The Ring latest P4P, Morales OUT, Wonjongkam IN

[Dirt E Gomez]

Wrong. Pacquiao tried to make the weight, failed and got stirpped of his Title accordingly. He just failed to make the weight. It was his fault but he didn't cheat.

Castillo on the other hand didn't even try and he and his team had no shame in trying to pull off tampering with the scales at the weigh-in. That's bafefaced cheating and shows blatant lack of class.

Hey, if you just don't get it or refuse to get it, then that's your problem.

Yeah, and you have some inside information that Castillo didn't try to make the weight? You saw him pounding away burgers 15 minutes before the way in? Castillo tried, he also knew he could not make the weight a 2nd time. Do you also know that Castillo told his man to try to put his foot under the scale?

I'm not the one not getting it, you are. I refuse to take 2 similar stories and then negate one competely due to personal biasness. Pac fans need to learn this, or, every biased fan for that matter.

[adeelr]

its not a bad list, except for the #10 guy should really be jermaine taylor.

[Jose Rizal]

Yeah, and you have some inside information that Castillo didn't try to make the weight? You saw him pounding away burgers 15 minutes before the way in? Castillo tried, he also knew he could not make the weight a 2nd time. Do you also know that Castillo told his man to try to put his foot under the scale?

I'm not the one not getting it, you are. I refuse to take 2 similar stories and then negate one competely due to personal biasness. Pac fans need to learn this, or, every biased fan for that matter.

LOL! First of all I didn't bring Pacquiao into this, you did. You just refuse to acknowledge that there's no comparison with what happened to them at the scales. Totally different situations, IMHO, and has nothing to do with with the discussion. But hey, if you think I'm biased... that's just too bad.

Coming in at the second attempt heavier shows me he didn’t want to drain himself attempting to make the weight. I never said Castillo himself told any of his people to do anything erroneous, but the fact is that they were caught trying to doctor the scales right in front of the friggin press and the fans for chrissakes! It was from their side that that controversy sprouted. Guilty or not, JLC and his team have to be held accountable for that disgusting act. He had undue advantage over Corrales and didn’t win that fight fair and square.

[medium-deek]

Where's Manny P??

[grayfist]

I think Pac's stoppages should count for a bit more something, although he had a loss to Erik along the way. Thus, I'll have him exchange places with Winky.

I'll keep Rafa on the list, but well below the "Mendoza Line". As for Juan, I'd have Castillo bump him off the whole list. That makes the Featherweight ranks without any representative, if one thinks of Pac as a Jr. Light, just as MAB is. Curious.

Looking at the list, I see MAB who holds two world belts at the weight ranks behind Pac (who has no world belt), and nobody, as yet, is raising hackles. Of course it's not about any particular weight class; it's pound-for-pound after all. It's supposed to trascend weights. Just the same, as Ole Will put it: "Curiouser and curiouser."

As for the Thai, I won't bother trying to spell his name, much less write it. Not yet. If he beats Arce and does more, I'll labor to write his name correctly. Maybe.

As for Taylor, I'm trying to think of other names but could not come up with any. So, I won't mind having him in there.
I won't mind a shorter list either.

[psychopath]

yeah, i just found it funny to write huge like diego who thought it could get his point across better..


Better In terms of opponents fought and beaten? Either of those two, yes.. who really knew Taylor well before Hopkins, hell, who really knows him now compared to any other fighter (other than someone just riding his coat pockets like HBO).

Better in terms of being a crowd draw? This shouldn't have anything to do with rankings.

Better in terms of accomplishment? Taylor beat Hopkins narrowly twice and is now 25-0, they are 44-2-1 (Marquez) and 59-2 (Wonjongkam), a combined 103-4.


here's some more "justification" for those that don't understand why Jermaine "Bad Intentions" Taylor still has yet to make the list on The Ring's Top 10 P4P rankings in favor of Juan Marquez and Pongsaklek Wonjongkam..

59-2 Wonjongkam is easily the best flyweight in boxing right now, and just because you haven't seen him on television doesn't make it untrue. I've heard rumors on him fighting in the US sometime soon and he's deserved to be on the list for sometime (when making my own P4P rankings a few days back, i actually almost had him on the list as well).

