Consensus p4p (based on TBRB, Ring & ESPN)

[chrisJS]

Garcia managed to beat Orlando Salido.

As an already seasoned pro and even then he took the easy way out once Salido had figured him out. You don't think the Loma of the last 2-3 years absolutely blasts the Salido that Rocky Martinez fathered? People forget that Loma really did enough to win his 2nd pro fight (1st time fighting past 5 rounds), despite the ref ignoring 100 or so low blows and Salido not coming close to making weight and refusing to step on the scale the next day.

Fighters improve. Henry Armstrong never avenged the Al Lovino loss but Al Lovino lost to lesser dudes. Bernard Hopkins lost to Clint Mitchell, Alexis Arguello lost 4 fights including a title shot to Marcel before he won a title. You are punishing a guy for daring to fight champs from the day he turned pro to fit your agenda.

Mikey ain't beating Salido, Rocky, Russell, Rigo, Walters, Linares in his first 15-20 fights. **** he ducked a fight with Linares.

[Curt Henning]

As an already seasoned pro and even then he took the easy way out once Salido had figured him out. You don't think the Loma of the last 2-3 years absolutely blasts the Salido that Rocky Martinez fathered? Fighters improve. Henry Armstrong never avenged the Al Lovino loss but Al Lovino lost to lesser dudes. Bernard Hopkins lost to Clint Mitchell, Alexis Arguello lost 4 fights including a title shot to Marcel before he won a title. You are punishing a guy for daring to fight champs from the day he turned pro to fit your agenda.

Mikey ain't beating Salido, Rocky, Russell, Rigo, Walters, Linares in his first 15-20 fights. **** he ducked a fight with Linares.

if mikey turned pro at 26 he might beat salido in his first 2 fights....but he didn't and loma didn't turn pro at 18-22 either.....

they were the same age ....stop making excuses for loma..,.he turned pro when he did by his own choice...and he fought who he did on his own choice...no one forced him

loma is 30 with two gold medals and like a trillion amateur fights...u guys talk about him like he just put on boxing gloves at age 23 or some ****

[bluebeam]

It's multiple lists combined. Based on those combined lists, the vast majority of fans it would appear you are perhaps even more clueless. You are probably one of those guys that picked Rigo, Walters and perhaps even Linares?

Garcia? Seriously? He hasn't even been in with a top 30 p4p guy.

why is it a big deal that loma beat rigo but nobody cares that floyd shut out marquez? 2 weight class jump for both losers right?

why is loma beating walters a big deal? walters was a nobody before he beat nonito and he has been a nobody since he beat nonito. not to mention walters has never even won a title at 130 and lets not forget the 1 year layoff.

why is loma beating linares a big deal? linares has no notable win.


this isnt a knock on lomachenko because he is as solid as they come. I just wanna know why are these wins big deals to you considering the facts i just stated

[Curt Henning]

I think loma is great..i really do

but these guys act like loma came into the salido fight as some big underdog and he just put on gloves for the first time at 22 years of age...and had no experience with pro fighters before...lol

[SteveM]

do you think the gonzales that rungvisai beat was a better fighter than lomachenko or crawford? i certainly don't. he was several weight classes above his best, aging while tiny, had his face broken by a ham and egger a few years back, had been taking punches even in victory and when he looked spectacular. and the first win was controversial, that was a headbutt that dropped him initially. yeah, he was on the top of a lot of the p4p lists at the time, but a lot of that comes down to the characteristics of a list and a confirmation bias. guys stay on the list until they're knocked off, generally. i didn't think gonzales had looked liek the best fighter on the planet for a while, but i respected that people wanted to keep him there while he had something left and beforehe had been knocked off. but if we're off on the evaluation of a guy being p4p#1, does his conqueror deserve to take his spot?


you also can't just stack wins next to each other when you evaluate a p4p list. floyd's got an amazing resume. would he be p4p #1 if he came out of retirement? he looked bad against a debuting fighter in his last fight. pacquiao likewise has one of the best resumes of all time. not a p4p fighter at the moment, right? and that's because you don't just weigh out wins on your p4p list, you evaluate where a fighter is contemporarily and hash out who you think would win if they were all the same size and fought.

yes, rungvisai has three very good wins and very recently, but are you really picking him to beat anybody in the world?


do you think rungvisai is a better fighter than lomachenko? how about crawford? if they were teh same size they'd body that guy, and i think you know that. they're just better fighters.

Thats a succinct summarisation of what I've often suspected. It takes too long to get on to the list and once on the boxers often stay too long.
I think resume is only the strongest component of decision making when the most recent fights have all been strong victories against decent opposition.
This means that fighters who have slipped in victory because they have now fought a higher level of comp (Golovkin) should slide down the rankings.
Another reason too slide would be lack of evidence of continued supremacy due to either inactivity, Garcia and Ward going back a few years and Fury now, or injury.
On the other hand, when a fighter is on a real hot streak like Loma we should pay less and less attention to a loss as it slips further and further back into the mists of time.
Of course, even applying rules or guidelines like these it still is very subjective. I'm high on Sor Rungvisai's recent resume even allowing for the fact that Gonzalez has slipped. Depends how much yu think he had slipped.

