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did'nt see anything that says anything about bloodtesting....but here is one :
Urine TKOs blood in Nevada boxing drug testing debate
June 9, 9:32 PM
The United States Anti Doping Agency sent the wrong guy to persuade the Nevada State Athletic Commission that completely random blood testing is a must for the huge Floyd Mayweather-Manny Pacquiao super bout.
I listened to over three hours of testimony over a telephone hookup Wednesday presided over by NSAC Chairwoman Pat Lundvall and including the other four governor appointed members of the Silver State's boxing board.
Travis Tygart, lawyer and publicity flack for the USADA, seemed to me to be a loser of a "split decision" to two speakers who preceded him, longtime Olympic boxing physician and Las Vegas resident Dr. Robert Voy and NSAC physician David Watson.
Need to know "background" to all this is that the Nevada interests are still "frosted" that the blood testing arrangements for the May 1 Mayweather-Sugar Shane Mosley bout in Las Vegas were strictly a private, contractual matter btween two Golden Boy promoter fighters and did not involve the state boxing board in any manner or form. It's my understanding that only the always negative results and test dates were casually reported to Nevada.
Can you say let;s go around the NSAC?
The testimony of the two doctors, taken in whole and in part, favored totally random urine testing as the most practical and, more important, most efficient way of deterring Pacman, Mayweather and any other boxer who might seek to use banned substances in connection with a boxing match.
Try as he might, and he was certainly quite glib, Tygart did not seem to persuade the commissioners that BOTH blood and urine random test must be put into effect for what Tygart kept repeating as "the protection for clean athletes."
Nevada boxing commission Medical Chief, Dr. David Watson (Life Photo)
If it was a battle between blood versus urine, I'd say urine was the winner but we'll have to see what the budget strained boxing board does next.
Just thinking out loud, but the commission's less than overwhelming response to highly critical Tygart might be a reason for the Pacquiao side to push even harder for a Nov. 13 but, conversely, cause the Mayweather side to seek to delay the inevitable bout into next year.
A fourth speaker was New Jersey boxing lawyer Patrick English who put in what came off as a suggestion that Nevada should enlist UCLA's highly respected Olympic drug expert, Dr. Donald Caitlin, to reform and/or expand its drug testing protocol. English did point out that that some experts are scientifcally uncomfortable because the USADA medical records have not been "published or peer reviewed."
Certainly, inserting Dr. Caitlin into the Big Fight mix is a solid idea. Unlike Tygart, he doesn't come off as an advocate for Mayweather and an enemy of Pacquiao. He would be regarded as properly neutral and impartial as to both boxers.
The banned susbtances most often mentioned were HGH and EPO.
Voy, former Chief Medical Office of the USOC, said current blood testing as to HGH is "ureliable and impractical."
He also said, "HGH is out there and there's not much we can do about it."
As far as EPO testing, Voy said, "I'm of the opinion that EPO is not a performance enhancer in boxing or that it gives you more endurace although that is the perception."
Regarding urine testing, Voy said it should be random and "closer to the event, the better."
Voy also said that while tiny amounts of blood are drawn for testing "it can be dangerous."
That was theme Dr. Watson chimed in on, saying, "I believe that urine is the best substance to test. I agree with Dr. Voy that urine (random testing) is what we should require and that blood is not necessary.
"I agree with Dr. Voy that there are theoretical and real risks to blood testing one of which is a (boxer getting) a hematoma on the elbow or a clot from missing a vein. There are also HIV and Hepatitis C risks."
Dr. Watson said blood testing should be curtailed "within three to four weeks before (a fight) so that the hemotoma risk does not put a fighter at a disadvantage."
Dr. Watson even patted himself and the commission on their collective backs, saying, "We're doing a great job."
Las Vegan Dr. Robert Voy is former Chief Medical Office of the United States Olmypic Committee
Tygart could not agree less even to the point of some verbal sparring with Lundvall.
She asked Tygart if blood testing is "the gold standard for everything."
