Has Higher Purses Resulted in Weak Fights?

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Problem is boxing doesn't reinvest in itself to grow as a sport. You can't "keep up with the times" when all the guys in charge are raking everything off the top. The sport has like zero mainstream draw mainly because it's disjointed. NBA, NFL, MLB.......they are all leagues, one main governing body and team sports. MMA has the best fighting the best with much lower salaries and it's kicking boxing's ass. I hate to admit it but it's true....boxing's structure is antiquated and entirely counter productive to growth.

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Rath]

Refreshing to see someone on here with common sense because it's definitely not used often around here.

and what was his answer to the thread question, did it resulted to weak fights?

commonsense you say. LOL

[Eff Pandas]

PBC is the epitome of what I'm talking about. Within a year's time, they have gone through nearly half a billion dollars and are putting shows back on the very networks that they virtually tanked to kickstart their endeavor. Their "mainstream" effort is all but done now and they have nothing to show for it except for 200 + boxers wondering where their next checks are going to come from. All these dudes jumped ship because of the exorbitant paydays but as we see now, that stuff was short lived. HBO is now in the same boat, all they are willing to offer is PPV's for non-PPV fights because they simply can't afford to pay these high purses. It is what it is but everyone wants to be Mayweather and the demand isn't there.

I think boxers ride the wave they can get on. Mayweather created a pretty big wave. Most guys can't do that. Most guys are realistic about their abilities to do that. I don't think Mayweather making the money he did is very impactful on the business of boxing in regards to making guys delusional about their earning abilities.

And HBO boxing's boat has nothing to do with paying boxers. It has to do with HBO's diminishing interest in boxing based on the lower & lower budget they give HBO boxing to work with each year for I believe the last 20 years. With HBO boxing's ability to promote the sport & attract talent they could probably do what PBC wants to do & create a NFL of boxing (I mean they kinda already are Boxing's version of the NFL, but I don't think they've ever made much of an effort to have the influence in the sport they could've for their own benefit & for the benefit of the sport) if HBO gave them the money they used to give them 20 or so years ago.

The whole money things works itself out one way or another & it is what it is like you said doe (with PBC or anyone else). Boxers ride the wave of money to whatever heights it goes to & if the tide comes in they deal with that to. Hell we all contend with that in our working lives to one degree or another.

[paulf]

Hauser has touched on it before; purses for a card used to be pretty much equal to the gate. If they sold a mil in tickets, there'd be a mil in tv money.

There's been a change the 10-15 years where guys that have no drawing power are getting huge money because of who is promoting them and, despite many years of being showcased, never turn into a draw. That is not sustainable and a detriment to the sport. Promoters and networks are trying to pick who is the star and not let the the fans vote with their viewership and ticket purchases. If that continues, down the line there will no sport left.

[daggum]

Hauser has touched on it before; purses for a card used to be pretty much equal to the gate. If they sold a mil in tickets, there'd be a mil in tv money.

There's been a change the 10-15 years where guys that have no drawing power are getting huge money because of who is promoting them and, despite many years of being showcased, never turn into a draw. That is not sustainable and a detriment to the sport. Promoters and networks are trying to pick who is the star and not let the the fans vote with their viewership and ticket purchases. If that continues, down the line there will no sport left.

so you are saying andre ward doens't deserve 2 million a fight? but he can attract tens of people! a couple of them might even pay! real honest to goodness money too

[-PBP-]

So you think paying them pennies would make them fight the best

Common sense bro. If you lower the pay. They will

A. Sit out until a big money fight comes along
B. Go to MMA
C. Go to football, basketball, baseball, soccer, hockey or another sport that pays better

In order for boxing to continue to attract talent worldwide, it needs to offer compensation that is competitive to other sports.

[Eff Pandas]

Hauser has touched on it before; purses for a card used to be pretty much equal to the gate. If they sold a mil in tickets, there'd be a mil in tv money.

There's been a change the 10-15 years where guys that have no drawing power are getting huge money because of who is promoting them and, despite many years of being showcased, never turn into a draw. That is not sustainable and a detriment to the sport. Promoters and networks are trying to pick who is the star and not let the the fans vote with their viewership and ticket purchases. If that continues, down the line there will no sport left.

Examples of guys who got overpaid for their drawing power for a long period of time who aren't PBC boxers? I'm sure there are some PBC guys who would fall under this umbrella right now, but I kinda see PBC as an anomaly in the boxing world still that may or may not conform into a successful long term product.

Now I'm sure there are situations where certain guys got overpaid for a fight or even a few fights over a few years, but I suspect there was a more logical reason for that like building a fighter towards a big fight that would even things out more. Or maybe that fighter lost before he got to that big fight, but his purses got lower after the L so the situation worked itself out.

I just have a hard time believing a promoter is overpaying fighters, for no reason & no upside to him, just to overpay a fighter & will continue doing that for a long period of time. And in the event a promoter was doing this that he'd stay in business since that math doesn't work out for very long & without an eventually upside for the overpaying party. Arum isn't in business since the 70's by overpaying guys. I can't imagine anyone who's been in the business 10+ years is overpaying.

[deathofaclown]

I touched on something similar to this last week when someone said only $1m was put up for Loma v Walters.

I said that is not actually a bad amount of money for two guys who are probably not even known by casual fans. The problem is that boxers like this or a guy like Santa Cruz have been getting overpaid to beat up journeymen. If a guy like Santa Cruz is getting paid $1m to fight a factory worker from Mexico, then he's going to want $2m to fight a top level opponent and it's just not viable because they don't generate enough money anyway. So why is he going to accept $1m to fight a good opponent when he can get the same for an easy fight?

Basically some fighters are getting paid way more than they should too soon and then end up pricing themselves out of better fights, and you can't really blame their logic sometimes. Would you move to another job for the same salary, but have to work 3 times as hard? nope.

If fighters were hungry for money, their incentive would be met by better fights if things were run properly. But they're not hungry when they make a million fighting nobodies.

[Eastcoast]

My answer to the question is yes.

There's examples all over the place where Lomo made $750k for an undercard fight vs a scrub, or Lara making $1mill vs a retired WW, or Quillin making around a mill for that Austalian kid. The market value of those fights would never be able to support those paydays. These guys sit back and fight infrequently without having to worry about stepping up b/c they're getting taken care of.

Alot of fighters like Jermall Charlo are getting paid so high, that when a tough fight like J-Rock does come around, the payday is high, but only slightly higher than the ridiculous amount he's currently getting for fighting scrubs. He has a low incentive and a wise-business sense tells him not to risk it.

[Porter's Dad]

It's distorted the market. It's killed fighters competitive spirit of wanting to take on huge fights, as they're making good bank for fighting scrubs, and the financial leap to fighting that guy you're not sure to beat is one that a lot are not willing to take.

Haymon has to take a lot of blame for this. His whole model was.....come sign with me, I'll look after you, I'll make you excellent paydays despite the opponent because of the leverage I have at whatever network I am at now. This is why he secured a whole bunch of fighters. It was his USP.

And now the same thing is damaging to him because his fighters have become used to a certain level of paycheck and it just isn't sustainable, not if he's having the reputed money issues that is being reported.