Juan Manuel Marquez is similarily 44-2 with a single draw with Pacquiao, the fact that he was able to come back from a 3 KD ROUND and pull out a draw (in a fight that some even think he came back to win in), means he's got some P4P credit to his name already. Since then, he's beaten every opponent he's faced significantly.

Just because every Jermaine Taylor fight from now on is available on tv thanks to HBO, it doesn't mean there aren't fighters out there who's fights aren't televised and carried by a major distributor (HBO) that deserve to be above him in pound for pound standings.

Also, i'm not going to believe that "The Ring", a magazine with more than 80 years under it's belt, is going to become a "Taylor hater" because it's fashionable. They just see through the HBO/DiBella hype like many others do. Jermaine Taylor has successfully defeated Bernard Hopkins by two close decisions, you have to give him that (everyone does).. but now... name me something else 'outstanding' he has done to get him in the rankings.... anything? .... exactly.

Listen, if he successfully defends a few times, or even just once against a worthy opponent, he'll be on the list, but as i say AGAIN.. there's no way he should be in the top 10 yet until he's done a little more than win 2 close-narrow decisions with a man getting close to retirement(taking nothing away from either of the fights).

Wow very long litany of craps.

You seems to be HYPERACTIVE today friend.

Better in terms of opponents fought and beaten . . . yes? Bull****! What crap is that?

JMM has 47 fights. He got his WBA belt from an aging Medina who's got 14 loses, and his IBF belt from "Chicken Gainer" who literally handed his belt to him. The goddam chicken didn't threw a single punch and kept running all night. JMM fought 46 bums and just 1 quality opponent in Pacquaio where he was gifted with a "magical draw" aided by a senile judge. What quality opponent are you talking about?

Same with Wongjongkam. Check the list of his opponets and point out who were the big named fighters that he fought. Arce has been chasing his coward ass for quite sometimes now but he keeps hiding in asia where keeps padding his records with wins by fighting BUM fighters.

Who is Taylor before he beat Bhops? Well who is Manny Pacquaio before he beat Barrera? Pacquiao's victory brought him up inside the p4p list so why shouldn't that rule apply to Taylor? The fact that Taylor beat the longest reigning undisputed Middle Weight Champ and the NO 1 P4P TWICE, that should be enough for the guy to make it to the list. Irregardless how close that may be.

Your hatred for Taylor is affecting your objectivity.

[mr. bojangles]

i think i'm missing somethin here. will someone please enlighten me, why is the Thai on that list?




i basically agree the ratings, except

Castillo should be higher than Juan Manuel Marquez (i mean, who has he fought besides decisioning Victor Polo last year?) and where's Jermain Taylor?

[mr. bojangles]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam

Alias Pongsaklek Sitkanongsak
Country Thai
Global Id TH-00-034051
Birthplace Nakhon Ratchasima, Thailand
Division Flyweight
Age 28
Born 1977-08-11
Stance Southpaw
Height 163
Manager Virat Vajiratanawongse


