Would the klitchko's last in the 70s?

[Marcov]

They would be up there with the Dokes and the Berbicks winning some and losing some and even winning a belt along the way. I doubt they would dominate but they would get some big fights.

[Steelhammer2011]

They would be up there with the Dokes and the Berbicks winning some and losing some and even winning a belt along the way. I doubt they would dominate but they would get some big fights.

You're a moron.

[Steelhammer2011]

First of all the 70's Ali wasnt difficult to hit at all, he took more punches against fat YMCA journeyman Chuck Wepner than Vitali has in his entire come back. Seriously, what a joke. I love the super Ali. First of all, its hilarious all the people calling these guys who used to fight at 190-200 early in their career "natural Cruisers" are you on crack? I guess Ali is a natural cruiser as well, hell, so is pretty much every "great" boxer of all time pre-tyson. Ali did the rope a dope against Foreman because he knew he couldnt avoid Foreman's punches. VITALI THROWS MORE AND FROM MORE ANGLES. He is stronger, and bigger than foreman and with much more stamina. You also down play INTELLIGENCE. Vitali is smarter and more prepared and his unorthodox style and preparation would be a nightmare for a hypejob like Ali who was knocked unconcious by 188 pound Henry Cooper and knocked down and taken 15 rounds by Chuck Wepner. Vitali wouldnt be intimidated, wouldnt fight ******, he'd stand in front of Ali, completely unafraid of his power, he'd keep his range, back away from his punches, he fights taller than any fighter in history, and Ali would be forced to chase Ali and 70's Ali was not a chaser. Vitali loves fighting off the back foot and he would wear Ali out, throw more punches, and do tons more damage. He'd probably win by easy TKO in round 8 or so. Anyone who sees it any other way is just a nostalgic person who talks about a mythical Ali who had the chin of Ali against Foreman, the speed of Ali against Liston, power that he never had etc...Want to know how Vitali would do against Ali...watch Ali vs. Foreman and imagine if Foreman had been 25 lbs larger, 4 inches taller, and had used his range and not tried to get inside Ali, instead of letting ALi push on him illegally push the back of his head down etc..., he threw 1-3 punches at a time, backed away,and repeated. Thats what would have happened

Foreman would be even easier for Vitali. Vitali is a bigger stronger, smarter, Foreman with more Stamina. Seriously, Vitali is a human freaking Rope a Dope. He doesnt require the rope. He'd let Foreman chase him, let him corner him, at times Vitali would even run from Foreman. He'd keept his hands down, push foreman away, refuse to clinch ever and if foreman came in and clinched, Vitali would put 250lbs on Foreman. Foreman would be exhausted and confused and take a ton of leather tryong to get close to Vitali's chin. Again, reach is inconsequential when Vitali's chin is 6 inches higher in the air. and he fights tall and long and off the back foot. Foreman's awkward arm punches would be a picnic against Vitali. When has Vitali been hurt? He keeps his hands down and trusts his chin thats never been broken. That uppercut that Lewis threw against Vitali that Vitali walked through is a stronger punch than anything Foreman threw in his life. Thats just a fact. no punch that Foreman had would scare Vitali, Vitali would walk him around the ring, hit him at will, lean back away from Foreman, keep his distance.


Frazier...stfu, if you think that Frazier would be any problem for Vitali you dont know boxing. See frazier vs foreman...any second from their fights...all you need to know.

Norton's crab wouldnt affect Vitali one bit.

A prime Shavers lost toa fighter with a losing record. People need to shut the hell up about Shavers, he's Shannon Briggs without any chin and less ability.

Theres never been a fighter like Vitali, never.

Im not going to argue Wlad, because I think he beats all of these guys as well, but people will argue he has no chin and I dont really want to explain to someone how if a fighter drastically changes their technique to eliminate a weakness that they improve and hence are better than they were and hence couldnt have been prime previously because they are better

Great post!

