Why do some boxers get praised for winning by decision whilst others get discredited?

[PensionKiller]

Because some have different skin color.

There I said it

Unfortunately there is some truth to this.

However, unless you're the under dog, 12 round decisions are often meh unless you put on a clinic. Then again some 12 round battles are wars

[HarvardBlue]

You make a good point! I agree that the criticism about a boxer being 'boring' is just as inappropriate as having an uneven standard for one boxer over the other. If a boxer is boring but is boxing within the rules without fouling, then they have every right to box the way that is suitable for them, irrespective of whether specific individuals find them boring or not.

'Boredom' is a subjective opinion whilst winning bouts is an objective accomplishment of boxing. If one finds a boxer boring, the simple solution is to not watch that boxer's bouts instead of watching and then complaining that the said boxer is boring.

The only time a legitimate complaint can be made is when a boxer is legitimately fouling or breaking the rules whilst his opponent isn't able to retaliate to even the playing field. That has nothing to do with 'boredom' but everything to do with 'unfairness' to one boxer over the other.

However, this thread is not related to boxers being called 'boring' or 'runners'. This thread is specifically about double standards existing among boxing fans. I never made any mention specifically about Andre Ward fans, Golovkin fans, Mayweather fans and etc. This is the reality within the boxing community in general.

My point is, why should a boxer be evaluated by expectation rather than actual feat and accomplishment? Who cares what fanatics or fanboys claim about their expectation of what their favorite boxer is going to do? If a fanatic claims their favorite boxer is a monster and that boxer doesn't show any signs of being a monster but still wins his bout within the rules, why should that boxer be criticized for not being a monster, even though he won his bout fair and square? If anybody is to be criticized, then it's those fanatics / fanboys, not the boxers themselves.

You'd have a point if the boxers themselves state they are going to do this or that, setting a high expectation of themselves and then failing to match that expectation. Criticism is justified then. In the case of Artur Beterbiev, he never claimed he was a monster. Nor did he ever claim he was going to KO every opponent he would ever face. At least not to my knowledge. Hence, why should he be criticized for going 12 rounds against Enrico Koelling, but the same criticism isn't applied to Andre Ward BY THOSE SAME FANS when Ward went 12 rounds with an opponent who is of the same caliber in Alexander Brand? That's the definition of DOUBLE STANDARD and NON-OBJECTIVITY. Equal standards and rules should apply to everyone in order for credibility to be maintained.

Actually Golovkin put the expectations on himself. He's always talking about putting on a big drama show.

I still don't know why Beterbiev is in this discussion. His career has been underwhelming so far. He's a really good fighter but he hasn't had the exposure for anyone to seriously compare him to Ward. I agree boxers should be judged objectively but that's a pipe dream. I wish that wasn't the case but that's just the way it is...

[Poet682006]

2017 and Fl0mos and Pac7ards are STILL running their cumdumpsters at each other SMDH

[Mr Objecitivity]

Actually Golovkin put the expectations on himself. He's always talking about putting on a big drama show.

I still don't know why Beterbiev is in this discussion. His career has been underwhelming so far. He's a really good fighter but he hasn't had the exposure for anyone to seriously compare him to Ward. I agree boxers should be judged objectively but that's a pipe dream. I wish that wasn't the case but that's just the way it is...

I don't recall Golovkin ever claiming that he would KO 100% of all his opponents that he faces in his boxing career. Or anything along those lines. Perhaps his fans did and his management team did. However, that's not a fault of Golovkin himself but of those particular individuals.

The reason why I used Alexander Povetkin and Artur Beterbiev as examples was because they were the most recent victims of experiencing such discrediting from individuals with double or multiple standards. Their bouts were most recent too. This thread has nothing to do with the quality of Beterbiev's career compared to Ward in general, but to do with particular boxers like Beterbiev being held to a different standard to other boxers like Ward.

Yes, objectivity isn't going to exist because boxing fans particularly are some of the most irrational sports fans I've ever come across. That won't change the fact that there will be some objective individuals out there who are going to expose such individuals that lack a single standard and objectivity so that conclusions based on reality can be exposed differentiated from conclusions based on fanboy fantasy, bias and delusion,

[Death_Adder]

WTF is a whilst?

