Pacquiao has a better resume than Duran!

[-PBP-]

I'm not going to be a snob and pretend like Pacquiao doesn't belong in the conversation with these past greats. But with Duran you have to look at the timing. You can't just list the names.

His ATG run at lightweight, victory over the #1 fighter in the world, in his prime and moving up to beat Iran Barkley with no catchweight gives him the edge.

Pac has some great wins and is an ATG in his own right but some of those wins were against past prime fighters and were at catchweights where the opponent was clearly less than 100%.

[Thraxox]

No, destroyed is an understatement. The final scores were 118–110, 116–112 and 115–112 in favor of Raheem and this was when Morales was the house fighter. Had Raheem had any power he may have killed Morales.

Morales was having difficulty making 130 so he fought Morales at 135. Yes, he did drop down back to 130 for that fight. So Manny beat a dude that just got destroyed at 135 then went back down to 130.

It's simply unfair to suggest Morales was the same EL Terible that Barrera defeated or that beat Manny.

Morales admitted that he took Raheem lightly, and didn't train much for the fight and thought of it as a tune up. There were no feints from Morales in that fight. It is unfair to say that it was the same Morales who fought Manny the first. But is also unfair to say that Pacquiao shouldn't even get credit knowing Morales forced Pacquiao to where pillows in the first fight. And Morales out boxed Pacquiao for the first 6 rounds till BODY SHOTS took toll on his body, because he(PAC) was now allowed to where Pacquiao's Reyes Gloves.

Raheem just fought Morales at just the right mental condition. It is even more ludicrous to suggest Raheem would beat Pacquiao.

[Larry the boss]

Margarito just fought at 147 in his last fight and weighed in 165 against Pacquiao you idiot.

Margo fought at 154 the fight before and was coming off of a year ban

[The Big Dunn]

Morales admitted that he took Raheem lightly, and didn't train much for the fight and thought of it as a tune up. There were no feints from Morales in that fight. It is unfair to say that it was the same Morales who fought Manny the first. But is also unfair to say that Pacquiao shouldn't even get credit knowing Morales forced Pacquiao to where pillows in the first fight. And Morales out boxed Pacquiao for the first 6 rounds till BODY SHOTS took toll on his body, because he(PAC) was now allowed to where Pacquiao's Reyes Gloves.

Raheem just fought Morales at just the right mental condition. It is even more ludicrous to suggest Raheem would beat Pacquiao.

Stop it dude, please. This is you being a Manny diehard. It wasn't the gloves, Morales was just slightly better at the time.

Morales was having a tough time making 130 anymore.

Then Bob tried to get him a title at 135 and he took on the lightest hitting champion at the weight and it backfired. Morales left alot of himself in the ring that night.

Go watch that fight., I meant what I said literally-If Raheem had any pop Morales might have never fought again.

I will say this-poster IronDanHamza suggested the 12th round of Morales/Manny 1 did a lot of long teerm damage to Morales. I think that is a fair point even though I may not necessarily agree.

[DJ Enerate]

Continuing on from the SRL-Money thread...

I want to point out that Manny has a better overall body of work compared to Duran's. Far better, actually.

Looking at Duran's signature wins, he has:
Jesus x2
Buchanan
SRL
Barkley
Palomino
Cuevas

Pacquiao, by comparison, has:
Barrera x2
Marquez x2
Morales x2
Bradley x2
Margarito
ODLH
Cotto
Hatton
Ledwaba
Not to mention a hell of a lot more quantitative quality, including being an 8-division champ as well as P4P in his late 30's.

Duran has the greater win over SRL, no comparison, but this is the same argument with Leonard-Floyd. Quality, at some point, doesn't beat the amount of quantity+quality that Floyd or Manny have.
Not to mention the losses that Duran also has in numbers...

Could you say that he was a better fighter than Manny? Arguably, sure, but you can't debate that his resume is inferior...

