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EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW: STEVE SMOGER
By Doveed Linder
Last month, referee Steve Smoger was awarded Referee of the Year by the WBA for 2010. His body of work in 2010 includes Khan-Malignaggi, Gamboa-Mtagwa, and other significant match-ups. Smoger spoke with Boxing talk and shared his thoughts on some of these fights, as well as his thoughts on whether or not the Manny Pacquiao-Antonio Margarito should have been stopped, his experiences refereeing Micky Ward’s fights, and more.
DL: Congratulations on being picked as the referee of the year for 2010 by the WBA. What were your thoughts when you heard this news?
SS: It was a big surprise. No forewarning. We’re in Managua, Nicaragua at the annual convention and it’s the second day of the convention and it’s their annual awards dinner. And they have an outstanding crowd. And the theme of the convention was to honor the memory of Alexis Arguello. And his daughter was there. Beautiful girl, beautiful girl… And she was the key note person there. She spoke very emotionally on behalf of her dad. And then they started with the awards and they announced judge of the year, Nelson Vazquez from Puerto Rico, a dear friend who I’ve worked with for many, many years. And I thought that was a very fine selection. And then they announced me and I could have fallen out of my chair! It was really, really nice to be recognized in that regard as one of the senior referees in the WBA.
DL: In your opinion, what specific fights that you refereed lead to this award? What were your highlights in 2010?
SS: Well, that’s a very good question. I definitely feel that I was very, very fortunate to have four WBAs. I opened 2010 with Yuriorkis Gamboa-Rogers Mtagwa. And that was quick and to the point. Mtagwa was coming off a very fine effort against “Juanma” (Juan Manuel Lopez) at the Garden and he earned the right to fight Yuriorkis who destroyed him. But I think the fight that may have tipped the scales was Amir Khan-Paullie Malignaggi. That was a very high profile fight because it was Khan coming to America. His first fight on American soil and he really displayed his talent. I don’t think Paullie won one second of one minute of any round. I started to worry about Paullie in the 7th and he was able to convince me and the doctors to let it go. I didn’t stop it until the 11th. He took several very, very strong shots in the 7th, 8th, 9th… I relied on the doctors. I called the doctors in almost every round after the 7th round and they kept saying he’s responsive, he’s fighting back, whatever. But I knew and you knew that he (Malignaggi) didn’t have the power to stop him (Khan). And I guess in this business there could have been a miracle, but I didn’t see it coming. And the surprising factor is that I didn’t stop it until late in the 11th round, because I had concerns through the 7th, the 8th, the 9th, and the 10th.
And then I had an excellent fight that really wasn’t seen in America. In August, I went to the Ukraine for the WBA and I worked Viacheslav Senchenko and it was an optional defense against a fighter by the name of Charlie Jose Navarro, and he gave the champion all he wanted and it was a very close fight. But I think the key fight that tipped me for this award was Khan-Malignaggi. And then as a re-ward for the a-ward, right from the convention, I went to Thailand for an interim super flyweight title fight which was a fantastic fight. Drian Francisco stopped Duangpetch Kokietgym for the super flyweight title, the interim belt, on November 30th in Thailand. And I think that was the re-ward for receiving the a-ward. I flew right from the convention to work that fight. But I would say the high profile fights were both Gamboa-Mtagwa and Khan-Malignaggi, which were in the Garden. And when you fight at MSG, you’re naturally the focal point of the boxing world.
DL: Let’s take a look back at 2010. In your eyes, what defined this year in boxing? What stands out in your mind?
SS: Manny (Pacquiao). Manny continuing to impress and improve. I think he handled (Joshua) Clottey in a very fine fashion. Very workman-like. And then I think his complete dominance of a much bigger man. I’ve been in the company of Antonio (Margarito). He is a big gentleman. It’s amazing that he can get down to 54 and 47. I’ve been in his company and he’s a tall, solid fighter. And I’ve been in Manny’s company and Manny and I are exactly 5’6” and a half, eyeball to eyeball. I saw him at Yankee Stadium and he was a guest for Miguel Cotto-Yuri Foreman and he looked to me the average height of a lightweight, and for a person of his stature to completely dominate and bust up Margarito in that fashion, I’d have to say that’s the dominant feature of 2010.
