Pacquiao/Marquez Post Fight Discussion- Please re-vote in the poll. .

[kbpoetree]

HBO been doin this for years overhypen "their" guy...did it on the Taylor and Hop fight very badly...its a money game unfortunatly and they got paid to advertise Pac..

[Doctor_Tenma]

in the 12th
pacquiao landed a left in the inside, a lead counter left to the head, a straight left to the body, marquez lands one right and later pacquiao check hooks marquez with the right, now with around 40-30 seconds left marquez throws a fient, one-two that hits nothing, pacquiao throws a right hook to the body as juan moves away, pacquiao lands a straight left that marquez plays off by putting his hands down and going pernell whitaker on his ass

and that's it, no way it's a marquez round

You've got to be kidding me, I'm watching it right now and nothing happened. First minute nothing happened, second minute both are landing glancing blows, Pacquiao lands 2 decent straight left hands, Marquez lands a decent right hand, Pacquiao's mouth piece falls out and nothing happens after that. Your truly over exaggerating here, that's not a round in which you could say either guy clearly won it, both looked spent, Pacquiao was cautious.

Like I said, anyway you score is fine.

[THE_BIG_HURT]

Just saw the fight recently, many thanks to obama for uploading the fight. I didnt watch the fight on saturday just checked out the comments section on nsb and i hear a lot of atrocious robbery posts against marquez and i made a effort to watch the fight multiple times before i made this thread. Its becoming common place that right after a fight a lot of sensationalized proclamations based on knee jerk reactions are made without much thought.

I thought i should wait, download the fight, watch it a couple of times and give it a proper viewing and analysis:


Round 1: MP 10 JMM 9

Could have gone either way, Really close round. JMM landed clean potshotting body punches, MP landed straight lefts. MP landed more by way of compubox. Both traded punches at the end with a low blow from JMM at the end. really close round that could have gone either way.

Round 2: JMM 10 MP 9

Another close round. MP threw more, landed more. JMM landed the cleaner punches, a couple of straight rights. I scored both round 1 & 2 a draw because they were so close but on second review it seemed as if MP won the first and JMM won the second.

Round 3: MP 10 JMM 9

First definitive round for MP. Landed clean lefts, jabs, and countered JMM with right hooks. JMM caught MP with some nice looping right hooks and straights but not enough to win a close round. Compubox i think had them even in landed punches.

Round 4: MP 10 JMM 9

Another definitive round for MP. Landed lots of straight lefts, lead lefts. MP landed and threw more by way of compubox. JMM caught MP with a couple of counter straight rights at the end of the round, but a clear round for a much aggressive MP.

Round 5: JMM 10 MP 9

First definitive round for JMM. Left uppercuts straight right hand combos working beautifully for JMM. Rocked MP on his heels late in the round. MP tried to come on late in the round with some straight lefts but a huge round for JMM.

Round 6: MP 10 JMM 9

Another close round. Very hard to score for either guy. JMM landed some more straight rights, MP landed his lefts. JMM threw body punches, some landed some caught a lot of MP's guard and elbows. Gave it to MP by narrowest of margins. It was JMM's lowest output.

Round 7: JMM 10 MP 9

Clear round for JMM, his best round so far. Looping right hooks, left uppercuts, clean big shots that landed. MP far too tentative and fighting at JMM's pace. Weird to know that MP out landed JMM 16-11.

Round 8: JMM 10 MP 9

Another clear definitive round for JMM. Clean lead rights, counter rights, single body shots. MP made it closer but JMM takes it for cleaner shots.

Round 9: MP 10 JMM 9

Best round of the fight so far. JMM controlled the first part of the round, single pot shots in spurts. MP regained control the middle of the rounds with aggressive jab straight left combos. Last part of the round was the best as both guys traded shots. Another close round for MP in my opinion.

Round 10: Draw 9-9

I have no idea won this round. Another excruciatingly close round. Again, MP landed more but it seemed as if it was a JMM round. Lots of exchanges were both guys landed on each other at the very same time. MP is cut, but JMM was far too tentative to seize the opportunity to capitalize on it. MP could hav edged it due to his aggression when he found out he was cut. MP threw 50 punches to JMM's 37.