Duran has 14 signature wins

Ernesto Marcel
Hector Thompson
Guts Ishimatsu
Edwin Viruet
Ray Lampkin
Jose Cuevas
Esteban DeJesus x2
Carlos Palomino
Ken Buchanan
Davie Moore
Iran Barkley
Ray Leonard

Hector Camacho would be in there if Duran wasn't robbed big time in their first fight.

Both Duran and Pac dared to be great by climbing the weight divisions fighting bigger men. A lot of people don't know Duran started fighting at bantamweight, and has a brilliant win at feather against Marcel, all before he peaked and dominated at lightweight for nearly a decade.

[Thraxox]

I'm not going to be a snob and pretend like Pacquiao doesn't belong in the conversation with these past greats. But with Duran you have to look at the timing. You can't just list the names.

His ATG run at lightweight, victory over the #1 fighter in the world, in his prime and moving up to beat Iran Barkley with no catchweight gives him the edge.

Pac has some great wins and is an ATG in his own right but some of those wins were against past prime fighters and were at catchweights where the opponent was clearly less than 100%.

The "Passed his prime" A level Fighters pacquiao has in his resume, is Mosley and Morales.

Cotto fought at 146 in the Clottey fight, then 145 in the pacquiao bout, and never complained about the catchweight he said in the post fight that he was in his best shape because he can eat and sleep properly.

Pacquiao fought Margo at 150 who balooned to 165. Margo said he was in his best shape, his team confirmed that.

[Thraxox]

Stop it dude, please. This is you being a Manny diehard. It wasn't the gloves, Morales was just slightly better at the time.

Morales was having a tough time making 130 anymore.

Then Bob tried to get him a title at 135 and he took on the lightest hitting champion at the weight and it backfired. Morales left alot of himself in the ring that night.

Go watch that fight., I meant what I said literally-If Raheem had any pop Morales might have never fought again.

I will say this-poster IronDanHamza suggested the 12th round of Morales/Manny 1 did a lot of long teerm damage to Morales. I think that is a fair point even though I may not necessarily agree.

So why did Morales FORCED Pacquiao to wear pillows? Morales was criticized a lot in the media back then for requiring Pacquiao to wear 14 ounce gloves. Stewart, Lampley was started questioning Morales' confidence to win the bout in the commentary to why he needed Pacquiao 14 ounce gloves which he refered that most people call it "Pillows" and would affect Pac's power which is his most important arsenal.

And HE HEADBUTT the hell out of Pacquiao and fought a one eyed PAcquiao from round 5 till round 12 and he still struggled.

Morales also said that the Raheem bout means nothing and that he wanted to silence the critics about the Pacquiao-Morales 1 gloves, saying that the gloves didn't make any difference and he would beat Pacquiao again even with punchers gloves, then he got KO'ed.

ALSO, Pacquiao has been taken 2 ounces of blood 2 days from the fight. Because the first 30 day sample was "Lost" It was so controversial that the FBI was involved in it. It was documented, the doctor himself who took the blood from Pacquiao noted that Pacquiao was getting dizzy and suggested to drink a lot of water, but Pac refused because he was trying to make weight for the fight.

SO DOES THAT SOUND LIKE A CLEAN WIN FOR MORALES? A BOUT THAT WAS LITTERED WITH CONTROVERSIES.

[Nay_Sayer]

So Barrera, Morales, Marquez, 6 wins, all don't add up to a single win over SRL...?

No, they don't. Not even close...

[Nay_Sayer]

Respectfully, Morales had gotten destroyed by Zahir Raheem before Manny beat him. Before he fought Raheem, Morales was 48-2 including a win over Manny. Raheem and after 4-7.

Erik was never the same guy after the Raheem fight. It;s not fair to equate that win with Barrera beating Morales.

In addition to the above, Junior Jones had beaten the *undefeated* Marco Antonio Barrera TWICE before Pacquiao got his hands on him...

[Nay_Sayer]

Then Manny destroyed Raheem....oh wait...he didn't even fight him.

^This

LMAO...