[DARKSEID]

I think Vitali would be in the runnings and hold the crown at least once.

but there's no way to tell since that era is over forever.

[Steak]

First of all the 70's Ali wasnt difficult to hit at all, he took more punches against fat YMCA journeyman Chuck Wepner than Vitali has in his entire come back. Seriously, what a joke. I love the super Ali. First of all, its hilarious all the people calling these guys who used to fight at 190-200 early in their career "natural Cruisers" are you on crack? I guess Ali is a natural cruiser as well, hell, so is pretty much every "great" boxer of all time pre-tyson. Ali did the rope a dope against Foreman because he knew he couldnt avoid Foreman's punches. VITALI THROWS MORE AND FROM MORE ANGLES. He is stronger, and bigger than foreman and with much more stamina. You also down play INTELLIGENCE. Vitali is smarter and more prepared and his unorthodox style and preparation would be a nightmare for a hypejob like Ali who was knocked unconcious by 188 pound Henry Cooper and knocked down and taken 15 rounds by Chuck Wepner. Vitali wouldnt be intimidated, wouldnt fight ******, he'd stand in front of Ali, completely unafraid of his power, he'd keep his range, back away from his punches, he fights taller than any fighter in history, and Ali would be forced to chase Ali and 70's Ali was not a chaser. Vitali loves fighting off the back foot and he would wear Ali out, throw more punches, and do tons more damage. He'd probably win by easy TKO in round 8 or so. Anyone who sees it any other way is just a nostalgic person who talks about a mythical Ali who had the chin of Ali against Foreman, the speed of Ali against Liston, power that he never had etc...Want to know how Vitali would do against Ali...watch Ali vs. Foreman and imagine if Foreman had been 25 lbs larger, 4 inches taller, and had used his range and not tried to get inside Ali, instead of letting ALi push on him illegally push the back of his head down etc..., he threw 1-3 punches at a time, backed away,and repeated. Thats what would have happened

Foreman would be even easier for Vitali. Vitali is a bigger stronger, smarter, Foreman with more Stamina. Seriously, Vitali is a human freaking Rope a Dope. He doesnt require the rope. He'd let Foreman chase him, let him corner him, at times Vitali would even run from Foreman. He'd keept his hands down, push foreman away, refuse to clinch ever and if foreman came in and clinched, Vitali would put 250lbs on Foreman. Foreman would be exhausted and confused and take a ton of leather tryong to get close to Vitali's chin. Again, reach is inconsequential when Vitali's chin is 6 inches higher in the air. and he fights tall and long and off the back foot. Foreman's awkward arm punches would be a picnic against Vitali. When has Vitali been hurt? He keeps his hands down and trusts his chin thats never been broken. That uppercut that Lewis threw against Vitali that Vitali walked through is a stronger punch than anything Foreman threw in his life. Thats just a fact. no punch that Foreman had would scare Vitali, Vitali would walk him around the ring, hit him at will, lean back away from Foreman, keep his distance.


Frazier...stfu, if you think that Frazier would be any problem for Vitali you dont know boxing. See frazier vs foreman...any second from their fights...all you need to know.

Norton's crab wouldnt affect Vitali one bit.

A prime Shavers lost toa fighter with a losing record. People need to shut the hell up about Shavers, he's Shannon Briggs without any chin and less ability.

Theres never been a fighter like Vitali, never.

Im not going to argue Wlad, because I think he beats all of these guys as well, but people will argue he has no chin and I dont really want to explain to someone how if a fighter drastically changes their technique to eliminate a weakness that they improve and hence are better than they were and hence couldnt have been prime previously because they are better

ugh, why do I bother.

first of all, Ali was prime around '67. the Wepner fight was in '75.

Vitali struggled to hit Chris Byrd, and even got hit flush a few times by him. Yes, even before he injured himself, it was happening in the early rounds. and you think that Vitali would TKO him in 8? come on man. I dont think even you would suggest that Chris Byrd was better than Ali.

