Boring Perfection

[Tony Trick-Pony]

Talent and skill and accomplishment is all great but what can you really say about a fighter who is never involved in a great fight?

Last November, Ward and Kovalev fought a close fight, but would you really call it great?

Canelo-GGG was competitive, but great?

Hagler-Hearns was great. Duran-Barkley was great. The Thrilla in Manila was great. Any even causal fan would be impressed with these fights.

Yet, most of the so called p4p guys nowadays have never been in such fights. I mean, Lomachenko is a great fighter but his fights aren't balls to the wall great back and forth fights. Terence Crawford's fight with Gamboa was competitive but once again, I wouldn't call it great.

One great fight this year I believe has been Joshua-Klitschko. They will both be remembered for that one.

However, what will so many of these other fighters be remembered for? What great back and forth high action fight was Roy Jones ever in? Mayweather's fights with Castillo and Maidana were close and competitive but nothing like a Barrera-Morales or a Gatti-Ward. Bowe-Holyfield I was a truly great heavyweight fight even if Bowe wasn't a great heavyweight. Holyfield definitely left part of himself in the ring that night and fans are still grateful as they should be.

I've heard it said that an unbeaten fighter just hasn't fought the right fighter yet. This could be true. How many ATGs have retired unbeaten and even the ones who did, how truly unbeaten were they?

In closing, fighters that go through these kinds of fights deserve much higher praise in my opinion than guys who had a lot of talent but are never in these. After all, many consider Sugar Ray Robinson the best of all time and he did have these types of fights with LaMotta, Basilio and Fullmer. For the ones that don't and end on sterling records with lots of belts in their homes, it may be impressive. It may inspire a lot of admiration but one thing's for sure. It's sure as hell boring.

[daggum]

well ward simply cant be in a great fight because any time he was challenged he resorted to octopus mode, headbutt, mode, take out his testicles mode, etc...

[Tony Trick-Pony]

well ward simply cant be in a great fight because any time he was challenged he resorted to octopus mode, headbutt, mode, take out his testicles mode, etc...

It's worse than that my friend.

I knew YOU would respond as in you are one of the few posters on here who appreciate a great fight.

Where is the passion with boxing fans these days?

So many are dead heads, obsessed with this constant drivel to be undefeated and invincible on boxrec while an utter bore in reality?

Something has gone out of the boxing fan.

This is pathetic.

Not one ounce of passion or substance.

All style and BS.

I long for the wars that fans are dying to see.

[Graz]

It's true. The great fights in boxing are so few and far between that the build up has to bring the fans in to watch. It's kind of like an exciting preview of a movie that really lets you down when you finally see it. It's all about promotion these days because the fights themselves can't live up to the hype. Lately many of the fights outcomes are determined not by the fighters themselves but by unscrupulous judges or referees.

[Mr Objecitivity]

I think domination = boring to most people whilst competitive fights = entertaining to most people.

Here's the catch though. When two boxers are in a competitive fight, like Arturo Gatti vs Micky Ward for example, it's usually because neither are that good in terms of boxing abilities relative to their opponent. On the other hand, when a boxer totally dominates their opponent by a big margin, it is usually because their boxing abilities are much higher relative to their said opponents.

Floyd Mayweather Jr appears boring because his boxing abilities are so much better than most of his opponents. Thus, he dominates them one lopsidedly and appears boring as a result. The same applies to Guillermo Rigondeaux, Wladimir Klitschko, prime Roy Jones Jr and etc.

However, two guys fighting in a bar with very little skill can be involved in an EXTREMELY 'competitive' fight and it would appear even more entertaining than some of the most entertaining boxing bouts as a result. However, there'll be very little skill in display.

When a boxer appears boring despite boxing cleanly using legal tactics (Andre Ward doesn't count), then you have to blame that boxer's opponents more than that boxer itself because none of the opponents are good enough in terms of boxing abilities to give a good enough challenge and make the fight competitive.

[Tony Trick-Pony]

I think domination = boring to most people whilst competitive fights = entertaining to most people.

Here's the catch though. When two boxers are in a competitive fight, like Arturo Gatti vs Micky Ward for example, it's usually because neither are that good in terms of boxing abilities relative to their opponent. On the other hand, when a boxer totally dominates their opponent by a big margin, it is usually because their boxing abilities are much higher relative to their said opponents.

