The Tyson In His Prime Debate. . . Acceptable?

[Left Hook Tua]

I know and I agree. However, for the original point was about prime Tyson. Him losing his prime due to his lack of focus, partying etc is irrelevant to whether or not the best version of Tyson would have beaten these others fighters. That's all I'm saying.

that goes for almost all fighters. kinda unfair to the rest and give mike benefit of doubt.

mike is a beast in heads up theoretical matches though.

[imperial1]

"AT LEAST AS FAR AS BEATING OTHER GREATS"


roy has toney and hop at least. mike doesn't even have that. unless you count old larry.

Old Larry didn't look to bad after Tyson that version would be top 10 today ..

[Left Hook Tua]

Tyson at peak (MENTALLY,PHYSICALLY)

VS. THE GREATS

L - ALI
L - FOREMAN
L - LISTON
W - PATTERSON
W - LOUIS
W - MARCIANO
W - DEMPSEY
W - FRAZIER
L - HOLMES

[Left Hook Tua]

Old Larry didn't look to bad after Tyson that version would be top 10 today ..

we should have seen old larry vs old george

[bigjavi973]

So as most here, I follow a few pages on facebook boxing related and I'm not dis*****g that Tyson is a legend of the sport, that is a given.

But. . . Say for example there's a post about his fight with Lewis, or Holyfield and you'll see comments such as

"Tyson would have beaten them in his prime"

Now, I don't really see the case here, as if you're referring to Tyson's prime we're talking from the age of 18 to like 22, which for me, is not an acceptable argument.

The way I see it, Tyson was a troubled youngster, maybe too much on his shoulders and his young mind at the time. He had the ability to become great, but his own demons were a much tougher battle than anything he faced in the ring.

Cus D'Amato's Tyson would probably beat most fighters in their prime.

[onetwopunch]

- Tyson was one of those fighters who peaked early, and like most young fighters who peak early they burn out quick or make bad choices and are mis guided. To be honest I dont think we had the chance to see the best Tyson, becuase once Cus died it was all down hill for him. But he had all the tools to destroy any heavyweight I can think of with the exception of Ali in my opinion. Ali was just way to smart and versatile in the ring. Tysons head movement and foot work..I have yet to see a heavyweight that comes close to him in that category. And his inside fighting, where he would get leverage on his upper cuts and hooks like no other heavyweight i have seen. These traits is the reason why the people who seen him fight in his younger years say that a "prime" Tyson would have beaten Holyfield and Lenox. And i have to agree with those people. Basically the best Lenox I have seen would not beat the best Tyson I have seen, same goes for Evander.

[bigjavi973]

. . . But then that is on him isn't it? in all due respect. It's not like father time has made him a shell of his former self, but his own lack of discipline and misplaced focus.

He admits that he didn't train for BD, and things didn't really get much better after that.

That's mostly cuz he surrounded himself with people that weren't helping him whatsoever. He stopped pivoting, moving his waist, his head etc. He was being fed this thing that he was this unstoppable monster, so he barely trained because of that. Look at the way he used to fight. He wouldn't just walk right up to a guy & try to hit him. If I remember correctly, read that he even got dropped in sparring. Mix that in with drugs & women. He lost the Douglas fight (imo Douglas was down for 10 count).

[bigjavi973]

tyson was a physical specimen with tools.

speed, power, skill, chin.... name it he got it.

in fantasy matchups he does well because of this.

but kinda like roy he didn't really prove much in the ring. at least as far as beating other greats.

you can argue tyson was superior to frazier and could beat ali too.

but tyson never beat any alis in his career.

ali beat a bunch of tysons. (floyd, joe, sonny, george)

[Left Hook Tua]

how many greats did roy beat?

mccallum was like 40 yrs. old
hopkins wasnt really hopkins yet
you gonna count tito?

toney but toney career was weird.

[SilverMiles]

The Tyson past prime excuse has always been lame. He was talented and with through the heavyweight division like a hot knife though butter but let's be honest the division was weak.

The two only ATG he fought embrassed him.