DL: You bring up Pacquiao-Margarito and I was just getting to that. You, yourself, often give the fighter the benefit of the doubt in tough fights, even when it seems they might be hurt or technically out-gunned.
SS: Correct.
DL: There are two fights this year that many feel should have been stopped. One of them is Manny Pacquiao-Antonio Margarito.
SS: I agree.
DL: The other is Vitali Klitschko-Shannon Briggs. How do you feel those two fights should have been handled from a referee’s standpoint?
SS: I didn’t see Briggs and Klitschko. I had worked on a Briggs card in ******ia. That was when he knocked out (Rob) Calloway. So he looked good and so forth and so on… I did see Pacquiao-Margarito and I would have stopped it in the 9th round. There comes a point when there’s absolutely no chance, when a fighter isn’t responding. He didn’t win any of the rounds. By way of contrast, look at Miguel Cotto-Paullie Malignaggi. Now, I permitted Paullie to continue, but he won the late rounds. He actually won the late rounds. And I remember the commissioner was imploring me to stop it. I brought the doctor in. He broke his orbital bone, his jaw… But he said, “Steve, I can continue.” And Miguel, it was his last fight at 140 and he was struggling a little bit. And it was an 8-4 fight. And Paullie, each round that he urged us to allow him to continue, he won. He won the later rounds. Cotto was very strong early on. I think he won 1 through 8 and Paullie won 9, 10, 11, and 12 because as I said it was an 8-4. But Margarito did not win anything at any time. So in that fight, if I was so motivated to check his vision, there was no chance in my view that the “hail mary” would have come. I would have stopped it. Although it’s my nature to allow a fighter every opportunity, there must be a realistic opportunity. And there was not a realistic opportunity.
And from what I read, I can’t comment on Briggs. They say in the heavyweight division, when I talk to brother and sister referees, they go back to “Big” John Tate (In a 1980 heavyweight bout, John Tate dominated Mike Weaver for most of 14 rounds. But with 40 seconds to go in the 15th and final round, Weaver caught Tate with a left hook that sent him to the canvas for the full count). So what if Briggs connected? He had the power, but I’ve worked with Shannon and in the last several years, he just doesn’t fire. Look at his fight with Sultan Ibragimov. He just stood there and let him run around him and jab. Shannon just didn’t fire. And he said he was a little off because of his asthma which could be true. But from what I read with sore shoulders and everything else, he didn’t have a realistic opportunity to prevail against the Klitschko gentleman, so that could have been stopped.
DL: There’s a movie out now called “The Fighter” which is based on the story of Micky Ward. And of course, you worked a few of Ward’s fights, most notably his fight against Emanuel Burton, which is one of the most action-packed fights of the decade. Tell me a little about your experiences working with Micky Ward.
SS: Well, I met Micky early, early on. He was one of the first fighters to fight on the casino scene in Atlantic City. He was a Top Rank fighter then, I think he was about 7 or 8-0. We’re talking early 80’s. And they said this kid is a real tough Irish kid from the Boston area and I worked several of his bouts on the way up. I think I had him when he stopped Steve Quinonez with a body shot at Foxwoods. And then in ’01 in Hampton Beach, there was a very special, special fight (Micky Ward-Emanuel Burton). A lot of heart, a lot of action… It was the 2001 fight of the year. Micky was a pleasure to work with. As was Emanuel. Never a problem. I could see something special brewing there. And I’ll never forget Teddy Atlas saying about the 4th round, I heard it on the replay… He said, “Ladies and gentlemen, stop what you’re doing! Call all your friends! We’re on the verge of something very special happening here!” It was an excellent, excellent bout. Micky knocked him down late and that was the deciding factor. He dropped him with a body shot. That perfect hook to the liver. And I wish all good things to Micky. He’s a wonderful, wonderful guy. He was excellent to work with. He never complained, nothing. As was Emanuel. Emanuel was and is a free spirit. I never tried to delegate how he fights. He’s hopping, he’s doing this… As long as he didn’t violate the rules, he could do whatever he wanted. He was a pleasure. He never complained. Fought hard, had his ways… But never in my view did he violate any of the rules.
