Why do some forget that GGG accepted the Ward fight in 2013?

[Curt Henning]

This is why you are ranked as one of the top worst posters of the year/decade on various polls. Stay deep in the red clown. You earned it by posting nonsense like this.

Facts are facts...Ward called out Floyd at 160...didn't offer to go to 160 for GGG. Nothing you say can change those facts.

i dont feel bad at all about my rep here...i post the truth..i expose peoples heroes....thats why im not well liked...and thats ok...none of you really matter

floyd said he would never fight at 160...its a moot point right then and there

golovkin said 168 for years and tried to make fights there...and tucked tail when ward came calling....thats the facts

[Boxing_1013]

1st fight Nelo edged it (wasn't mad with the draw)
2nd, GGG got that Mexican treatment that he begged for. 8-4

Man I just think the bar is so low for Canelo to get rounds lol...yeah I just don't see how anyone can get to 6 rounds for Nelo in either fight.

They were good fights and Canelo did a lot of good stuff...he just pretty clearly imo got outworked round in round out and lost 8-4 both times...punch stats don't tell everything obviously but they tell the story I saw...which was GGG was just too active almost every round for Nelo in those 2 fights.

[Boxing_1013]

You can’t keep it real with hearsay, that’s called assuming. You believe what GGG says, you don’t believe what ward says. That’s fine, but call a spade a spade. Don’t call others “fans” when you’re plainly picking sides.

Actually there is no report of what ward said because either no one asked him (because no reporter thought it important enough to ask in the several interviews he’s had on the topic), or the meeting could have been a farce.

Either way it’s nice to debate but i have ward as simply a higher pedigree fighter than ggg and their fantasy fight as just that.

I'm not a huge fan of Ward's style (or his persona outside the ring, as you are probably gathering)...but he was a really tough, smart fighter...I think he got away with a lot because he was always fighting at home...but he certainly could be a long day for anyone in there.

I say that to say that if someone wants to think Ward would have been too much for GGG...that is a fair comment...I think prime vs prime...well I don't really know how it would go in a neutral environment (meaning weight/venue/judges/ref etc were all 'fair'.)

As to why I don't really believe Ward about anything - how do you feel about these comments/this situation from Ward about Lucian Bute...I'll try to keep it concise...but after studying comments from GGG/Ward over the past 10 years or so, it is stuff like this that just makes me not believe a word Ward says...and honestly I'm not sure how anyone can.

Video at 1:00 says Ward wants Bute after Super Six tourney...or that winner (which was Ward) should face Bute after the tourney ends:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XO_H29ikNzs

This is no mixing of words here...it is clear what he is saying.

Now fastforward just 2 fights (7 months I think) later...Ward beats Abraham and Froch.

https://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/id/7372586/andre-ward-lucian-bute-bout-looks-unlikely-time-being

'Sadly, it doesn't seem like Bute or boxing fans will get the fight they want. Ward showed little interest in Bute at his postfight media conference after his masterpiece against Froch. Sure, Ward earned the right to do what he wants after such a tough road in the Super Six, but it's still disappointing to hear.

"To be perfectly honest, no disrespect to Bute and his team, but they've sat back and they've fought B-level and C-level guys and he did what he was supposed to do," said Ward, failing to grasp that Bute wasn't invited to the Super Six and had no A-level opponents available to him. "He stopped them and he's gotten them out of there. But he's just been sitting back, waiting, while we've been fighting for the past two and a half years against top-level competition.

"So I don't have to go to Lucian Bute right now," Ward said. Going up to light heavyweight for the right fight -- not to campaign up there, but for the right fight -- is an option. So we've just got to sit back and see what makes sense. I think I earned the right to pick the right fight for the right price."

I mention that last comment about going up to LHW for a reason btw...if Ward had said 'I'm willing to face any LHW in the world too'...I would have taken it the same way as GGG/his team's 154-168 comment...basically meaning, under the right conditions, if it makes sense for us (money, weight, venue etc) we would take the fight...I'm mentioning this to point out again that imho I am not 'picking on Ward' or 'giving GGG a pass'...I am just judging them from their own comments.

"That's a tremendous fight for Carl because I know Carl doesn't like Bute," Ward said. "To be perfectly honest, I think Bute has to beat somebody. I'm just gonna be frank with you: He has to beat somebody, an A-level guy, to get a shot. We'll sit back and talk as a team, but off the top of my head, he has to beat somebody. You can't sit back and just take your time while everyone else is working hard and you come in and get the same pay that everyone else gets. It don't work like that. This is a sport, but we also use our brains for business, and we'll sit down and make a solid business decision."