Vitali was only about an inch taller than Cooney. yes, I know, Vitali is not Cooney. but Foreman was also 40, and he dealt with the height differential like it didnt even exist. and were talking prime Foreman here. Vitali was only a few inches taller than Foreman, and Foreman still had the longer reach. I dont think distance would have mattered too much.

'arm punches', come on. The guy hit like a truck! go look how he puts huge dents in large heavybags. and he hurt Holyfield at 40 something almost as much as a prime Lewis did, if you respect Lewis' power. and incidently, Vitali was definitely hurt against Sanders(and Lewis), although Sanders is a hard puncher and Vitali weathered the storm against him well.

you know what, I might believe the whole 'today's fighters are greater than the 70s' thing, except for that fact that a 45 year old George Foreman became lineal champ and then beat a future titleholder in the 2000s at 48. FOURTY EIGHT. and then a shot Holyfield at 46 or so deserved to beat a top 5 fighter in todays division.

its OK if you think that Vitali would beat Foreman since its a 'fantasy fight', but the way you put down ATGs is just wrong.

[cooper5]

They would definitely be top contenders in any era.

[Die Antwoord]

ugh, why do I bother.

first of all, Ali was prime around '67. the Wepner fight was in '75.

Vitali struggled to hit Chris Byrd, and even got hit flush a few times by him. Yes, even before he injured himself, it was happening in the early rounds. and you think that Vitali would TKO him in 8? come on man. I dont think even you would suggest that Chris Byrd was better than Ali.

Vitali was only about an inch taller than Cooney. yes, I know, Vitali is not Cooney. but Foreman was also 40, and he dealt with the height differential like it didnt even exist. and were talking prime Foreman here. Vitali was only a few inches taller than Foreman, and Foreman still had the longer reach. I dont think distance would have mattered too much.

'arm punches', come on. The guy hit like a truck! go look how he puts huge dents in large heavybags. and he hurt Holyfield at 40 something almost as much as a prime Lewis did, if you respect Lewis' power. and incidently, Vitali was definitely hurt against Sanders(and Lewis), although Sanders is a hard puncher and Vitali weathered the storm against him well.

you know what, I might believe the whole 'today's fighters are greater than the 70s' thing, except for that fact that a 45 year old George Foreman became lineal champ and then beat a future titleholder in the 2000s at 48. FOURTY EIGHT. and then a shot Holyfield at 46 or so deserved to beat a top 5 fighter in todays division.

its OK if you think that Vitali would beat Foreman since its a 'fantasy fight', but the way you put down ATGs is just wrong.

Ali was prime in 67...haha why? Because he beat a legitimate cripple in Cleveland Williams, and was coming off of 2 fixed fights with Sonny Liston...Oh I forgot...he beat Ernie Terrell...WHO LOST MORE IN 1967 THAN VITALI HAS IN HIS CAREER. Wow...what a great win...beating a guy who lost 3 times that year...way to go. Oh he truly was the greatest of all time...the way he dispatched of a guy who was shot in the stomach and one who lost 3 times that year.

Your whole argument is based on A > B, B>C, C>A, thats nonsense. Did you know Tommy Machine Gunn beat a younger Foreman than the one who won the Lineal title, Tommy Machine Gunn beat Foreman easy, Holyfield struggled with him, so Tommy Gunn would have easily beat Holyfield, Holyfield beat Tyson, so that means Tommy Gunn would have beat Tyson, Tyson beat Holmes easy, and Holmes massacred Ali...therefore Tommy Gunn would have been the greatest fighter of the 70's. Your argument is ridiculous. Heavyweights who add weight and stay in decent shape, have proven time and time again that they can win fluke fights because their chins tend to actually improve due to the extra weight and brain damage, and their punch tends to be the last thing to fade.

The Wepner fight was months apart from Foreman. Foreman is by far Ali's best win. You want to talk about an Ali that was knocked unconcious by 188 pound, a guy who would be a LHW today, Henry Coop Cooperson. A guy who refused to rematch Jones because he was a big time coward. A guy who had to cheat in matches, who caused cuts because his gloves were cut during matches and concealed, gloves with rips in them...CAUSE MORE CUTS.