By Doveed Linder
Last month, referee Steve Smoger was awarded Referee of the Year by the WBA for 2010. His body of work in 2010 includes Khan-Malignaggi, Gamboa-Mtagwa, and other significant match-ups. Smoger spoke with Boxing talk and shared his thoughts on some of these fights, as well as his thoughts on whether or not the Manny Pacquiao-Antonio Margarito should have been stopped, his experiences refereeing Micky Ward’s fights, and more.
DL: Congratulations on being picked as the referee of the year for 2010 by the WBA. What were your thoughts when you heard this news?
SS: It was a big surprise. No forewarning. We’re in Managua, Nicaragua at the annual convention and it’s the second day of the convention and it’s their annual awards dinner. And they have an outstanding crowd. And the theme of the convention was to honor the memory of Alexis Arguello. And his daughter was there. Beautiful girl, beautiful girl… And she was the key note person there. She spoke very emotionally on behalf of her dad. And then they started with the awards and they announced judge of the year, Nelson Vazquez from Puerto Rico, a dear friend who I’ve worked with for many, many years. And I thought that was a very fine selection. And then they announced me and I could have fallen out of my chair! It was really, really nice to be recognized in that regard as one of the senior referees in the WBA.
DL: In your opinion, what specific fights that you refereed lead to this award? What were your highlights in 2010?
SS: Well, that’s a very good question. I definitely feel that I was very, very fortunate to have four WBAs. I opened 2010 with Yuriorkis Gamboa-Rogers Mtagwa. And that was quick and to the point. Mtagwa was coming off a very fine effort against “Juanma” (Juan Manuel Lopez) at the Garden and he earned the right to fight Yuriorkis who destroyed him. But I think the fight that may have tipped the scales was Amir Khan-Paullie Malignaggi. That was a very high profile fight because it was Khan coming to America. His first fight on American soil and he really displayed his talent. I don’t think Paullie won one second of one minute of any round. I started to worry about Paullie in the 7th and he was able to convince me and the doctors to let it go. I didn’t stop it until the 11th. He took several very, very strong shots in the 7th, 8th, 9th… I relied on the doctors. I called the doctors in almost every round after the 7th round and they kept saying he’s responsive, he’s fighting back, whatever. But I knew and you knew that he (Malignaggi) didn’t have the power to stop him (Khan). And I guess in this business there could have been a miracle, but I didn’t see it coming. And the surprising factor is that I didn’t stop it until late in the 11th round, because I had concerns through the 7th, the 8th, the 9th, and the 10th.
And then I had an excellent fight that really wasn’t seen in America. In August, I went to the Ukraine for the WBA and I worked Viacheslav Senchenko and it was an optional defense against a fighter by the name of Charlie Jose Navarro, and he gave the champion all he wanted and it was a very close fight. But I think the key fight that tipped me for this award was Khan-Malignaggi. And then as a re-ward for the a-ward, right from the convention, I went to Thailand for an interim super flyweight title fight which was a fantastic fight. Drian Francisco stopped Duangpetch Kokietgym for the super flyweight title, the interim belt, on November 30th in Thailand. And I think that was the re-ward for receiving the a-ward. I flew right from the convention to work that fight. But I would say the high profile fights were both Gamboa-Mtagwa and Khan-Malignaggi, which were in the Garden. And when you fight at MSG, you’re naturally the focal point of the boxing world.
DL: Let’s take a look back at 2010. In your eyes, what defined this year in boxing? What stands out in your mind?
SS: Manny (Pacquiao). Manny continuing to impress and improve. I think he handled (Joshua) Clottey in a very fine fashion. Very workman-like. And then I think his complete dominance of a much bigger man. I’ve been in the company of Antonio (Margarito). He is a big gentleman. It’s amazing that he can get down to 54 and 47. I’ve been in his company and he’s a tall, solid fighter. And I’ve been in Manny’s company and Manny and I are exactly 5’6” and a half, eyeball to eyeball. I saw him at Yankee Stadium and he was a guest for Miguel Cotto-Yuri Foreman and he looked to me the average height of a lightweight, and for a person of his stature to completely dominate and bust up Margarito in that fashion, I’d have to say that’s the dominant feature of 2010.