[HarvardBlue]

I don't recall Golovkin ever claiming that he would KO 100% of all his opponents that he faces in his boxing career. Or anything along those lines. Perhaps his fans did and his management team did. However, that's not a fault of Golovkin himself but of those particular individuals.

The reason why I used Alexander Povetkin and Artur Beterbiev as examples was because they were the most recent victims of experiencing such discrediting from individuals with double or multiple standards. Their bouts were most recent too. This thread has nothing to do with the quality of Beterbiev's career compared to Ward in general, but to do with particular boxers like Beterbiev being held to a different standard to other boxers like Ward.

Yes, objectivity isn't going to exist because boxing fans particularly are some of the most irrational sports fans I've ever come across. That won't change the fact that there will be some objective individuals out there who are going to expose such individuals that lack a single standard and objectivity so that conclusions based on reality can be exposed differentiated from conclusions based on fanboy fantasy, bias and delusion,

He never actually used those words but he was talking about "big drama show." "Not boring" "Get 'big' knock out." Or other things along those lines. Let's not pretend he had no part in portraying himself that way.

Like I said the Beterbiev fight was incredible boring. If I'm not mistaken the crowd was booing the whole time. You know what would've stopped the booing? A quick KO. If it went 12 rounds but had some "drama" to it. Maybe there crowd wouldn't have had a problem with the fight. The crowd showed their displeasure to a boring fight. That's it! Nothing else. This has nothing to do with Ward so why even bring him up.

[Mr Objecitivity]

He never actually used those words but he was talking about "big drama show." "Not boring" "Get 'big' knock out." Or other things along those lines. Let's not pretend he had no part in portraying himself that way.

Like I said the Beterbiev fight was incredible boring. If I'm not mistaken the crowd was booing the whole time. You know what would've stopped the booing? A quick KO. If it went 12 rounds but had some "drama" to it. Maybe there crowd wouldn't have had a problem with the fight. The crowd showed their displeasure to a boring fight. That's it! Nothing else. This has nothing to do with Ward so why even bring him up.

Gennady Golovkin doesn't speak English fluently. Therefore, unless what he said was spoken in his native languages and then translated accurately, the true meaning behind the things he said in English would remain unclear. Also, none of those statements he made in English which you've mentioned insinuate in anyway that he his claiming he would win 100% of all of his bouts by knockout or that a decision victory shouldn't be accepted. Those statements are very vague. It could simply mean that he prefers winning by KO over winning by decision and that he tries his best to KO most of his opponents, if not all.

As for Beterbiev's bout against Koelling being 'boring', 'boredom' has nothing to do with this thread. The reason why I am comparing Andre Ward's performance against Alexander Brand to Beterbiev's performance against Enrico Koelling is because those who discredited Beterbiev's win over Koelling due to the fact that it went 12 rounds and didn't discredit Andre Ward similarly for going 12 rounds against a similar level of opponent in Alexander Brand. I wanted to know the reason for having this non-objective, double or more standards that applies to one boxer and not another boxer. I wanted to know how Beterbiev's performance against Enrico Koelling somehow proves he couldn't beat Andre Ward which is what some were claiming. Even though Andre Ward performed just as well / poorly against Alexander Brand as Beterbiev did against Enrico Koelling.

Also, how is it Beterbiev's fault if Koelling was not willing to engage or attack much? Which was the cause behind why the bout had no 'drama' or not much 'drama, since Beterbiev was attacking for the whole bout whilst Koelling wasn't and boxing requires both boxers to attack to create any 'drama'.

Also, Koelling was never previously knocked out, before getting stopped for the first time in his career by Beterbiev. So perhaps he had a very good chin and punch resistance? Hence why Beterbiev couldn't KO him very early. So why should Beterbiev be blamed for not being able to KO a very durable opponent earlier, rather than the durable opponent getting credit for having high durability for absorbing as many punches for as long as he did against Beterbiev?

[Mr Objecitivity]

WTF is a whilst?

https://www.google.com/search?q=Whilst+definition&oq=Whilst+definition&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.2517j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[HarvardBlue]

Gennady Golovkin doesn't speak English fluently. Therefore, unless what he said was spoken in his native languages and then translated accurately, the true meaning behind the things he said in English would remain unclear. Also, none of those statements he made in English which you've mentioned insinuate in anyway that he his claiming he would win 100% of all of his bouts by knockout or that a decision victory shouldn't be accepted. Those statements are very vague. It could simply mean that he prefers winning by KO over winning by decision and that he tries his best to KO most of his opponents, if not all.