The last part there added in here to show that Ward has always been very conscious of his fight plan...he doesn't seem like he just says 'yes' to a fight right away...he has to really iron out every detail and be in control of basically everything before he fights someone.

GGG seems like he more or less deals fair with people...and knows his role when he is B side or the A side...Ward always thought he was the A-side (money-wise) when he often times wasn't.

And then Ward says this, a few months later, after Bute signed his fight with Froch:

"I was disappointed," Ward said. "Bute and his promoter were screaming and yelling that I was ducking them, then they go and make a two-fight deal with Froch where if he loses, he takes Froch back to Canada? I didn't understand that. I was never ducking him, I just wanted to build up the fight. I was coming off two years of grueling fights and I felt he needed to fight someone. But ducking him? Come on. He wants belts, I have three belts over here if he wants to fight for a belt."

https://www.badlefthook.com/2012/4/12/2943180/andre-ward-says-he-wanted-to-fight-lucian-bute-butes-team-disagrees

So yeah this is why I view Ward the way I do...and I view GGG more or less like most other fighters, who more or less do what they say.

Again, I don't see how any objective person could read that situation from Ward there and not just kind of roll your eyes...and there are other very similar situations like this from him...and I just don't see how anyone takes him seriously or believes him on anything.

Nothing personal against him...but yeah stuff like that is why I view him and his word the way I do.

[GhostofDempsey]

i dont feel bad at all about my rep here...i post the truth..i expose peoples heroes....thats why im not well liked...and thats ok...none of you really matter

floyd said he would never fight at 160...its a moot point right then and there

golovkin said 168 for years and tried to make fights there...and tucked tail when ward came calling....thats the facts

You are hung up on getting the last wrong word on every thread. A loser who thinks he is winning. The truth frightens little beta males like you. Hide behind your overrated heroes.

[TheUptownKid]

I'm not a huge fan of Ward's style...

"I was disappointed," Ward said. "Bute and his promoter were screaming and yelling that I was ducking them, then they go and make a two-fight deal with Froch where if he loses, he takes Froch back to Canada? I didn't understand that. I was never ducking him, I just wanted to build up the fight. I was coming off two years of grueling fights and I felt he needed to fight someone. But ducking him? Come on. He wants belts, I have three belts over here if he wants to fight for a belt."

https://www.badlefthook.com/2012/4/12/2943180/andre-ward-says-he-wanted-to-fight-lucian-bute-butes-team-disagrees

So yeah this is why I view Ward the way I do...and I view GGG more or less like most other fighters, who more or less do what they say.

Again, I don't see how any objective person could read that situation from Ward there and not just kind of roll your eyes...and there are other very similar situations like this from him...and I just don't see how anyone takes him seriously or believes him on anything.

Nothing personal against him...but yeah stuff like that is why I view him and his word the way I do.

I love boxing and I come on here to discuss so thanks. I really just try to keep the business/ promotional side separate from my being a fan.

In no other aspect of life do we obsess over others salaries, like we do with athletes. Contract talks which should be confidential have been leaked with consistency. Building up fights has changed as generations stateside have strayed away from boxing.

I say this to say GGG is a quality fighter with a definite legacy, Ward built himself the same way. Ward has the benefit of being from a place where he was celebrated and rewarded for his skill. Do you think if GGG could fight in Kazakhstan and get paid he wouldn’t?

In the end it’s hard to argue against a gold medal winning undefeated p4p great, in terms of the sport. GGG won several fights at mw and was a long reigning champ. I think that fight wasn’t worth the risk for GGG and that Ward was probably in a place where he would benefit more anyway. That’s the business side, but professionally I just think ward is a bigger longer better boxer with vastly better defense than GGG. Too many advantages on this side

[Boxing_1013]

I love boxing and I come on here to discuss so thanks. I really just try to keep the business/ promotional side separate from my being a fan.

In no other aspect of life do we obsess over others salaries, like we do with athletes. Contract talks which should be confidential have been leaked with consistency. Building up fights has changed as generations stateside have strayed away from boxing.

I say this to say GGG is a quality fighter with a definite legacy, Ward built himself the same way. Ward has the benefit of being from a place where he was celebrated and rewarded for his skill. Do you think if GGG could fight in Kazakhstan and get paid he wouldn’t?

In the end it’s hard to argue against a gold medal winning undefeated p4p great, in terms of the sport. GGG won several fights at mw and was a long reigning champ. I think that fight wasn’t worth the risk for GGG and that Ward was probably in a place where he would benefit more anyway. That’s the business side, but professionally I just think ward is a bigger longer better boxer with vastly better defense than GGG. Too many advantages on this side

Thanks for the reply...I have been wrong before and will be wrong again...but honestly I just never really saw top level skills from Ward against basically any quality fighter that he faced in the pros...besides Froch (which I scored 7-5 to Ward) I can't give him one clear/non-controversial win in my eyes...when I say top level skills, I mean clear separation and clear winning of at least some rounds...Floyd did this often, as did/do many other fighters imho depending on the fight.