Vitali was hurt early in the fight and continued and it kept getting worse. He dealt with Byrd easily, he was never hurt, didnt have a cut or a mark on him, you do realize how pathetic it is that you defend Ali who was literally knocked unconcious by a 188 pounder, but criticize Vitali for taking some shots in a fight. Wow...You mean Vitali was hit? Guys hit him at times? HE SUCKS. TERRIBLE BOXER. SOMEONE HIT HIM.

Haha and I love how you talk about prime. Its funny, all these clowns talking about Ali's prime...but then bring up Chris Byrd...not only did Vitali take the Byrd fight on a weeks notice after prepping for Ruddock...could you find 2 different fighters? But he was 3.5 years into his pro boxing career at the time, and he still only lost what? one round? and wasnt hurt at all other than a shoulder injury from punching byrd in the face? He gave an interview after the fight where he wasnt even breathing heavily. His shoulder hurt and he didnt really understand the magnitude of a loss, he was used to kickboxing where fighters fight all the time and its more of a tourney structure. Trust me...he gets it now. He wasnt upset after the Byrd loss, he was totally stoic, he said simply, "i didnt think I could win the remaining rounds...why continue and risk injury?"

We get it, you worship old parkinsoned riddled men. Theres plenty of youtube videos of them and a boxing history section go back and talk about the time when Ali took on Jesus and slayed him or the time when George Foreman punched through the great wall...we get it.

bringing up Cooney like he fought anything like Vitali...Cooney was 2 inches shorter, no where near the same shape, nowhere close to the same style and the COONEY FOREMAN BEAT WAS RETIRED FOR 3 YEARS, IN HIS LAST FIGHT OF HIS CAREER, HAD NOT WON IN 4 YEARS, HAD FOUGHT 6 TIMES IN 10 YEARS. Get out of here with that ****. What the hell are you tlaking about. An old George Foreman beat a retired fighter who in his prime was nothing like Vitali but was kind of tall?

Go back to the boxing history section with your tired ****.

[Spray_resistant]

The best versions of either are fully capable of beating the best versions of any HW who could show up on any night.

[Vadrigar.]

What do all those guys have in common? They were all HW's that were natural Cruiserweights.

Who put on a lot of extra weight to appear big, but are actually out of shape.

[Steak]

Ali was prime in 67...haha why? Because he beat a legitimate cripple in Cleveland Williams, and was coming off of 2 fixed fights with Sonny Liston...Oh I forgot...he beat Ernie Terrell...WHO LOST MORE IN 1967 THAN VITALI HAS IN HIS CAREER. Wow...what a great win...beating a guy who lost 3 times that year...way to go. Oh he truly was the greatest of all time...the way he dispatched of a guy who was shot in the stomach and one who lost 3 times that year.

Ali was in his prime in '67 because he looked his best, was younger, and had not been off in a 3 year hiatus...

Your whole argument is based on A > B, B>C, C>A, thats nonsense. Did you know Tommy Machine Gunn beat a younger Foreman than the one who won the Lineal title, Tommy Machine Gunn beat Foreman easy, Holyfield struggled with him, so Tommy Gunn would have easily beat Holyfield, Holyfield beat Tyson, so that means Tommy Gunn would have beat Tyson, Tyson beat Holmes easy, and Holmes massacred Ali...therefore Tommy Gunn would have been the greatest fighter of the 70's. Your argument is ridiculous. Heavyweights who add weight and stay in decent shape, have proven time and time again that they can win fluke fights because their chins tend to actually improve due to the extra weight and brain damage, and their punch tends to be the last thing to fade.

I dont understand. So I should just ignore what Foreman accomplished? the fact that he was still beating top opponents way after his prime, out of shape in his midlate 40s shows that in his prime he would have at LEAST done well in his prime in that era. is that really so hard to understand?