Career Record © www.boxrec.com

Date Opponent W-L-D Location Result
2005-12-23 Isidro Balabat 5-3-0 Petchaboon, Thailand W TD 5
2005-10-10 Daisuke Naito 27-1-2 Tokyo, Japan W TD 7
WBC Flyweight Title
2005-07-29 Mark Sales 11-26-3 ****kok, Thailand W UD 6
2005-04-29 Daniel Diolan 15-11-1 Petchburi Province, Thail W TKO 3
2005-01-29 Noriyuki Komatsu 19-1-5 Osaka, Japan W TKO 5
WBC Flyweight Title
2004-11-26 Mark Sales 11-23-3 Chiengrai, Thailand W UD 8
2004-10-08 Randy Mangubat 31-20-12 Phuket, Thailand W UD 10
2004-07-15 Luis Angel Martinez 14-4-2 Khonkaen, Thailand W TKO 5
WBC Flyweight Title
2004-04-30 Ronnie Canete 18-14-2 Nakornrachasima, Thailand W KO 3
2004-01-03 Trash Nakanuma 23-4-0 Yokohama, Japan W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2003-11-14 Hussein Hussein 23-0-0 ****kok, Thailand W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2003-07-25 Jaime Acerda 8-13-0 Chaiyaphum, Chaiyaphum Pr W KO 9
2003-06-06 Randy Mangubat 31-17-11 Songkla, Thailand W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2002-11-26 Hidenobu Honda 25-1-0 Osaka, Japan W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2002-09-06 Jesus Martinez 15-2-0 Rangsit, Thailand W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2002-04-19 Daisuke Naito 19-0-2 Khonkaen, Thailand W KO 1
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-12-06 Luis Alberto Lazarte 19-4-1 Pattaya, Thailand W TKO 2
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-10-26 Alex Baba 18-1-0 Hatyai, Thailand W TD 8
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-07-15 Hayato Asai 16-2-2 Nagoya, Japan W TKO 5
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-05-08 Alvin Felicilda 1-4-1 Udonthai, Thailand W PTS 10
2001-03-02 Malcolm Tunacao 11-0-1 Pichit, Thailand W TKO 1
WBC Flyweight Title
2000-12-29 Ramil Anito 16-18-3 Koh Kong Island, Cambodia W TKO 5
2000-09-22 Nathan Barcelona 22-27-2 Saraburi, Thailand W TKO 6
2000-08-25 Jinar Milla 0-1-0 Sakolnakorn, Thailand W TKO 3
2000-07-01 Ramil Anito 16-15-3 Nakhon Pathom, Thailand W PTS 10
2000-05-19 Texas Gomez 17-31-6 Udon Thani, Thailand W KO 7
2000-03-17 Mark Sales 5-5-1 Roi-et, Thailand W PTS 10
2000-02-25 Joven Simbajon 14-24-6 Samut Sakorn, Thailand W PTS 8
2000-01-29 Armando Rocil 1-2-0 ****kok, Thailand W KO 2
1999-12-25 Ritichai Kiatprapas 24-4-0 ****kok, Thailand W KO 3
1999-11-12 Rolando Baclayo 15-13-2 Saraburi, Thailand W KO 6
1999-09-17 Randy Mangubat 20-15-9 Nakhon Si Thammarat, Thai W PTS 8
1999-07-23 Texas Gomez 17-29-6 Yala, Thailand W KO 3
1999-06-13 Jose Orozco 0-1-0 ****kok, Thailand W KO 2
1999-04-30 Dennis Sabsal 12-6-3 Tunsong, Thailand W PTS 8
1999-02-05 Emer Barrientos 5-6-4 Pattalung, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-12-04 Roy Tarazona 11-17-4 Phuttamonthon, Thailand W PTS 8
1998-11-14 Allan Llanita 13-3-4 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 6
1998-10-23 Ramil Gevero 7-21-1 Sakon Nakhon, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-07-30 Dennis Sabsal 10-3-3 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-06-05 Juanito Rubillar 10-2-5 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-04-22 Rodulfo Fernandez 15-19-8 ****kok, Thailand W KO 2
1998-02-27 Jerry Pahayahay 28-27-1 Koh Samui, Surat Thani, T W PTS 10
1997-11-12 Alpong Navaja 20-38-5 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 10
1997-09-26 Ramil Gevero 5-16-1 Saraburi, Thailand W PTS 10
1997-08-01 Jaime Aliguin 19-28-4 Chantaburi, Thailand W PTS 10
1997-05-09 Lolito Laroa 9-11-4 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 6
1997-03-28 Mzukisi Sikali 19-4-1 Nongtha Buri, Thailand W TKO 1
WBU Light Flyweight Title
1996-11-22 Roy Tarazona 8-7-4 Surin, Thailand W TKO 3
1996-10-04 Randy Mangubat 10-10-6 Roi-et, Thailand W KO 3
1996-07-11 Jerry Pahayahay 25-21-1 Kalasin, Thailand L KO 5
1996-05-24 Juanito Rubillar 9-0-5 Petchaboon, Thailand W KO 4
1996-04-04 Ramon Algora 2-8-0 Udonthani, Thailand W KO 1
1995-12-22 Jerry Pahayahay 24-18-1 Sakon Nakhon, Thailand L PTS 8
1995-11-05 Ramil Gevero 3-5-1 Saraburi, Thailand W TKO 5
1995-09-25 Alpong Navaja 16-22-4 ****kok, Thailand W TKO 4
1995-08-27 Bernardo Jun Davalos 12-8-2 Rangsit, Thailand W KO 2
1995-05-14 Rolando Tadle 2-2-1 Lampang, Thailand W KO 4
1995-04-27 Rex Remias 12-5-3 ****kok, Thailand W KO 1
1995-03-12 Al Tarazona 19-13-5 Phitsanulok, Thailand W TKO 8
1994-12-21 Bernardo Jun Davalos 12-5-1 ****kok, Thailand W KO 3