I think a ww version of Rungvisai would be very scary proposition - don't think either Spence, Thurman or Crawford would be jumping to get in the ring with him. And at MW I think it's be the same. The guy is intense and determined - like an unshakeable pit bull that just won't deter despite taking a lot of flak.

[Curt Henning]

why is it a big deal that loma beat rigo but nobody cares that floyd shut out marquez? 2 weight class jump for both losers right?

why is loma beating walters a big deal? walters was a nobody before he beat nonito and he has been a nobody since he beat nonito. not to mention walters has never even won a title at 130 and lets not forget the 1 year layoff.

why is loma beating linares a big deal? linares has no notable win.


this isnt a knock on lomachenko because he is as solid as they come. I just wanna know why are these wins big deals to you considering the facts i just stated

this has already been brought up...chris will try to explain by saying "no one was asking for Floyd/marquez....so it doesn't matter".....ive seen him say it before

except marquez was asking for it

[SteveM]

why is it a big deal that loma beat rigo but nobody cares that floyd shut out marquez? 2 weight class jump for both losers right?

why is loma beating walters a big deal? walters was a nobody before he beat nonito and he has been a nobody since he beat nonito. not to mention walters has never even won a title at 130 and lets not forget the 1 year layoff.

why is loma beating linares a big deal? linares has no notable win.

this isnt a knock on lomachenko because he is as solid as they come. I just wanna know why are these wins big deals to you considering the facts i just stated

We can all knock resumes but if you are making a case against Loma's resume then you have to look objectively at the resumes of the fighters you cast as being higher up the p4p lists.

[chrisJS]

why is it a big deal that loma beat rigo but nobody cares that floyd shut out marquez? 2 weight class jump for both losers right?

why is loma beating walters a big deal? walters was a nobody before he beat nonito and he has been a nobody since he beat nonito. not to mention walters has never even won a title at 130 and lets not forget the 1 year layoff.

why is loma beating linares a big deal? linares has no notable win.


this isnt a knock on lomachenko because he is as solid as they come. I just wanna know why are these wins big deals to you considering the facts i just stated

I don't think Rigo is a big deal but a large number should because they picked Rigo to win handily. I'm not one of those. That's just a solid win for me but it was impressive he made him quit so quickly.

Walters moved to 130 before Loma and had proven himself as a good fighter. It was an impressive win to dominate Nonito like that. The 11 months is an issue for Loma but it wasn't an issue when Postol was off for 10 or Gamboa 12 against Crawfod nor was it an issue when Mosley was off for 16 before Floyd or Oscar was off for 12 for Floyd. FYI he'd beaten Darchinyan which was a solid win especially at that point in Walters career. Walters was obviously a good all-around undefeated fighter, hence why so many on this board picked him to beat Loma. Loma took his soul to the point he seems to not care about fighting again.

Linares has been an excellent fighter for a while. He never got that signature fight unfortunately. Garcia ducked him which could have told a lot. He had unified titles at 135 and was on a good run of solid wins and a lengthy reign.

[Curt Henning]

I don't think Rigo is a big deal but a large number should because they picked Rigo to win handily. I'm not one of those. That's just a solid win for me but it was impressive he made him quit so quickly.

Walters moved to 130 before Loma and had proven himself as a good fighter. It was an impressive win to dominate Nonito like that. The 11 months is an issue for Loma but it wasn't an issue when Postol was off for 10 or Gamboa 12 against Crawfod nor was it an issue when Mosley was off for 16 before Floyd or Oscar was off for 12 for Floyd. FYI he'd beaten Darchinyan which was a solid win especially at that point in Walters career. Walters was obviously a good all-around undefeated fighter, hence why so many on this board picked him to beat Loma. Loma took his soul to the point he seems to not care about fighting again.

Linares has been an excellent fighter for a while. He never got that signature fight unfortunately. Garcia ducked him which could have told a lot. He had unified titles at 135 and was on a good run of solid wins and a lengthy reign.

you put wayyyy too much stock in troll threads from the "demographic" as proof that guys "picked against loma"....every time theres a fight theres a bunch of threads or posts where someone says the dog is going to win.....still not a reflection....have someone put up real money or put a gun to their head....people weren't picking rigo or walters

[chrisJS]

you put wayyyy too much stock in troll threads from the "demographic" as proof that guys "picked against loma"....every time theres a fight theres a bunch of threads or posts where someone says the dog is going to win.....still not a reflection....have someone put up real money or put a gun to their head....people weren't picking rigo or walters

Not just here I saw a lot on social media and staff on sites picking those two. Another one was Russell. I remember tight odds, I believe it was on The Ring's fight picks the slight majority had Russell winning and obviously social media and forums a ton picked Russell too.

Picking Rigo made no sense to me whatsoever. I thought that would be one of his easiest fights perhaps even his easiest. I warned people about looking stupid (and won some bets). That was a solid win executed in brilliant fashion but the Walters, Linares and Russell wins are excellent IMO and probably the strongest three wins of any active fighter outside of Pacquaio and Chocolatito both of whom are on the downside.