As for Beterbiev's bout against Koelling being 'boring', 'boredom' has nothing to do with this thread. The reason why I am comparing Andre Ward's performance against Alexander Brand to Beterbiev's performance against Enrico Koelling is because those who discredited Beterbiev's win over Koelling due to the fact that it went 12 rounds and didn't discredit Andre Ward similarly for going 12 rounds against a similar level of opponent in Alexander Brand. I wanted to know the reason for having this non-objective, double or more standards that applies to one boxer and not another boxer. I wanted to know how Beterbiev's performance against Enrico Koelling somehow proves he couldn't beat Andre Ward which is what some were claiming. Even though Andre Ward performed just as well / poorly against Alexander Brand as Beterbiev did against Enrico Koelling.

Also, how is it Beterbiev's fault if Koelling was not willing to engage or attack much? Which was the cause behind why the bout had no 'drama' or not much 'drama, since Beterbiev was attacking for the whole bout whilst Koelling wasn't and boxing requires both boxers to attack to create any 'drama'.

Also, Koelling was never previously knocked out, before getting stopped for the first time in his career by Beterbiev. So perhaps he had a very good chin and punch resistance? Hence why Beterbiev couldn't KO him very early. So why should Beterbiev be blamed for not being able to KO a very durable opponent earlier, rather than the durable opponent getting credit for having high durability for absorbing as many punches for as long as he did against Beterbiev?

The English is his second language defense of Golovkin is getting old. He said what he said and meant it. I already said he didn't use the words "win 100%" with a KO. However, part of marketing strategy to sell him to the public was his KO ratio. When his last 2 fights didn't end in KOs, it derailed (for now) that marketing strategy. This will probably help people see him now as a boxer and take the pressure off him to KO everyone. Maybe this is good for him. No?

As far as Beterbiev, I'm a fan of his. I think he is the best at 175. His career path has been lacking because of the long lay offs. The fact of the matter is his last fight stunk. It didn't do his marketability any good. Comparing his win over Koelling to Ward's win over Brand makes no sense. The both dominated... Neither win was spectacular except that a lot of people booed Beterbiev. The reason was because the fight was boring. People expected more from him. People think all of Ward's fight is boring (I don't), so it didn't matter that it lasted 12 rounds. Boring or not. No need to analyze this any further.

[soul_survivor]

Why does this double, triple or more of those standards exist among boxing fans? When one boxer wins a decision by shutout, winning every round in the process. They get criticized for being exposed or lacking this or that ability. Whilst when other boxers accomplish this exact same feat. They are credited and praised for displaying 'high level boxing skills'.

An example of this would be Artur Beterbiev taking 12 rounds to stop Enrico Koelling. Despite Beterbiev winning every round comfortably until the 12th where he eventually dropped and finished off Koelling. Some of the fans are discrediting Beterbiev for apparently being 'exposed' or 'not being good enough' or 'lacking x, y or z ability'. Another similar example is Alexander Povetkin beating Christian Hammer by shutout 12 rounds decision and ends up being discredited similarly to how Beterbiev was discredited by those fans after his win over Koelling.

Yet, when Andre Ward beats someone like Alexander Brand or Sullivan Barrera by decision. It somehow apparently shows Andre Ward is such a 'skilled boxer' with such 'high level boxing abilities', according to those same fans discrediting decision victories of Beterbiev and Povetkin. Even though Andre Ward pretty much accomplished the same feat as the other two boxers?

Why do these multiple standards exist for different boxers? Why can't every boxer be judged / evaluated by the same standard?

I agree to a certain extent but it's important look at the context of those 12 rounds. Tbh, Pov, Bet and Ward all looked laboured and ultimately boring in those fights. They were difficult to watch against a level of opposition that should have been beaten inside 6.

An exciting ,entertaining 12 rounds would be GGG/Canelo or what BJS did to Lem.

BUT the people you are talking about only regard skill if it comes from people with the appropriate skin colour.