Marvis Frazier could've been more

[soul_survivor]

I always felt bad for Marvis Frazier, the son of a legend who was trying to walk in his father's foot steps. I think it was obvious he would never have the same pro success as his dad did but the way he was bought along was shameful, fighting a guy like Bugner in only his 10th pro fight, getting matched up with Holmes straight after.

Seriously, Marvis was still a novice learning the tools of the trade yet his father allowed him to be matched up against the best heavyweight on the planet. What followed was a rebuilding process, fights with Tillis and Smith followed. Marvis won both and both those guys were top heavies at the time. It's quite obvious that Marvis didn't have the power or dynamism of his father but he had the skill, sadly his dad once again allowed him to be matched up with a young guy called Mike Tyson. It was a ridiculous choice. From then on, he never fought at the highest level.

If he was handled right, he could have been so much better. Was it a simple case of Joe trying to live a last few moments of glory? Make some money off his son? Why was he so irresponsible with his own flesh and blood?

What do you guys think?

[SUCIO416]

definitely vicarious living


his dad even trained him for the tyson fight

[SthPaw]

In all honesty I do not know much about Marvis Frazier's career in general, but I have heard this said about him once or twice. I have read that he wasn't the same after Tyson destroyed him.

It must be said though that every single time he stepped out there would have been immense pressure, the guy is Joe Frazier's son and I'm sure he had people remind him of that all the time...
So maybe you are right and he should have been brought along a bit smoother than Bugner, Holmes, Smith and Tyson within a few of his developmental years so to speak.
At a glance it seems as though people assumed a lot about him based on who his dad was which is a shame.

[Malik Kaya]

When i first saw the Tyson fight, i thought Marvis was dead they way he fell on his knees with no signs of life in him.

[soul_survivor]

When i first saw the Tyson fight, i thought Marvis was dead they way he fell on his knees with no signs of life in him.

LOL so did I, he just sort of sat there, all life ****** out of him. The uppercut was monstrous!

In all honesty I do not know much about Marvis Frazier's career in general, but I have heard this said about him once or twice. I have read that he wasn't the same after Tyson destroyed him.

It must be said though that every single time he stepped out there would have been immense pressure, the guy is Joe Frazier's son and I'm sure he had people remind him of that all the time...
So maybe you are right and he should have been brought along a bit smoother than Bugner, Holmes, Smith and Tyson within a few of his developmental years so to speak.
At a glance it seems as though people assumed a lot about him based on who his dad was which is a shame.

A bit of background for you, Marvis went 56-2 in his amateur career, winning the junior world championship in the hw division.

In just a handful of fights he beat guys like Smith and Bugner, one a former title challenger, the other a future WBA champ. I think if his dad had truly cared for him and didn't try to cash out and live a few last years of glory, his son could have avoided Holmes and Tyson, built up about 15-20 fights and fought for one of the alphabet titles in a weak era. He probably would've won it, ofc the Tyson bout would have been inevitable but by then he would have gone down as a former champ.

Now he is largely forgotten.

[SthPaw]

A bit of background for you, Marvis went 56-2 in his amateur career, winning the junior world championship in the hw division.

In just a handful of fights he beat guys like Smith and Bugner, one a former title challenger, the other a future WBA champ. I think if his dad had truly cared for him and didn't try to cash out and live a few last years of glory, his son could have avoided Holmes and Tyson, built up about 15-20 fights and fought for one of the alphabet titles in a weak era. He probably would've won it, ofc the Tyson bout would have been inevitable but by then he would have gone down as a former champ.

Now he is largely forgotten.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the summary on him, his amateur career seemed very impressive. I think you could be right in the fact that maybe Joe (directly or indirectly) was a big part on Marvis being put on the fast track before he was ready. Chances are more than likely Tyson would have beaten him regardless, but it would have made for a great moment of history if another Frazier held a title at HW too. As you said at least then he would have gone down as a former champ, also part of the Frazier family and be held in high regards rather than be known by the most part as Smokin' Joe's son that Tyson KO'd...
A shame when you think about it.

[PainfromUkraine]

Good thread - an idea as well for you if you want to move on it would be to create a thread in general about famous boxers and their sons or other close relatives like that following in their footsteps, more often than not not succeeding in this and perhaps if the father or whoever pushed them into boxing for the sake of it, just living off a name etc.

[CubanGuyNYC]

I haven't thought about Marvis in a while, but whenever his name comes up, I always think of the Tyson KO. It was just brutal...ended the kid's career. The consensus always seemed to be that Joe tried to extend his career through his son. Why else would he rush Marvis so quickly? We'll never know what could have been....

[Godsfly]

joe frazier ant a match maker..........he comes from a era of when the best fought the best (he's a old school guy) in his mind the best must fight the best. only recently (the last 12 years) is where we have people picking and choosing & all of this match making.

frazier feels that if you are a fighter you must take on the best in your division period point blank. (the problem is his era of thinking cost his son a few a** beatings)

it wasn't about cashing out his son. the guys back then just thought totally different about the sport of boxing as oppose to today............frazier came up the hard grueling blood sweat & tears way.

he told his son even before he started fighting "you better be sure that this is what you want to do. boxing is not like any other sport. this takes guts and blood. you better be sure that this is what you want to do son"

[CubanGuyNYC]

joe frazier ant a match maker..........he comes from a era of when the best fought the best (he's a old school guy) in his mind the best must fight the best. only recently (the last 12 years) is where we have people picking and choosing & all of this match making.

frazier feels that if you are a fighter you must take on the best in your division period point blank. (the problem is his era of thinking cost his son a few a** beatings)

it wasn't about cashing out his son. the guys back then just thought totally different about the sport of boxing as oppose to today............frazier came up the hard grueling blood sweat & tears way.

It's true that the best tended to fight the best years ago, but everyone thought Joe pushed his son too fast at the time. At least, that's the way I remember it.