why all of a sudden is groves the underdog????explain.

[PRINCE O' PROSE]

BUMP,




interesting thread.

[J.R]

Thats nonsense Locke , Smith tried his hardest , what evidence do you have of this?

No evidence, merely what I stated in that exact post you quoted, if you were Warren, would you put your main prospect in with somebody as supposedly dangerous as Smith? Without insurance? Or the guarantee your money spinner would come out on top???

Really?

Frank wouldn't.

So no, it's not nonsense, at all.

[J.R]

I mean, Adamu looked pretty bad in edging by Carl Dilks, a guy DeGale blew away. But none of these triangulations really speak much to how this fight will go down.


Ofc, the bookmakers' odds have a lot to do with how smoothly DeGale navigated Smith and the life and death manner of Groves' win over Anderson.


But if you just look at what each guy does in there, it tells you something.

Looking exciting and spectacular had glossed over Groves' flaws to a certain degree, but I think even his best performances have lacked structure and have shown him to be a quite one-dimensional fighter with not the coolest of heads and relatively few wrinkles to his game. In the corner, Adam Booth doesn't have much on-point, practical advice for him; the look of confusion on Groves' face while being berated for "slugging with a slugger" between rounds of his fight with Anderson was quite amusing, although I felt for him in that situation. In his favor, Groves has demonstrated a level of fighting heart that DeGale hasn't needed to show yet.

DeGale is more defensively sound, more consistent with the jab, more fleetfooted/smartfooted (yeah, I made up a word), more rounded and a lot more patient and guilesome. And it's hard to see how Groves can beat him style-wise. This is why I favor DeGale clearly. He has some points to prove in certain intangible areas, but he's emerging as a quite crafty fighter with potential to be a reasonable achiever at world level in the future.


I think a lot of people want this to be a highly competetive, dramatic, back and forth encounter in the Eubank-Benn mould, but I imagine DeGale controlling Groves and systematically breaking him down for as long as it takes to get him out of there. And that feeling of a predictable, fairly one-sided outcome is why I decided against making the trip down to see it in person.

How do you see DeGale reacting should Groves tag him with a couple of heavy shots? I can't remember seeing his chin being tested as much as Groves could, potentially....

[hogey]

Groves has fought the better men and for me will be that little bit more battle hardened, Adamu is better than anyone on Degales record and Kenny Anderson was not a mug dont forget he was the reigning Commonwealth gold medalist and undefeated in 11 fights so not a push over for Groves in only his 11th fight. Paul Smith is the only name worth talking about on Degales record and he is on the slide and and really just a middleweight.
I will go against the general opinion and predict a 9th round KO for Groves, i have a feeling Degale is not half as confident as he is making out and if things start going wrong i can see him unravelling. Groves punching power and mental strength will be the difference for me.

[gingeralbino]

How do you see DeGale reacting should Groves tag him with a couple of heavy shots? I can't remember seeing his chin being tested as much as Groves could, potentially....

thats what i was about to say, we've seen Groves in trouble and how he responded, he was able to snatch victory from the jaws of defeat, thats a good quality to have.

I cant remember seeing de gale hurt badly, how is he going to react? But, more importantly, is Groves going to be able to hurt him in the first place?

Cant wait for this fight, i thnk de gale wins a close hard fight, but im hoping Groves proves me wrong.

[J.R]

I'm just pumped up, should be a great fight and a good night out for me.

[junior gong]

I'm just pumped up, should be a great fight and a good night out for me.

Good on you, wish I was going. Gonna be having an all dayer though, bbq, load of friends coming round. Good times! Gutted about Clev-Braehmer though.

[The_Demon]

Because Degale is clearly the more skilled fighter

[SplitSecond]

because degale fights all conservative like, thus = more skillful

[PRINCE O' PROSE]

How do you see DeGale reacting should Groves tag him with a couple of heavy shots? I can't remember seeing his chin being tested as much as Groves could, potentially....

That's one of the intangible areas DeGale is still unproven in. He ate a few decent shots from Smith, nothing too heavy. More importantly, though, I see Groves having trouble landing his most hurtful stuff on DeGale. He needs to find DeGale's body consistently first, IMO, but whether or not he can is another matter.

No evidence, merely what I stated in that exact post you quoted, if you were Warren, would you put your main prospect in with somebody as supposedly dangerous as Smith? Without insurance? Or the guarantee your money spinner would come out on top???

Really?

Frank wouldn't.

So no, it's not nonsense, at all.

"Supposedly" being the operative word. Warren knew DeGale was levels above Smith.


A risk is Warren putting one of his boys in with someone he didn't know, i.e. the two examples from recent history that I cited before.

Warren put Khan in with Prescott purely on the recommendation of Jorge Rubio; you saw what happened there.

Warren sent Kevin Mitchell over to the US to meet a well-travelled, cagey, durable southpaw in Walter Estrada; Estrada beat Mitchell black and blue, and Kevin, who (bizarrely) had no southpaw sparring coming into the match, was somewhat fortunate to escape with his '0' intact after the fight ended on a quite odd stoppage.

Warren would have been advised as to the risk level and obviously felt comfortable enough and had confidence enough in his two prized charges to make those fights. But they were greater risks, in truth, than putting DeGale in with Smith, both of whose abilities Warren knows firsthand.



Mitchell-Murray is a fight where I think Warren is 1.) using Mitchell as a bridge opponent to test Murray's potential for success above domestic/Euro level (Kev being in a limbo between domestic/Euro level and world class himself) 2.) giving Mitchell one last chance to prove he's worth a second push.

Murray has that bull**** Ring rating, but both of these fighters' ability to do anything on the world level is really in question, both can be considered duds for different reasons; it's now or never for both guys, which is why Warren is giving a platform for one of them to emerge as some kind of a feasible hope.

Maybe Frank sees Murray as the likelier to emerge at this moment in time, the more dedicated fghter, but it's not a rigged fight in Murray's favor.

Way I see it is, Kevin is the better fighter. If even the Mitchell that fought Katsidis turns up, Murray gets knocked out; Kev hits hard (he had an iron-chinned Katsidis backing up at least once even while hurt himself) and he's way more skilled than Murray. All John has is a size advantage. Mitchell would have to have fallen off really badly to lose the fight.