Record to Date
Won 59 (KOs 31) Lost 2 Drawn 0 Total 61


-----------------------------------------------------------------



restless_438


tell me how he's become the "best flyweight in the world today" and not Jorge Arce. by fighting a certain Mark Sales (11-26-3)twice? a Randy Mangubat (31-20-12) 4 times? a cab driver named Nathan Barcelona (22-27-2)? Isidro Balabat (5-3-1)? this guy obviously has a padded record and just been preying on helpless bums.


Hussein Hussein and Malcolm Tunacao are the only live fighters on that record.

[restless_438]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam

Alias Pongsaklek Sitkanongsak
Country Thai
Global Id TH-00-034051
Birthplace Nakhon Ratchasima, Thailand
Division Flyweight
Age 28
Born 1977-08-11
Stance Southpaw
Height 163
Manager Virat Vajiratanawongse


Career Record © www.boxrec.com

Date Opponent W-L-D Location Result
2005-12-23 Isidro Balabat 5-3-0 Petchaboon, Thailand W TD 5
2005-10-10 Daisuke Naito 27-1-2 Tokyo, Japan W TD 7
WBC Flyweight Title
2005-07-29 Mark Sales 11-26-3 ****kok, Thailand W UD 6
2005-04-29 Daniel Diolan 15-11-1 Petchburi Province, Thail W TKO 3
2005-01-29 Noriyuki Komatsu 19-1-5 Osaka, Japan W TKO 5
WBC Flyweight Title
2004-11-26 Mark Sales 11-23-3 Chiengrai, Thailand W UD 8
2004-10-08 Randy Mangubat 31-20-12 Phuket, Thailand W UD 10
2004-07-15 Luis Angel Martinez 14-4-2 Khonkaen, Thailand W TKO 5
WBC Flyweight Title
2004-04-30 Ronnie Canete 18-14-2 Nakornrachasima, Thailand W KO 3
2004-01-03 Trash Nakanuma 23-4-0 Yokohama, Japan W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2003-11-14 Hussein Hussein 23-0-0 ****kok, Thailand W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2003-07-25 Jaime Acerda 8-13-0 Chaiyaphum, Chaiyaphum Pr W KO 9
2003-06-06 Randy Mangubat 31-17-11 Songkla, Thailand W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2002-11-26 Hidenobu Honda 25-1-0 Osaka, Japan W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2002-09-06 Jesus Martinez 15-2-0 Rangsit, Thailand W UD 12
WBC Flyweight Title
2002-04-19 Daisuke Naito 19-0-2 Khonkaen, Thailand W KO 1
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-12-06 Luis Alberto Lazarte 19-4-1 Pattaya, Thailand W TKO 2
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-10-26 Alex Baba 18-1-0 Hatyai, Thailand W TD 8
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-07-15 Hayato Asai 16-2-2 Nagoya, Japan W TKO 5
WBC Flyweight Title
2001-05-08 Alvin Felicilda 1-4-1 Udonthai, Thailand W PTS 10
2001-03-02 Malcolm Tunacao 11-0-1 Pichit, Thailand W TKO 1
WBC Flyweight Title
2000-12-29 Ramil Anito 16-18-3 Koh Kong Island, Cambodia W TKO 5
2000-09-22 Nathan Barcelona 22-27-2 Saraburi, Thailand W TKO 6
2000-08-25 Jinar Milla 0-1-0 Sakolnakorn, Thailand W TKO 3
2000-07-01 Ramil Anito 16-15-3 Nakhon Pathom, Thailand W PTS 10
2000-05-19 Texas Gomez 17-31-6 Udon Thani, Thailand W KO 7
2000-03-17 Mark Sales 5-5-1 Roi-et, Thailand W PTS 10
2000-02-25 Joven Simbajon 14-24-6 Samut Sakorn, Thailand W PTS 8
2000-01-29 Armando Rocil 1-2-0 ****kok, Thailand W KO 2
1999-12-25 Ritichai Kiatprapas 24-4-0 ****kok, Thailand W KO 3
1999-11-12 Rolando Baclayo 15-13-2 Saraburi, Thailand W KO 6
1999-09-17 Randy Mangubat 20-15-9 Nakhon Si Thammarat, Thai W PTS 8
1999-07-23 Texas Gomez 17-29-6 Yala, Thailand W KO 3
1999-06-13 Jose Orozco 0-1-0 ****kok, Thailand W KO 2
1999-04-30 Dennis Sabsal 12-6-3 Tunsong, Thailand W PTS 8
1999-02-05 Emer Barrientos 5-6-4 Pattalung, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-12-04 Roy Tarazona 11-17-4 Phuttamonthon, Thailand W PTS 8
1998-11-14 Allan Llanita 13-3-4 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 6
1998-10-23 Ramil Gevero 7-21-1 Sakon Nakhon, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-07-30 Dennis Sabsal 10-3-3 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-06-05 Juanito Rubillar 10-2-5 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 10
1998-04-22 Rodulfo Fernandez 15-19-8 ****kok, Thailand W KO 2
1998-02-27 Jerry Pahayahay 28-27-1 Koh Samui, Surat Thani, T W PTS 10
1997-11-12 Alpong Navaja 20-38-5 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 10
1997-09-26 Ramil Gevero 5-16-1 Saraburi, Thailand W PTS 10
1997-08-01 Jaime Aliguin 19-28-4 Chantaburi, Thailand W PTS 10
1997-05-09 Lolito Laroa 9-11-4 ****kok, Thailand W PTS 6
1997-03-28 Mzukisi Sikali 19-4-1 Nongtha Buri, Thailand W TKO 1
WBU Light Flyweight Title
1996-11-22 Roy Tarazona 8-7-4 Surin, Thailand W TKO 3
1996-10-04 Randy Mangubat 10-10-6 Roi-et, Thailand W KO 3
1996-07-11 Jerry Pahayahay 25-21-1 Kalasin, Thailand L KO 5
1996-05-24 Juanito Rubillar 9-0-5 Petchaboon, Thailand W KO 4
1996-04-04 Ramon Algora 2-8-0 Udonthani, Thailand W KO 1
1995-12-22 Jerry Pahayahay 24-18-1 Sakon Nakhon, Thailand L PTS 8
1995-11-05 Ramil Gevero 3-5-1 Saraburi, Thailand W TKO 5
1995-09-25 Alpong Navaja 16-22-4 ****kok, Thailand W TKO 4
1995-08-27 Bernardo Jun Davalos 12-8-2 Rangsit, Thailand W KO 2
1995-05-14 Rolando Tadle 2-2-1 Lampang, Thailand W KO 4
1995-04-27 Rex Remias 12-5-3 ****kok, Thailand W KO 1
1995-03-12 Al Tarazona 19-13-5 Phitsanulok, Thailand W TKO 8
1994-12-21 Bernardo Jun Davalos 12-5-1 ****kok, Thailand W KO 3

