Most elite fighters could retire undefeated.

[ruedboy]

It is not that easy.

You have to be flawless to minimise damage in each fight. You have to be able to adapt to avoid losing to that fighter who simply has your number. You have to have a good chin to avoid getting stopped by a well timed punch. You have to have toughness when the opponent puts you through hardship.

There is only so much careful match making can eliminate.

I agree, I said simple but not easy.

[alexnation]

Don't forget that had Fury only been knocked down once, he would have won.
That fight was Wilder's wake up call
And Fury's karma for doping vs Wlad

Fury schooled both though. Even if he did dope, his ring IQ is just a lot higher and he knows his strength and weaknesses so he doesn't get into thoughtless slugfests.

[ruedboy]

Should just label this thread the excuse maker's haven.

From 686BC to now there are ten unbeaten HW champions, period. 3k years, ten to ever do it, y'all ****in' dumb.


Been plenty of eras with weak competition, been loads of hypejobs kept safe, been loads of champions who did retire unbeaten, only ten remain to this day.

Clearly, it takes something more than a weak era, more than being protected, more than getting out when the timing is right. It takes being too good to fail, some **** y'all excuse makin' ******* will never understand.

Who is making excuses?
Why you getting all emotional?
It's just a boxing thread on hump day.

[The Big Dunn]

The blueprint's simple (but not easy),
clever match making and walking away at the right time,
fight low risk guys and retire at the right time,
most great fighters had losses at the end of their careers.

The problem with your assertion is most great fighters don't lose to other great fighters but instead lose to guys who the are far superior to on paper. The difference between a Floyd and say a Duran or a Manny isn't match making but the fact that Floyd didn't lose to Kirland Laing or Jeff Horn level opponents.

Yes, some great fighters lose to other ATG-like Ali losing to Frazier or SRL to Duran. However if you check their records you will see more losses like Watts (Hagler)or Torrecampo (Manny) that have prevented an undefeated record.

[ruedboy]

And never losing to guys like Medgeon Singsurat, and Rustico Torrecampo.

I agree, (I think) :-)

[ruedboy]

The problem with your assertion is most great fighters don't lose to other great fighters but instead lose to guys who the are far superior to on paper. The difference between a Floyd and say a Duran or a Manny isn't match making but the fact that Floyd didn't lose to Kirland Laing or Jeff Horn level opponents.

Yes, some great fighters lose to other ATG-like Ali losing to Frazier or SRL to Duran. However if you check their records you will see more losses like Watts (Hagler)or Torrecampo (Manny) that have prevented an undefeated record.

Maybe , But say Duran retires at 30, his record at that point is 73-2. His 2 losses are to great fighter in their prime (SRL, Estaban De Jesus).So good matchmaking keeps him away from 2 prime guys and getting out at 30 makes him undefeated with over 70 wins.
As for Manny, imagine if Pac had a good team around him from his early days, instead of having to fight to survive? There's no telling how good his record could have been.
I admit, these are improbable scenarios, but my thread is just food for thought.

[The Big Dunn]

Maybe , But say Duran retires at 30, his record at that point is 73-2. His 2 losses are to great fighter in their prime (SRL, Estaban De Jesus).So good matchmaking keeps him away from 2 prime guys and getting out at 30 makes him undefeated with over 70 wins.
As for Manny, imagine if Pac had a good team around him from his early days, instead of having to fight to survive? There's no telling how good his record could have been.
I admit, these are improbable scenarios, but my thread is just food for thought.

On paper Duran was far superior to De Jesus. That was a major upset. De Jesus had lost previously to an unknown somewhere in South America so he is another example of the point I make in the post.

Before losing to DeJesus he beat Buchanan in a fight he wasn't favored and had beaten men who were champions in other divisions.

Match making is part of it but "careful matchmaking" doesn't change just because there was a loss. That was part of the same "careful matchmaking" it's just that the fighter lost.

Upsets happen because humans are imperfect, not necessarily because the match making plan suddenly changed is all I am saying.

[-Kev-]

To be elite you have to beat top guys. You can’t just be undefeated and that equals elite. You have to be able to beat any style.

If you’re supposedly elite, but you have trouble against brawlers, and your promoter keeps brawlers away from you and matches you against the style you’re great against, then that’s not an elite fighter. That’s elite matchmaking.

[Real King Kong]

Also need to be fortunate with a decision or 2. There’s bound to be close fights.

[ruedboy]

Also need to be fortunate with a decision or 2. There’s bound to be close fights.

Yes, you got to be lucky.
Cuts, head butts, low blows, anything can happen.
It could be a fighter gets sick and comes in not 100%.
Sh/t does happen.