I was not a huge Floyd fan...but he would have multiple rounds in big fights where I came away from the round saying 'OK, clear Floyd round'...same for me for GGG, Lara, Kovalev, Lomachenko, Spence, Crawford etc...I never really saw that for Ward in my eyes vs even Bika and Barrera and above...against Kessler I had him ahead but that fight ended controversially as we know unfortunately.

Again have nothing really against Ward...just try to call it like I see it...and certainly think he benefited from being the home fighter in his career...and tbh, I think he knew he needed that home cooking...and that is why we never saw him travel for what should have been big money fights for him in his career (Bute in Canada or Froch in the UK come to mind).

After how 'lackluster' (while I never saw him really excel, and also think he was a bit dirty, I will say that he was also very hard to look good against, and had a lot of 50/50 rounds in those fights) I personally saw him to be vs top competition in the pros, I seriously wonder how he was such an accomplished amateur...I wonder how many of his 120 fights there were even away from home..it looks like most of them were in the USA as well (obviously not the Olympic gold he won though which was in Greece of course).

My hunch is that he was considered the golden boy by USA boxing for a while...he was trained by Hunter from a young age so that probably carried a lot of weight in scoring any close amateur fights in his favor...though there probably weren't a ton in those days where he needed help...he certainly was not a scrub after all, by any means.

I think the sad story about his parents probably made it easier for him to get good decisions in a way as well...he was just a young kid who had a good story behind him then, so I would bet he had a lot of people rooting for him and helping him along the way, if you will.

Certainly take nothing away from him fighting at home as a pro, since he was afforded that opportunity to make a good career by doing so...and if he traveled his scorecards and record may have looked a lot different imho...I don't blame him for that.

But similarly, if GGG was getting the same type of grind it out decisions/controversial wins, fighting at home in Kazhakstan and sometimes in his own hometown of Karaganda...then yes I would look to those results with a side-eye and would downgrade/judge GGG accordingly.

I appreciate all styles...two of my favorites from this past era are GGG and Lara...but a main issue I had with Ward was his seeming inability to separate from good boxers in his fights against them...and when he did, often times those fights were then marred by some type of controversy (Dawson weight drop/Kov low blows/Kessler head butts).

I appreciate some dirty fighting as well...it is part of the game imo...but yeah I just think with Ward that if he were judged in a completely neutral environment for his career, his record and resume may look quite a bit different/worse...I think GGG's would probably look a bit better in that case.

But it is what it is...I certainly think Ward could have beaten GGG, prime vs prime...and certainly could have done it clean...I think Ward was a bit unfortunate to have the Kessler and Kovalev fights marred in the way that they were...and maybe he could have secured a similar victory vs GGG but with much less controversy.

I suspect in a neutral environment, prime vs prime, it would have been a tough gritty dirty fight...with Ward trying to do as much as he can, legal or not, to get the win...I think it would have turned into a nasty war or with Ward getting a deduction or even a DQ.

Anyway, thanks for the reply...got a bit long winded here but I like to talk boxing as well and enjoyed the convo.

Also I know the last post was long from me as well...but again that post/situation with Bute is an example of why I more or less view Ward the way I do...I just don't find him to be genuine with his words.

I've actually had friends like him before...who I consider to be average or above average intelligence...but they think they are the smartest person in the world...and end up weaving tales/clear mistruths where you can't believe they are trying to spin what they are spinning.

Anyway nice chat!! Lol

[DreamFighter]

You are hung up on getting the last wrong word on every thread. A loser who thinks he is winning. The truth frightens little beta males like you. Hide behind your overrated heroes.

you are describing yourself, he didnt try to get the last word in. but you did.

[TheUptownKid]

Thanks for the reply...I have been wrong before and will be wrong again...but honestly I just never really saw top level skills from Ward against basically any quality fighter that he faced in the pros...besides Froch (which I scored 7-5 to Ward) I can't give him one clear/non-controversial win in my eyes...when I say top level skills, I mean clear separation and clear winning of at least some rounds...Floyd did this often, as did/do many other fighters imho depending on the fight.

I was not a huge Floyd fan...but he would have multiple rounds in big fights where I came away from the round saying 'OK, clear Floyd round'...same for me for GGG, Lara, Kovalev, Lomachenko, Spence, Crawford etc...I never really saw that for Ward in my eyes vs even Bika and Barrera and above...against Kessler I had him ahead but that fight ended controversially as we know unfortunately.