The Wepner fight was months apart from Foreman. Foreman is by far Ali's best win. You want to talk about an Ali that was knocked unconcious by 188 pound, a guy who would be a LHW today, Henry Coop Cooperson. A guy who refused to rematch Jones because he was a big time coward. A guy who had to cheat in matches, who caused cuts because his gloves were cut during matches and concealed, gloves with rips in them...CAUSE MORE CUTS.

Just because it was Ali's best win doesnt mean it was his prime.

I very much dislike Ali as a person, but that doesnt reflect on him as a fighter. Getting knocked down by Cooper early in his career by a very hard flush punch doesnt magically make him ****. Getting hit by a 190lb person flush with good technique hurts more than getting hit by a larger guy with worse technique. being bigger doesnt NOT make you the bigger puncher. hell, a 130lb retired woman boxer hit as hard as a 205+lb MMA male fighter when they did an alike test.
saying that Ali is **** because he got knocked down once early in his career is like saying that Wladimir sucks ass because he got TKOed by a bum. both things are ******.

Vitali was hurt early in the fight and continued and it kept getting worse. He dealt with Byrd easily, he was never hurt, didnt have a cut or a mark on him, you do realize how pathetic it is that you defend Ali who was literally knocked unconcious by a 188 pounder, but criticize Vitali for taking some shots in a fight. Wow...You mean Vitali was hit? Guys hit him at times? HE SUCKS. TERRIBLE BOXER. SOMEONE HIT HIM.

I said he looked frustrated and had a difficult time hitting Byrd, and got hit flush on the jaw by him near his prime. Out of all the guys that Vitali fought, likely Byrd resembles Ali the most. why wouldnt I bring up that fight?

Haha and I love how you talk about prime. Its funny, all these clowns talking about Ali's prime...but then bring up Chris Byrd...not only did Vitali take the Byrd fight on a weeks notice after prepping for Ruddock...could you find 2 different fighters? But he was 3.5 years into his pro boxing career at the time, and he still only lost what? one round? and wasnt hurt at all other than a shoulder injury from punching byrd in the face? He gave an interview after the fight where he wasnt even breathing heavily. His shoulder hurt and he didnt really understand the magnitude of a loss, he was used to kickboxing where fighters fight all the time and its more of a tourney structure. Trust me...he gets it now. He wasnt upset after the Byrd loss, he was totally stoic, he said simply, "i didnt think I could win the remaining rounds...why continue and risk injury?"

We get it, you worship old parkinsoned riddled men. Theres plenty of youtube videos of them and a boxing history section go back and talk about the time when Ali took on Jesus and slayed him or the time when George Foreman punched through the great wall...we get it.

In fact, I cant stand Ali. he was a moron in his prime, and a total jackass. but that doesnt mean I should ignore the fact he was brilliant in the ring.

bringing up Cooney like he fought anything like Vitali...Cooney was 2 inches shorter, no where near the same shape, nowhere close to the same style and the COONEY FOREMAN BEAT WAS RETIRED FOR 3 YEARS, IN HIS LAST FIGHT OF HIS CAREER, HAD NOT WON IN 4 YEARS, HAD FOUGHT 6 TIMES IN 10 YEARS. Get out of here with that ****. What the hell are you tlaking about. An old George Foreman beat a retired fighter who in his prime was nothing like Vitali but was kind of tall?

Go back to the boxing history section with your tired ****.

I already said 'yes, I know Cooney was not Vitali'. but he was a large opponent, and not a total bum either. I only brought him up because he was a decent opponent who was only a little shorter than Vitali, and Foreman had no trouble whatsoever with height. Foreman would have trouble with Vitali and his particular style maybe...but the height differential would not be a big deal to him.

honestly, grow up. I know you like the Klitschkos and everything, but at least try to have a boxing discussion without becoming a child just because someone disagrees with you.
If it makes you happy, go ahead and stay in lala land. but dont be such a baby.