorithm based approach and some to more traditional subjective lists.

[UNBANNED]

It's absolutely got it's place as a reference and gets more criticism that it should to be honest, but it's incapable of adapting to circumstances like blatantly bad scorecards which human - subjective based - systems can. Furthermore it's heavily skewed against the lighter divisions largely cos there's fewer fighters there and more mobility between divisions, but other other reasons too which I'll go into if you like.


Anyways, ain't gonna fault you if you like the Boxrec rankings or use 'em, there's no reason why you shouldn't and at least they ain't got the inherent biases of subjective systems, which generally massively skew in favour of those fighters who have been on US screens the most (a factor which I describe as 'exposure bias').

Myself I simply choose not to do P4P altogether, I understand it's a fun discussion to have but I just regard it is a bit of fantasy nonsense... for sure rank within divisions but his idea that somehow you can objectively compare guys of vastly different weights who can never fight each other or have common opponents makes no sense to me.

Great points. Hopefully Boxrec can create a system which considers bad scorecards and evaluates how dominant or competitive fights are.

Retroactive scoring is good though for the reason mentioned, but all of your points are good too