Comments Thread For: With Andre Ward Retired, Who is The #1 P4P Fighter in The World?

[boxingitis]

Never said Russell was a chump. I'm not even saying it wasn't a good win. I'm saying a win over him doesn't put Lomachenko on top of the P4P list. It doesn't matter if he's the champ now. People on here make an argument that Canelo with over 40 fights was a meaningless win for Mayweather because he was green. But Russell, who gets repeatedly lambasted, is vaulted into a world beater because Lomachenko beat him. There's just no consistency in the argument I see here on a daily basis. As far as Crawford, he unified the division. A rare feat in boxing. Why I have to explain why that is better than any accomplishment by Lomachenko is beyond me?

You need promoters and fighters willing to fight in order for fighters to unify. Crawford got lucky that none of PBC or Goldenboy fighter had belts. Come on Indongo.

Indongo, Postol

Or

Russell , Walters

U know Lomachenko is the best at 126 and 130, he could clean the those division if fighters would fight him. Watch Crawford struggle to fight Thurman and Specne.

[Dr.Cool]

What do you mean 'guess', as if to say that there is a "correct answer" out there?

All that Rankings are, are opinions. Whether we're talking P4P or Divisional, btw. What matters is how informed and conscientious those opinions are (there is such a thing as an objective opinion).

P4P means "Who's better/best, regardless of size"...

And what goes into determining that, includes EVERYTHING that is pertinent; Resume and Dominance along with Skill and Talent, plus Heart, Durability, Intangibles.

P4P is not just a Resume comparison... close fights happen, bad decisions happen.
P4P is not just a Skills competition..... without Talent, Heart, or a Chin, the "most skilled" dont mean much.
P4P is not just a Talent competition..... you need to prove what your god-given attributes can do.

So it involves it all. P4P takes it ALL into account. And it's up to each individual Boxing aficionado (media members, hardcore fans, etc) to honestly assess all of the factor in coming up with their opinion. For there is not "correct answer," there are simply more reasonable/less reasonable opinions.

No one knows how much heart or chin most fighters have because they never test themselves. When an organization lists someone as p4p #1 that means a lot more than some purely subjective list, based on eye test alone.

Actually, Thurman deserves it more than anyone else right now. I say Spence is the best, but yes, I prefer to make educated guesses, instead of "well, he beat his bums more decisively". For everyone on here, fine, have your own, I think Spence is the best. His win over Brook is better than Postol. Loma might've had a claim, but he decided to stay with Daddy Arum and face no-names coming off losses. Crawford should be facing the top ww's. And no, Horn doesn't count. The Ring and TRBR should leave it vacant though, none of these play-it-safers deserve it.

A Crawford-Spence fight is what everyone should be calling for. That would determine who is #1 p4p. At least Spence is trying to get Thurman, while Crawford is picking between the Hornet and Jessie Vargas.

I know what a p4p list is idiot, but apparently you do not realize the importance that makes for casuals, for the ones who decide who gets paid and who doesn't. If everyone was arguing saying Mayweather shouldn't be #1 do you honestly think he would have kept breaking his own records for ppv buys and paychecks? When The Ring and TRBR make lists, that lists makes an actual $$$$ difference. And that is based on resume. No one actually believed Pac was a top 10 p4p fighter the last few years, but he was on everyone's list because of his resume. And that is why he also made tens of millions for single fights. And that is an honor that should have to be earned.

[HarvardBlue]

You need promoters and fighters willing to fight in order for fighters to unify. Crawford got lucky that none of PBC or Goldenboy fighter had belts. Come on Indongo.

Indongo, Postol

Or

Russell , Walters

U know Lomachenko is the best at 126 and 130, he could clean the those division if fighters would fight him. Watch Crawford struggle to fight Thurman and Specne.

Russell and Walters are probably better caliber fighters but Postol and Indongo accomplished more. Lomachenko is one of the most highly skilled fighter I've ever seen. Forget just being the best at those weights. People mistake my stance on Lomachenko, especially on his P4P status as hate. It's not. I'm saying it's too soon because he hasn't beat any opponent with real accomplishments on their resume. Walters was the closest but the way that fight ended doesn't sit well with me. It was just too convenient the way Walters quit. Not to mention 2 other fighters under the Top Rank banner just decide to concede the fight when neither one was hurt or in danger. When you see 3 professional fighters quit because they were "outclassed" you have to question the legitimacy of the result. Especially if those fighters never showed that quality before. If he beats Rigondeaux in a spectacular fashion, not just win, I can see him going to the top. Me or anyone else won't have an argument against him.