Record to Date
Won 59 (KOs 31) Lost 2 Drawn 0 Total 61


-----------------------------------------------------------------



restless_438


tell me how he's become the "best flyweight in the world today" and not Jorge Arce. by fighting a certain Mark Sales (11-26-3)twice? a Randy Mangubat (31-20-12) 4 times? a cab driver named Nathan Barcelona (22-27-2)? Isidro Balabat (5-3-1)? this guy obviously has a padded record and just been preying on helpless bums.


Hussein Hussein and Malcolm Tunacao are the only live fighters on that record.

you make your elite knowledge known when you get all your information from boxrec.com and make in known by copy/paste... glad you can see who's fought legit opponents or not through looking at names and records on a website and not seeing actual fights... have you seen even one fight from Wonjongkam? btw, i'm a big Jorge Arce fan and i'd never take anything away from him.
And for psycho or anyone else saying that Taylor's two close decisions to Hopkins were enough to get him on the P4P rankings.. again, IMO (and ya'll need to calm down in general cause it's just my opinion) he's on the edge right now, if he just would prove he deserves the attention he's getting and fight someone worthwhile, he'll be on the list.. but psycho, you obviously only the read parts of my post that you wanted to read.

[Papa Ace]

wong-JOKE-lam who? u must be kiddin me..