DL: You bring up Pacquiao-Margarito and I was just getting to that. You, yourself, often give the fighter the benefit of the doubt in tough fights, even when it seems they might be hurt or technically out-gunned.
SS: Correct.
DL: There are two fights this year that many feel should have been stopped. One of them is Manny Pacquiao-Antonio Margarito.
SS: I agree.
DL: The other is Vitali Klitschko-Shannon Briggs. How do you feel those two fights should have been handled from a referee’s standpoint?
SS: I didn’t see Briggs and Klitschko. I had worked on a Briggs card in ******ia. That was when he knocked out (Rob) Calloway. So he looked good and so forth and so on… I did see Pacquiao-Margarito and I would have stopped it in the 9th round. There comes a point when there’s absolutely no chance, when a fighter isn’t responding. He didn’t win any of the rounds. By way of contrast, look at Miguel Cotto-Paullie Malignaggi. Now, I permitted Paullie to continue, but he won the late rounds. He actually won the late rounds. And I remember the commissioner was imploring me to stop it. I brought the doctor in. He broke his orbital bone, his jaw… But he said, “Steve, I can continue.” And Miguel, it was his last fight at 140 and he was struggling a little bit. And it was an 8-4 fight. And Paullie, each round that he urged us to allow him to continue, he won. He won the later rounds. Cotto was very strong early on. I think he won 1 through 8 and Paullie won 9, 10, 11, and 12 because as I said it was an 8-4. But Margarito did not win anything at any time. So in that fight, if I was so motivated to check his vision, there was no chance in my view that the “hail mary” would have come. I would have stopped it. Although it’s my nature to allow a fighter every opportunity, there must be a realistic opportunity. And there was not a realistic opportunity.
And from what I read, I can’t comment on Briggs. They say in the heavyweight division, when I talk to brother and sister referees, they go back to “Big” John Tate (In a 1980 heavyweight bout, John Tate dominated Mike Weaver for most of 14 rounds. But with 40 seconds to go in the 15th and final round, Weaver caught Tate with a left hook that sent him to the canvas for the full count). So what if Briggs connected? He had the power, but I’ve worked with Shannon and in the last several years, he just doesn’t fire. Look at his fight with Sultan Ibragimov. He just stood there and let him run around him and jab. Shannon just didn’t fire. And he said he was a little off because of his asthma which could be true. But from what I read with sore shoulders and everything else, he didn’t have a realistic opportunity to prevail against the Klitschko gentleman, so that could have been stopped.
DL: There’s a movie out now called “The Fighter” which is based on the story of Micky Ward. And of course, you worked a few of Ward’s fights, most notably his fight against Emanuel Burton, which is one of the most action-packed fights of the decade. Tell me a little about your experiences working with Micky Ward.
SS: Well, I met Micky early, early on. He was one of the first fighters to fight on the casino scene in Atlantic City. He was a Top Rank fighter then, I think he was about 7 or 8-0. We’re talking early 80’s. And they said this kid is a real tough Irish kid from the Boston area and I worked several of his bouts on the way up. I think I had him when he stopped Steve Quinonez with a body shot at Foxwoods. And then in ’01 in Hampton Beach, there was a very special, special fight (Micky Ward-Emanuel Burton). A lot of heart, a lot of action… It was the 2001 fight of the year. Micky was a pleasure to work with. As was Emanuel. Never a problem. I could see something special brewing there. And I’ll never forget Teddy Atlas saying about the 4th round, I heard it on the replay… He said, “Ladies and gentlemen, stop what you’re doing! Call all your friends! We’re on the verge of something very special happening here!” It was an excellent, excellent bout. Micky knocked him down late and that was the deciding factor. He dropped him with a body shot. That perfect hook to the liver. And I wish all good things to Micky. He’s a wonderful, wonderful guy. He was excellent to work with. He never complained, nothing. As was Emanuel. Emanuel was and is a free spirit. I never tried to delegate how he fights. He’s hopping, he’s doing this… As long as he didn’t violate the rules, he could do whatever he wanted. He was a pleasure. He never complained. Fought hard, had his ways… But never in my view did he violate any of the rules.
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