Where Did It All Go Wrong Between Ali and Frazier?

[BWC]

Frazier was a mean, hard, hard man. He grew up tough in Buford, SC, then moved to Philly at 15 already a family man. Ali considered him the N word, an uncle Tom, and Frazier was as bad a MoFo as they come.

Best Ali-Frazier book is "Ghosts of Manila". I recommend every boxing fan check it out.

[BigBadBenn]

Best Ali-Frazier book is "Ghosts of Manila". I recommend every boxing fan check it out.

Ur right about that, great read. The 'This Is Your Life' appearance by Joe was surprising enough to me but then when he went on to lavish as much praise and warmth as he did on Ali it left me wondering too...
I always thought the beef started when Ali asked Joe to join the noi and when Joe refused Ali got all pissy and considered him a traitor and an uncle tom.

[New England]

frazier used to have a reunion with ali whenever it made monetary sense. paid interviews, appearances, etc. from all accounts he was still very bitter toward ali until he died.

i used to work for a radio show, and his publicist used to tell us that "joe is still bitter about some things," and i think that was the best way to describe it.


one of the biggest insults to frazier was muhammad trying to take away his identity as a black man in america, calling him an uncle tom, etc. joe frazier was the son of a share cropper, and literally worked fields when he was young. his youth was anything but favored by white america, and his experience was just as "black" as ali's. ali painted him as a, dumb, subservient and complacent black man, and joe never forgave him for it.


the two were also friends in the 60's, and joe, IIRC, was involved in getting ali a license to train and fight. all of a sudden joe sees this guy he helped out screaming in the media about how he's a gorilla . i'd think the guy two faced, myself.

[aldo5408]

They were never what you call enemies, but Ali hurt Frazier deeply. Frazier helped Ali while he was exiled and upon his return Ali publicly humiliated Frazier and Fraizer was hurt on a personal level, he felt betrayed

Didn't know Ali called the great Frazier a uncle tom. Wow why did he do that? That is very disrespectful. Celebrity or not. What a awful thing to say

[Combat Talk Radio]

Ali did the man dirty after Frazier helped him. Then this which I remember vividly:

[Divine Hammer]

frazier treated ali with kindness and treated him like a true buddy. but ali spat on him and hurt him. very sad story. fraizer didnt deserve the hate he got.

[muslimer12]

Ali called him an Uncle Tom...worst thing you can call a black prideful man

Frazier called him Clay tho, worst thing you can call a nation of islam follower

[Joe Beamish]

They were like opposite poles, at least symbolically, at a time of tremendous change and crisis. Both were "blue collar" in fact, but Ali was pretty, youthful and (self-) educated. Frazier was rural, old school, honorable, stoic, conservative. It seems that the culture of the time tried to align both guys with various interests, regardless of what the men were really like underneath.

[muslimer12]

The same things Ali called Frazier, he called Foreman. Just not the uncle tom part but to be fair frazier called Ali, Clay a lot. Im sure they were never enemies and that he may have held some resentment but also cared for him. Frazier cried for Ali when he talked about his parkinsons and said he wished Ali lived a normal life without the disease.

[LacedUp]

Ali called him an Uncle Tom...worst thing you can call a black prideful man

Joe got over that pretty quickly.

The things Frazier's family had to go through during Manila was probably the worst that happened.