Round 11: MP 10 JMM 9

Another close round but i felt MP took this round. JMM became even far more tentative. MP landed lots of 1-2s on JMM while JMM countered single shot right hands but far too few in between. Compubox for that round give a clear edge to MP.

Round 12: MP 10 JMM 9

Clear round for MP. He's the only one that did anything. JMM basically shut it down and for the last couple of rounds was doing his best de la hoya vs trinidad impression.


Analysis:

It really did a disservice to marquez when beristain told him that he was winning a fight. I think their impression of how the fight was going was somewhat warped due to the fact that marquez never hit the canvas. He became far too tentative when he needed to pick up the pace. Even in this fight when pacquiao was cut, marquez left him off the hook. In their 2nd fight, he went after pacquiao when he was cut then relented again.

I saw the fight first on pure entertainment value, then watched it a 2nd time to score the fight, and a third time just to get some more thoughts and analysis. Let me just say i am not a philipino nor mexican but a old white guy that's been watching boxing since the 70s. It was a close fight and anybody that says marquez CLEARLY won or CLEARLY dominated is out of their mind.

Through round 11, pacquiao threw 541 to marquez 400. Pacquiao landed 158 punches to marquez 127. Pacquiao 29% to Marquez 32%. After watching the fight several times, i am shocked to see how so many people say marquez dominated pacquiao. This was a very close fight with so many close rounds and was very difficult to score. I had the benefit of a vlc player to pause and look at the fight again and knowledge of compubox scores yet i found so many rounds difficult to score for both guys.

In the end, taking out the sound of the pro mexican crowd, the regular biases of the hbo crew, in my honest opinion i saw pacquiao win this fight. marquez fought brilliantly for his age, the weight, and the given opponent but you cant scream blatant robbery in a very close fight were you were out punched and out landed by a much more aggressive fighter who by the way is arguably the biggest star in the sport.

thanks for a well thought out post. I can care less who thinks who won. I just like that somebody came on here intelligently without sounding like a fanboy.
Marquez fought Great, i left the bar saying we just saw a classic from 2 of the best and i was satisfied. People saying one guy dominated either way are just wrong imo

[SplitSecond]

You've got to be kidding me, I'm watching it right now and nothing happened. First minute nothing happened, second minute both are landing glancing blows, Pacquiao lands 2 decent straight left hands, Marquez lands a decent right hand, Pacquiao's mouth piece falls out and nothing happens after that. Your truly over exaggerating here, that's not a round in which you could say either guy clearly won it, both looked spent, Pacquiao was cautious.

Like I said, anyway you score is fine.

im the one that should be saying this, seriously hilarious

[SplitSecond]

did the punches i mentioned not happen or somethin?
you saw the right hand from marquez that i saw, but didn't see the punches from pacquiao that i saw? take your biased glasses off man, seriously

[Toyman]

very good unbiased post.

i have the exact same scorecard, except th 9-9 was 10-9 for pac since he was the aggressor.


116-112 for pac, 115-113 if you have to give a round to jmm, but there is no way jmm won this fight lol!

pac wins trilogy 3-0.

[Doctor_Tenma]

did the punches i mentioned not happen or somethin?
you saw the right hand from marquez that i saw, but didn't see the punches from pacquiao that i saw? take your biased glasses off man, seriously

Other than the 2 straight left hands from Manny and Marquez's straight right, everything else was glancing. Just not a round either guy clearly won.

[savorduhflavor]

6 and 10 were clear Marquez rounds. Don't see how they could be scored any other way.

[El-Canelo]

9-9 ? ???

10 point MUST system ... clues in the name

[loui_ludwig]

I am really not keen on a 4th fight. If you look at the 3 fights:

1st fight: a draw but a judge made a mistake on the scoring of the 1st round. If it was corrected, it favored Pacquiao.
2nd fight: split decision for Pac due to the knockdown.
3rd fight: Majority decision for Pac.

So if there is a 4th fight, it will be leaning towards a UD for Pac.

I am not interested in a 4th fight but JM Marquez deserves a rematch.