"You have to collect both," an exasperated Tygart said.
Tygart defended his agency's not taking any blood from either Mayweather or opponent Shane Mosley after they had prefight tests 17 and 18 days before they May 1 bout. He said the boxers would be afraid to cheat because they know USADA could come knocking with their needles at any given time.
Tygart took NSAC to task for expression concerns about blood testing expenses although this a climate where Gov. Jim Gibbons has been talking about closing down other state regulatory boards.
He then made a financial suggestion which won't play well in the executive casino offices or with boxing promoters, saying taxes from casino revenues and PPV TV boxing could fund the testing completely.
"You take one half of one percent of the PPV fees or some of the gaming revenues," Tygart said.
Tygart made it clear, as he has in the past, that he thinks Nevada's testing regimen is a joke.
"You can do a lot better for the clean athletes. No disrespect, frankly what you do (now) is inadequate. You guys deserve better, you can do better.
"It's all about protecting the public, stopping the sportying fraud where athletes cheat to win and also protecting the health and safety of the athletes."
Although it was noted that blood testing has caught merely one HGH cheater (a British rugby player) in eight years, Tygart said "in the next few months" a reliable blood test will be available which can nab HGH uses 14 to 21 days after usage.
Tygart made the specious argument that some athletes prefer blood tests to giving urine.
"Blood can be quicker and you don't have to drop your pants," Tygart said.
His mantra was that only blood and urine, completely random testing will effectively police cheaters.
"I think you have to have both to have an effective program."
Tygart likes to shoot flaming arrows into the Nevada. Then he wonders why they circle their wagon train.
Tygart mentioned he could have sent the WADA and USADA chief scientist before the boxing board and would be glad to present those officials in the future.
Based on what I heard, the USADA's mistake was sending this prosecutor in the first place.
Nevada offered up two doctors and USADA offered its legal beagle-PR chief.
Now that's a mismatch.
Urine TKOs blood in Nevada boxing drug testing debate
June 9, 9:32 PM
The United States Anti Doping Agency sent the wrong guy to persuade the Nevada State Athletic Commission that completely random blood testing is a must for the huge Floyd Mayweather-Manny Pacquiao super bout.
I listened to over three hours of testimony over a telephone hookup Wednesday presided over by NSAC Chairwoman Pat Lundvall and including the other four governor appointed members of the Silver State's boxing board.
Travis Tygart, lawyer and publicity flack for the USADA, seemed to me to be a loser of a "split decision" to two speakers who preceded him, longtime Olympic boxing physician and Las Vegas resident Dr. Robert Voy and NSAC physician David Watson.
Need to know "background" to all this is that the Nevada interests are still "frosted" that the blood testing arrangements for the May 1 Mayweather-Sugar Shane Mosley bout in Las Vegas were strictly a private, contractual matter btween two Golden Boy promoter fighters and did not involve the state boxing board in any manner or form. It's my understanding that only the always negative results and test dates were casually reported to Nevada.
Can you say let;s go around the NSAC?
The testimony of the two doctors, taken in whole and in part, favored totally random urine testing as the most practical and, more important, most efficient way of deterring Pacman, Mayweather and any other boxer who might seek to use banned substances in connection with a boxing match.
Try as he might, and he was certainly quite glib, Tygart did not seem to persuade the commissioners that BOTH blood and urine random test must be put into effect for what Tygart kept repeating as "the protection for clean athletes."
Nevada boxing commission Medical Chief, Dr. David Watson (Life Photo)
If it was a battle between blood versus urine, I'd say urine was the winner but we'll have to see what the budget strained boxing board does next.
Just thinking out loud, but the commission's less than overwhelming response to highly critical Tygart might be a reason for the Pacquiao side to push even harder for a Nov. 13 but, conversely, cause the Mayweather side to seek to delay the inevitable bout into next year.