Floyd Mayweather Jr appears boring because his boxing abilities are so much better than most of his opponents. Thus, he dominates them one lopsidedly and appears boring as a result. The same applies to Guillermo Rigondeaux, Wladimir Klitschko, prime Roy Jones Jr and etc.

However, two guys fighting in a bar with very little skill can be involved in an EXTREMELY 'competitive' fight and it would appear even more entertaining than some of the most entertaining boxing bouts as a result. However, there'll be very little skill in display.

When a boxer appears boring despite boxing cleanly using legal tactics (Andre Ward doesn't count), then you have to blame that boxer's opponents more than that boxer itself because none of the opponents are good enough in terms of boxing abilities to give a good enough challenge and make the fight competitive.

Thank you for excluding Andre Ward. Great call.

I hear what you are saying and I don't disagree with you.

But what puts asses in the seats?

And I'm not talking about putting asses in the seats because the majority of the crowd wants one boring guy to lose?

Where is the passion man?

So you can go twelve, put the crowd to sleep and win?

A fighter should be a warrior.

These guys aren't warriors.

They're businessmen.

That's fine.

But ATG?

When other ATGs spilled their blood and guts to entertain us all and make fight fans for generations?

These guys profit from this rich history and give nothing back.

They're thieves.

[Tony Trick-Pony]

It's true. The great fights in boxing are so few and far between that the build up has to bring the fans in to watch. It's kind of like an exciting preview of a movie that really lets you down when you finally see it. It's all about promotion these days because the fights themselves can't live up to the hype. Lately many of the fights outcomes are determined not by the fighters themselves but by unscrupulous judges or referees.

So true, brother.

I agree with everything you say.

And the movies these days aren't much better.

It's like entertainment in America is getting by on its rich history and giving nothing to the consumers they depend on to make a living.

[Mr Objecitivity]

Thank you for excluding Andre Ward. Great call.

I hear what you are saying and I don't disagree with you.

But what puts asses in the seats?

And I'm not talking about putting asses in the seats because the majority of the crowd wants one boring guy to lose?

Where is the passion man?

So you can go twelve, put the crowd to sleep and win?

A fighter should be a warrior.

These guys aren't warriors.

They're businessmen.

That's fine.

But ATG?

When other ATGs spilled their blood and guts to entertain us all and make fight fans for generations?

These guys profit from this rich history and give nothing back.

They're thieves.

No problem! Any boxer that doesn't dominate using legal tactics like Andre Ward, Bernard Hopkins and etc. don't deserve to be classified in the same category.

Anyway, as far as entertainment is concerned, you have to first define what you mean by 'entertainment'. Entertainment does mean different things to different people. Only then one can establish how to give 'entertaining' boxing bouts. I can generalize and argue in behalf of some people in terms of how they define entertainment, but I can't do it in behalf of absolutely everybody.

[M Bison]

Wow this DCAF don't know shiet about boxing, Andre Ward is the greatest to lace them up and I see beyond yo white lies and y'all just wanna see slick ATG futue HOF best of all time Ward lose, SMFH!!

[Tony Trick-Pony]

No problem! Any boxer that doesn't dominate using legal tactics like Andre Ward, Bernard Hopkins and etc. don't deserve to be classified in the same category.

Anyway, as far as entertainment is concerned, you have to first define what you mean by 'entertainment'. Entertainment does mean different things to different people. Only then one can establish how to give 'entertaining' boxing bouts. I can generalize and argue in behalf of some people in terms of how they define entertainment, but I can't do it in behalf of absolutely everybody.

Great point, sir.

I'll define my entertainment.

My entertainment stems from fights- not so much boxing.

I've come to realize that I am a fight fan- not a boxing fan.

By this, I mean, when to guys actively pursue one another in a quest to prove dominance in an aggressive fashion.

For me, guys like Gatti and Ward do this. The most skillful? No. But blood and guts warriors keep me enthralled the whole time on watching them years after what they did in the ring. I'm also a reader of great novels, but I only re-read the great ones. I also only rewatch the great fights.

My point being, I want and long for the fights that have crowds on their feet.

Excellent skills and dominance are impressive.

I just don't find them as entertaining as two warriors going after each other with everything they have and leaving it all in the ring.