God Gifted/Shoulder Roll

[Mr.0pal]

LOL, James Toney a tremendous athlete, I must be an elite athlete then.

Pretty sure Floyd was not born with the knowledge of the shoulder roll so it is not God gifted.

And it is taught in gyms it is a basic move in boxing, boxing 101 and a lot fighters use this.

James was much better when he was at 160 and 168 with that defense. The heavier he got the more he got hit but he was still advanced using the style. James has great natural upper body movement but his downfall is his led feet.

[D4thincarnation]

James was much better when he was at 160 and 168 with that defense. The heavier he got the more he got hit but he was still advanced using the style. James has great natural upper body movement but his downfall is his led feet.

Not questioning Toney's technique, but it had to do with skill not athleticism.
Thats why when Toney made Burger King his second home his defensive skills were still there.

[ShoulderRoll]

Not that many people know how to teach the move properly. You pretty much have to find an old American trainer from back in the day.

For instance James Toney learned it from Pops Miller, and the Mayweathers picked it up from the old Michigan trainers.

[Mr.0pal]

Not questioning Toney's technique, but it had to do with skill not athleticism.
Thats why when Toney made Burger King his second home his defensive skills were still there.

The fact that this style involves a lot of upper body activity means that athleticism is a factor. He developed the skill through his athleticism. If you don't have good athleticism you'll never master the amount of slipping, ducking, head movement ect. required to be effective.

[MRBOOMER]

The fact that this style involves a lot of upper body activity means that athleticism is a factor. He developed the skill through his athleticism. If you don't have good athleticism you'll never master the amount of slipping, ducking, head movement ect. required to be effective.

That's not true Judah had all that he just sucks at it lol.

[BillyBoxing]

Yes... but more so, to use the philly shell defense masterfully requires great natural athleticism because you're using a lot of upper body twisting, ducking and rolling. Pause the video when you see Floyd duck left hooks and you'll see his head is level with his knees. You have to be fast at doing it because punches come fast. Look at how badly Oscar failed trying to use this style when he fought Mayorga. It takes great conditioning and natural reflexes.

Natural athleticism...

Natural reflexes...

How do you know it's natural or not?

Oscar failed because you don't learn it in few weeks.

Floyd has without a doubt the body and the genetic background of an athlete,but his reflexes aren't natural IMO, it has been worked and worked for years with his uncle and father, dude is a boxing gym rat since his first steps...he has never done anything else in his life, and that's why he is a so narrow minded person who don't know shat about "real" life living in his small Money May Family world since the cradle.

[BillyBoxing]

Not that many people know how to teach the move properly. You pretty much have to find an old American trainer from back in the day.

For instance James Toney learned it from Pops Miller, and the Mayweathers picked it up from the old Michigan trainers.

And a lot of boxing trainer don't teach defense, they just scream at you "keep your hands up" and that's it.

Boxing training is 95% offense, 5% defense in most boxing gyms.

[edgarg]

do you really need to be god gifted to perform the shoulder roll and be good at it? seems like Floyd is the only really good boxer doing it at this moment. why donīt they teach this technique more often at the gyms?

It's wel known, and often quoted by historians that that many old time excellent techniques have been lost due to more modern styles having evolved. The shoulder roll is just one of them. In years gone by, many boxers used it. It ws nothing special.

[Jedi Vader]

I started a new boxing gym and started using the Philly shell in their Match-group.
Lol the coach screamed for me keep my hands up.
He actually took me to the side and tried to show me how to block the traditional way.
Forced me to train traditional blocking for a whole ****ing training session

It's funny I sparred with the Philly shell and the other guy didn't land a single punch, yet the coach thought I didn't know how to block because I used philly shell.

People get so ingrained wiht the "always keep your hands up" the whole concept is instinctively offensive to trainers.

Great post.

LOL, James Toney a tremendous athlete, I must be an elite athlete then.

Pretty sure Floyd was not born with the knowledge of the shoulder roll so it is not God gifted.

And it is taught in gyms it is a basic move in boxing, boxing 101 and a lot fighters use this.

How come your idol gets hit so often then if it's such a 'basic' move?

Natural athleticism...

Natural reflexes...

How do you know it's natural or not?

Oscar failed because you don't learn it in few weeks.

Floyd has without a doubt the body and the genetic background of an athlete,but his reflexes aren't natural IMO, it has been worked and worked for years with his uncle and father, dude is a boxing gym rat since his first steps...he has never done anything else in his life, and that's why he is a so narrow minded person who don't know shat about "real" life living in his small Money May Family world since the cradle.

Sorry Bro.

You can't enhance or work your reflexes like you say you can. You simply have to accept the reflexes you are born with. Floyd's reflexes are almost cat like, similarly to Roy Jones Jr. If they could be worked on or enhanced, every cat would be in the gym trying to make them better.

[edgarg]

the fighters that were best at it were tremendous athletes. the jame's toneys and the floyd mayweathers. so id say so.hell roger mayweather used it as well and he also had tremendous physical gifts. its rally not an easy style to master and its clearly not for everyone.

It was Mayweather senior who taught his son. If you look at a video of the father, you'll see it clearly.