A fourth speaker was New Jersey boxing lawyer Patrick English who put in what came off as a suggestion that Nevada should enlist UCLA's highly respected Olympic drug expert, Dr. Donald Caitlin, to reform and/or expand its drug testing protocol. English did point out that that some experts are scientifcally uncomfortable because the USADA medical records have not been "published or peer reviewed."
Certainly, inserting Dr. Caitlin into the Big Fight mix is a solid idea. Unlike Tygart, he doesn't come off as an advocate for Mayweather and an enemy of Pacquiao. He would be regarded as properly neutral and impartial as to both boxers.
The banned susbtances most often mentioned were HGH and EPO.
Voy, former Chief Medical Office of the USOC, said current blood testing as to HGH is "ureliable and impractical."
He also said, "HGH is out there and there's not much we can do about it."
As far as EPO testing, Voy said, "I'm of the opinion that EPO is not a performance enhancer in boxing or that it gives you more endurace although that is the perception."
Regarding urine testing, Voy said it should be random and "closer to the event, the better."
Voy also said that while tiny amounts of blood are drawn for testing "it can be dangerous."
That was theme Dr. Watson chimed in on, saying, "I believe that urine is the best substance to test. I agree with Dr. Voy that urine (random testing) is what we should require and that blood is not necessary.
"I agree with Dr. Voy that there are theoretical and real risks to blood testing one of which is a (boxer getting) a hematoma on the elbow or a clot from missing a vein. There are also HIV and Hepatitis C risks."
Dr. Watson said blood testing should be curtailed "within three to four weeks before (a fight) so that the hemotoma risk does not put a fighter at a disadvantage."
Dr. Watson even patted himself and the commission on their collective backs, saying, "We're doing a great job."
Las Vegan Dr. Robert Voy is former Chief Medical Office of the United States Olmypic Committee
Tygart could not agree less even to the point of some verbal sparring with Lundvall.
She asked Tygart if blood testing is "the gold standard for everything."
"You have to collect both," an exasperated Tygart said.
Tygart defended his agency's not taking any blood from either Mayweather or opponent Shane Mosley after they had prefight tests 17 and 18 days before they May 1 bout. He said the boxers would be afraid to cheat because they know USADA could come knocking with their needles at any given time.
Tygart took NSAC to task for expression concerns about blood testing expenses although this a climate where Gov. Jim Gibbons has been talking about closing down other state regulatory boards.
He then made a financial suggestion which won't play well in the executive casino offices or with boxing promoters, saying taxes from casino revenues and PPV TV boxing could fund the testing completely.
"You take one half of one percent of the PPV fees or some of the gaming revenues," Tygart said.
Tygart made it clear, as he has in the past, that he thinks Nevada's testing regimen is a joke.
"You can do a lot better for the clean athletes. No disrespect, frankly what you do (now) is inadequate. You guys deserve better, you can do better.
"It's all about protecting the public, stopping the sportying fraud where athletes cheat to win and also protecting the health and safety of the athletes."
Although it was noted that blood testing has caught merely one HGH cheater (a British rugby player) in eight years, Tygart said "in the next few months" a reliable blood test will be available which can nab HGH uses 14 to 21 days after usage.
Tygart made the specious argument that some athletes prefer blood tests to giving urine.
"Blood can be quicker and you don't have to drop your pants," Tygart said.
His mantra was that only blood and urine, completely random testing will effectively police cheaters.
"I think you have to have both to have an effective program."
Tygart likes to shoot flaming arrows into the Nevada. Then he wonders why they circle their wagon train.
Tygart mentioned he could have sent the WADA and USADA chief scientist before the boxing board and would be glad to present those officials in the future.
Based on what I heard, the USADA's mistake was sending this prosecutor in the first place.
Nevada offered up two doctors and USADA offered its legal beagle-PR chief.
Now that's a mismatch.
Urine is great if you bother to take it often and randomly, then bother to test it for things other than stock standard steroids.
Still doesn't test for HGH though.
Not to mention there is no storage of samples.
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