[USMCer]

I lean toward Rigondeaux as the choice. However, I'd like to wait to see how he performs against Loma before anointing him. I do place him high enough that if Loma happens to beat him, I think he should be considered #1 at that point.

Seems that you just want us to take a stance on the matter, which is fine. If you put a gun to my head, I'd say Rigondeaux.

If someone truly believes that it's too close to call and leaves it as a "tie" for the top spot, that's fine. My little issue is with the idea that the top spot can be left "vacant"... that's a silly, contrived concept.


BTW, would you say Lomachenko is the most "skilled"... if not, who's the best, based purely on skills?

And how far down the list is Loma, based on "resume"?

[Squ□redCircle34]

Crawford and it's not a question!

Hopefully he buys out his contract from Top Rank!

I think at 147, he can take Danny Garcia, Thurman, Horn, Pacquiao and etc.

His toughest fights will be against Spence and Porter!

[USMCer]

are you an MMA guy ?

coz yea, I have been trying to explain that for a long time

you are probably too smart for this site

P4P, based on ceteris paribus, I doubt that anybody could beat Rigo

maybe Crawford, not sure..... a little early to tell, which is where resume comes in handy..... but you are 100% correct, P4P does not equal resume

otherwise, Pac would be #1, and Golovkin would not be on the list at all

ranking by resume, is a current ATG list, NOT a P4P list

Yeah, I'm a hardcore when it comes to MMA, but I've been a casual Boxing fan for a longer time, and a general sports fan (College FB, NBA, etc).

Pound-for-pound... it takes a wealth of knowledge and diligent 'work' to come up with a substantive P4P list... however, the concept itself is simple if you don't over-think it.

I've said something similar to that myself, about the distinction between P4P and ATG.

While the idea of GOAT/ATG is about all-time, a fighter's entire career... P4P is about 'the now,' what's going on currently/recently. So the results of a fight from 5 years ago does NOT mean as much as the results of a fight from 2 years ago, and even less compared to a fight from 1 year ago, etc. Ya don't ignore what happened 5+ years ago, but it has less significance than more recent results/information.

[aboutfkntime]

No one knows how much heart or chin most fighters have because they never test themselves. When an organization lists someone as p4p #1 that means a lot more than some purely subjective list, based on eye test alone.

Actually, Thurman deserves it more than anyone else right now. I say Spence is the best, but yes, I prefer to make educated guesses, instead of "well, he beat his bums more decisively". For everyone on here, fine, have your own, I think Spence is the best. His win over Brook is better than Postol. Loma might've had a claim, but he decided to stay with Daddy Arum and face no-names coming off losses. Crawford should be facing the top ww's. And no, Horn doesn't count. The Ring and TRBR should leave it vacant though, none of these play-it-safers deserve it.

A Crawford-Spence fight is what everyone should be calling for. That would determine who is #1 p4p. At least Spence is trying to get Thurman, while Crawford is picking between the Hornet and Jessie Vargas.

I know what a p4p list is idiot, but apparently you do not realize the importance that makes for casuals, for the ones who decide who gets paid and who doesn't. If everyone was arguing saying Mayweather shouldn't be #1 do you honestly think he would have kept breaking his own records for ppv buys and paychecks? When The Ring and TRBR make lists, that lists makes an actual $$$$ difference. And that is based on resume. No one actually believed Pac was a top 10 p4p fighter the last few years, but he was on everyone's list because of his resume. And that is why he also made tens of millions for single fights. And that is an honor that should have to be earned.

everyone who watched their P4P fighter get dished up by Jeff Horn..... knows they fk'd up

you are only as good as your last fight

what you did yesterday, will not help you today

1) ability/style
2) form
3) resume

gets the job done every time

Pac did not need to be on that list in order to attract fans

he would sell out Brisbane again tomorrow, or anywhere else

[Mike_R]

I have it for Crawford at this point. Lots of big shifts to come over the next year or more though.

Loma vs. Rigo ought to affect the top 10 pretty majorly depending how it goes down. Same for GGG/Canelo rematch.

Spence is on the way up pretty quick but needs to do more work on the 147 division.

Mikey Garcia and what weight he decides to campaign at will also affect things since he is within range to fight either Bud or Loma all depending.

[GhostofDempsey]

Whoever wins Loma/Rigo in December is P4P #1 in my opinion.

[aboutfkntime]

Whoever wins Loma/Rigo in December is P4P #1 in my opinion.

it depends on the manner of loss, or win

Rigo is a lot smaller than Loma, who has mentioned fighting at lightweight

if Loma goes life and death with him, not much may change