Again have nothing really against Ward...just try to call it like I see it...and certainly think he benefited from being the home fighter in his career...and tbh, I think he knew he needed that home cooking...and that is why we never saw him travel for what should have been big money fights for him in his career (Bute in Canada or Froch in the UK come to mind).

After how 'lackluster' (while I never saw him really excel, and also think he was a bit dirty, I will say that he was also very hard to look good against, and had a lot of 50/50 rounds in those fights) I personally saw him to be vs top competition in the pros, I seriously wonder how he was such an accomplished amateur...I wonder how many of his 120 fights there were even away from home..it looks like most of them were in the USA as well (obviously not the Olympic gold he won though which was in Greece of course).

My hunch is that he was considered the golden boy by USA boxing for a while...he was trained by Hunter from a young age so that probably carried a lot of weight in scoring any close amateur fights in his favor...though there probably weren't a ton in those days where he needed help...he certainly was not a scrub after all, by any means.

I think the sad story about his parents probably made it easier for him to get good decisions in a way as well...he was just a young kid who had a good story behind him then, so I would bet he had a lot of people rooting for him and helping him along the way, if you will.

Certainly take nothing away from him fighting at home as a pro, since he was afforded that opportunity to make a good career by doing so...and if he traveled his scorecards and record may have looked a lot different imho...I don't blame him for that.

But similarly, if GGG was getting the same type of grind it out decisions/controversial wins, fighting at home in Kazhakstan and sometimes in his own hometown of Karaganda...then yes I would look to those results with a side-eye and would downgrade/judge GGG accordingly.

I appreciate all styles...two of my favorites from this past era are GGG and Lara...but a main issue I had with Ward was his seeming inability to separate from good boxers in his fights against them...and when he did, often times those fights were then marred by some type of controversy (Dawson weight drop/Kov low blows/Kessler head butts).

I appreciate some dirty fighting as well...it is part of the game imo...but yeah I just think with Ward that if he were judged in a completely neutral environment for his career, his record and resume may look quite a bit different/worse...I think GGG's would probably look a bit better in that case.

But it is what it is...I certainly think Ward could have beaten GGG, prime vs prime...and certainly could have done it clean...I think Ward was a bit unfortunate to have the Kessler and Kovalev fights marred in the way that they were...and maybe he could have secured a similar victory vs GGG but with much less controversy.

I suspect in a neutral environment, prime vs prime, it would have been a tough gritty dirty fight...with Ward trying to do as much as he can, legal or not, to get the win...I think it would have turned into a nasty war or with Ward getting a deduction or even a DQ.

Anyway, thanks for the reply...got a bit long winded here but I like to talk boxing as well and enjoyed the convo.

Also I know the last post was long from me as well...but again that post/situation with Bute is an example of why I more or less view Ward the way I do...I just don't find him to be genuine with his words.

I've actually had friends like him before...who I consider to be average or above average intelligence...but they think they are the smartest person in the world...and end up weaving tales/clear mistruths where you can't believe they are trying to spin what they are spinning.

Anyway nice chat!! Lol

And almost exactly contradicting you, I like ward bc he took average gifts and made it into an all world fighter. He doesn’t have the greatest reflexes, power, speed or body type, but he made himself into a winner. You can say he didn’t win fights big, but it’s hard to pick out a fight he lost either. People say kovalev, but he made kovalev fight his fight (I was at both) and during both he exhibited stellar boxing skills.

He’s the anti Deontay Wilder. All skill average measurables. Either way you’re free to see what you do (btw I had ward froch 8-4) but ward took inside fighting East when they didn’t have many inside fighters and made it successful.

[Boxing_1013]

And almost exactly contradicting you, I like ward bc he took average gifts and made it into an all world fighter. He doesn’t have the greatest reflexes, power, speed or body type, but he made himself into a winner. You can say he didn’t win fights big, but it’s hard to pick out a fight he lost either. People say kovalev, but he made kovalev fight his fight (I was at both) and during both he exhibited stellar boxing skills.

He’s the anti Deontay Wilder. All skill average measurables. Either way you’re free to see what you do (btw I had ward froch 8-4) but ward took inside fighting East when they didn’t have many inside fighters and made it successful.

Hey I hear ya...I think the first Kov fight was a clear loss...I didn't see Kov fighting Ward's fight at all really...went into that one just excited to see who the better man was, and on that night it was very clear who the better man was.

I think Ward was a tough smart fighter...and I like some of his proficiency in the dark arts of boxing...I just think he was a bit protected and 'helped' in his career moreso than a fighter of similar ability, of which there were quite a few.

But good chats my friend!

[Vodkaholic]

Lol "muh email. Assept mah terms lil g: