Comments Thread For: Golden Boy Promotions Joins Boxing Promoters Association

[JBell11]

Pardon my cynicism. But, WBA, WBC, IBF, WBO and all other alphabet organizations were creations of guys older than those who are behind the new organization but are of the same ilk. Promoters, managers, etc.

Personally, I would have been more enthusiastic were I one of those who had no idea whatsover about how promoters, managers, etc. do there business.

Adding a big S--- to a collection of S--- can't take out the stink.

Just my opinion.

Cynicism is welcomed. Unfortunately, your post is poorly written and does not make any sense.

Goldenboy is making the snobby Bob Arum look bad. Everybody knows that Uncle Snob will never join any other Organization than his board of directors, stocks, IRAs and all his other assets.
The Greedy MOFO hasn't negotiated with another promoter for years.

I wouldn't look at GBP by itself; view the movement al together, that is all promotion companies will operate under a unified standard, offering fair competition, better matches, better industry practice rules, proposal of a standard code of ethics, possibility of “WADA-like” drug testing …etc.

I think the BPA was formed, in part, in reaction to certain actions by HBO that seemed to exclude smaller promoters. Namely HBO giving GBP most favored promoters status. Another reason is there are some bills on the hill in Washington looking to form a national commission (which will never happen) that the promoters would have to pick up the cost for.

It is a big deal that GBP is joining - but in all honesty it doesn't mean anything unless the promoters start addressing the root problems of the sport. These are the same old problems that have lead people on the hill in DC to want to get involved for decades. Mostly, corrupt sanctioning bodies and no centralized authority in the sport to give it structure and stamp out corrupt practices. If the BPA was serious - they would form a league (or some sort of organized structure), have only one set of ratings (done by a combination of a writers poll and computerized ratings e.g. boxrec - just like the BCS in college football) and one world champion in each division with a cogent and logicial set of rules for promoters and fighters to follow.

It's really not that difficult. Everyone knows what the right thing to do is to fix the big problems in the sport. The BPA is a step in the right direction but they need to actually do something to help the sport and not just look out for their own interests.

I know there are reasons not to change things. Like the more belts there are, the more opportunites for fighters and promoters to make money. But the belts have become so damn near meaningless these days, what are you really paying all these sanctioning fees for? TV doesn't demand title fights (which was the old justification for having belts). Certainly HBO, the network that matters the most, doesn't. They don't even mention what belt it is most of the time. True, fighters (and their managers) who currently have belts would be loath to give them up and actually have to prove they are the absolute best in their division. But hey, it wasn't that long ago when there was only one recognized champ in each divsion (am I old or are the 1970's not ancient history).

YOu are absolutely correct, the BPA is an organization that is in it's infancy, and the idea is to provide a uniformed set of rules and an effective policy that promoters AND commissions alike can rely on.

Why should boxing fans acknowledge or be happy about this?

A legion of promoters looking to come into a union with sanctioning bodies and state and local commissions? That's the axil of evil, a trifecta of corruption and greed.
A look at any promising fighters record and what will be seen are crimes of promoters and commissions pitting undefeated prospects and fighters containing a thorough amateur background facing journeymen void of a winning record coming off of a streak of knock-out losses. These 3 en****** already work in unison to strip boxing of its morality and ethics with gross mismatches, corrupt rankings, and just selfish and greed filled behavior.

No need to praise GBP or the promotional companies already involved in this good ole boys club. Something different is needed and it's not this.

I believe you are getting caught up in GBP, if you have a disdain for them that is your agenda, however the big picture; a promotional giant like GBP signing onto this org legitimizes their stance on creating a "best practice", fair competition, and ethics.

[brick wall]

what boxing needs right now is an association of fighters not promoters. promoters priority is to look after their businesses...fighters welfare is just secondary to them unless they're dealing with superstars.
fighters need to step up for their own protection. i think andre ward has already voiced out this fighters organization before.

[brooklyngod]

good for gbp and for boxing as a whole

[Heru]

I believe you are getting caught up in GBP, if you have a disdain for them that is your agenda, however the big picture; a promotional giant like GBP signing onto this org legitimizes their stance on creating a "best practice", fair competition, and ethics.

I'm one of the biggest defenders of GBP on this board, so don't try to discredit my credibility because of an nonexistent bias against them.

All of these independent promotional companies are at the root of the problem and it won't change because the bottom line is the bottom line. They're business and we've all seen what business with little to no regulation does.

Give me a list of these promotional companies and I'll show a string of gross mismatches (co-corruption with commissions), undeserved rankings (co-corruption with sanctioning organizations), and terrible decisions (co-corruption with commission employees).

I usually come in defense of GBP because it appears to me that they're less corrupt than some others, but all the promotional companies are involved in this activity without exception.

[AddiX]

The BPA doesn't do crap.

You have to realize, most of these guys are dirt bags and don't like each other. The only ones who work together are the lower end companies who work together to get there fighters on each others cards.

Most people don't realize that its HIGHLY expensive to build fighters and do small shows. There is so many costs that if you break even your happy.

If I want my fighter on Lou Dibellas card I have to pay for everything for the 2 fighters involved, and I have to take a specific # of tickets off his hands at damn near close to face value.

I know a promoter and he said they do absolutely nothing together. They sit around, they talk some non-sense and nothing happens.

[grayfist]

Cynicism is welcomed. Unfortunately, your post is poorly written and does not make any sense.

I wouldn't look at GBP by itself; view the movement al together, that is all promotion companies will operate under a unified standard, offering fair competition, better matches, better industry practice rules, proposal of a standard code of ethics, possibility of “WADA-like” drug testing …etc.

YOu are absolutely correct, the BPA is an organization that is in it's infancy, and the idea is to provide a uniformed set of rules and an effective policy that promoters AND commissions alike can rely on.


I believe you are getting caught up in GBP, if you have a disdain for them that is your agenda, however the big picture; a promotional giant like GBP signing onto this org legitimizes their stance on creating a "best practice", fair competition, and ethics.

Poorly written it may have been but what little sense it does contain is more than what resides in just quickly enthusing over an addition to an organization that is composed of the very same uncontrite people who helped bring boxing to where it is.

To put what I said in terms that you may better understand: Adding a big stool upon a dung heap cannot make the dung heap less than what it is. The best it can do is deodorize the crap hill for a while and nothing else. Sooner than later, the real nature of the pile will come out, probably, to be preceded by stench.

I find more sense in looking back at the histories of boxing organizations that inaugurated their respective existence with avowed noble objectives and then recall how the noble purposes were quickly waylaid by business interests than just quickly hail any announcement of good intentions. I cited the WBC, the WBA, the IBF and the WBO--all creations of promoters, managers, national boxing commissions, etc., including "promotional giants" of their eras. I raise them again as examples of how matters have gone. If you think my doing so is nonsense then you surely look like one who thinks that nothing can be learned from the past. THAT, to me, is what makes no sense.

Note: Notice above that you spelled all as "al"? And, do you see your interesting use of punctuation marks or lack of use when a customarily appropriate one is required? I presume that those make your post better written than mine. They give you the right to criticize what I have posted as "poorly written".

If that is so, please accept my congratulations for your faultless prose and my gratitude for your taking the time to point out my shortcomings that glare at readers in manners that yours don't.

[Vasyl’s dad]

Frankly, I am a bit surprise with the lack of acknowledgement of such an important milestone. "Fans" of the sport should be on board with the efforts as people in the industry strive for an ethical standard. Fans who are so tied up with testing, catchweights, in-house matching, etc...should be eating this up...

There really isn't that many though.

Its about 5 guys with their numerous alts.

[Vasyl’s dad]

I believe you are getting caught up in GBP, if you have a disdain for them that is your agenda, however the big picture; a promotional giant like GBP signing onto this org legitimizes their stance on creating a "best practice", fair competition, and ethics.

lol,

the same GBP that tried to slander a fighter into taking their interests tests (Floyd to Manny) when just months before that,


refused to do the same testing for one of their fighters when asked by a potential opponent. (Judah to Shane)

[JBell11]

I'm one of the biggest defenders of GBP on this board, so don't try to discredit my credibility because of an nonexistent bias against them.

All of these independent promotional companies are at the root of the problem and it won't change because the bottom line is the bottom line. They're business and we've all seen what business with little to no regulation does.

Give me a list of these promotional companies and I'll show a string of gross mismatches (co-corruption with commissions), undeserved rankings (co-corruption with sanctioning organizations), and terrible decisions (co-corruption with commission employees).

I usually come in defense of GBP because it appears to me that they're less corrupt than some others, but all the promotional companies are involved in this activity without exception.

Ok, so an association of promoters, commissions, physicians, and fighters (possibly) isn't the answer?

Then what is? How do we begin to solve some of the problems?

The problems you mention? "Mismatches (co-corruption with commissions), undeserved rankings (co-corruption with sanctioning organizations), and terrible decisions (co-corruption with commission employees)" Aside from the sport being regulated on a federal level (which will never happen)

I believe it comes down to one thing, accountability, create a policy that addresses the problems above (I'm sure there is more) and repremand accordingly. It is important for state commissions (ALL of them,[despite some states that do not have commissions]) to be on board with this organization so that promoters won't have the ability to "shake down" the state. That is, provide gaps or flexibility for fighters.

The BPA doesn't do crap.

You have to realize, most of these guys are dirt bags and don't like each other. The only ones who work together are the lower end companies who work together to get there fighters on each others cards.

Most people don't realize that its HIGHLY expensive to build fighters and do small shows. There is so many costs that if you break even your happy.

If I want my fighter on Lou Dibellas card I have to pay for everything for the 2 fighters involved, and I have to take a specific # of tickets off his hands at damn near close to face value.

I know a promoter and he said they do absolutely nothing together. They sit around, they talk some non-sense and nothing happens.

First and foremost, there is no disrespect here. I respect your experience and it sounds like you have experience within the industry; a manager maybe. I got to say you should be most animated about this topic, and push to better the sport, for the fighters sake, now I do not know what you have done already, but if you are sitting on the sideline of the sport, complaining about it, then you are not helping the cause. Voice your discontent with the organization, be a part of the organization.

Poorly written it may have been but what little sense it does contain is more than what resides in just quickly enthusing over an addition to an organization that is composed of the very same uncontrite people who helped bring boxing to where it is.

To put what I said in terms that you may better understand: Adding a big stool upon a dung heap cannot make the dung heap less than what it is. The best it can do is deodorize the crap hill for a while and nothing else. Sooner than later, the real nature of the pile will come out, probably, to be preceded by stench.

I find more sense in looking back at the histories of boxing organizations that inaugurated their respective existence with avowed noble objectives and then recall how the noble purposes were quickly waylaid by business interests than just quickly hail any announcement of good intentions. I cited the WBC, the WBA, the IBF and the WBO--all creations of promoters, managers, national boxing commissions, etc., including "promotional giants" of their eras. I raise them again as examples of how matters have gone. If you think my doing so is nonsense then you surely look like one who thinks that nothing can be learned from the past. THAT, to me, is what makes no sense.

Note: Notice above that you spelled all as "al"? And, do you see your interesting use of punctuation marks or lack of use when a customarily appropriate one is required? I presume that those make your post better written than mine. They give you the right to criticize what I have posted as "poorly written".

If that is so, please accept my congratulations for your faultless prose and my gratitude for your taking the time to point out my shortcomings that glare at readers in manners that yours don't.

No disrespect. Yes, it was poorly written. I literally did not understand what you were writing; you were probably typing too fast and missed a couple of words. Literally speaking, you actually made no sense. Sure, I was writing fast too, so thanks for pointing that out. I'm sorry you spent three days proof reading your rebuttal. Truly I am.

Anyway thanks for clarifying your point; I now understand. So simply, you believe this organization like many others before it and currently is not effective because the same unethical people will practice in the same manner? Like I said above, what do you propose? I believe the roll of the commissions is vitally important. I believe in the safety of the fighter before anyone gets paid, I believe in ethics in business, accountability. If everyone is looking after their self-interests that's fine, lets create a system of checks and balances.

lol,

the same GBP that tried to slander a fighter into taking their interests tests (Floyd to Manny) when just months before that,


refused to do the same testing for one of their fighters when asked by a potential opponent. (Judah to Shane)

I understand, it's a bit hypocritical. Consistency is impotant too.

[B]I truly respect your opinions and thoughts. Personally I'd like to know more about B.P.A. I am a strong advocate of "best practices" in the business of the sport. The good news? People have voiced the discontent with the sport, and that they want to better the sport. Objectively, there should be a group of people that can create a governance. Organizations like BPA is a good start. I agree with Dibella's stance on the matter and that is, the organization (BPA) must establish policies and procedures to govern the org and sport accordingly before it is deemed effective. You just can't shoot something down when it hasn't even been enacted. My bad if there are some typos or grammatical errors...

[grayfist]

Ok, so an association of promoters, commissions, physicians, and fighters (possibly) isn't the answer?

Then what is? How do we begin to solve some of the problems?

The problems you mention? "Mismatches (co-corruption with commissions), undeserved rankings (co-corruption with sanctioning organizations), and terrible decisions (co-corruption with commission employees)" Aside from the sport being regulated on a federal level (which will never happen)

I believe it comes down to one thing, accountability, create a policy that addresses the problems above (I'm sure there is more) and repremand accordingly. It is important for state commissions (ALL of them,[despite some states that do not have commissions]) to be on board with this organization so that promoters won't have the ability to "shake down" the state. That is, provide gaps or flexibility for fighters.



First and foremost, there is no disrespect here. I respect your experience and it sounds like you have experience within the industry; a manager maybe. I got to say you should be most animated about this topic, and push to better the sport, for the fighters sake, now I do not know what you have done already, but if you are sitting on the sideline of the sport, complaining about it, then you are not helping the cause. Voice your discontent with the organization, be a part of the organization.


No disrespect. Yes, it was poorly written. I literally did not understand what you were writing; you were probably typing too fast and missed a couple of words. Literally speaking, you actually made no sense. Sure, I was writing fast too, so thanks for pointing that out. I'm sorry you spent three days proof reading your rebuttal. Truly I am.

Anyway thanks for clarifying your point; I now understand. So simply, you believe this organization like many others before it and currently is not effective because the same unethical people will practice in the same manner? Like I said above, what do you propose? I believe the roll of the commissions is vitally important. I believe in the safety of the fighter before anyone gets paid, I believe in ethics in business, accountability. If everyone is looking after their self-interests that's fine, lets create a system of checks and balances.


I understand, it's a bit hypocritical. Consistency is impotant too.

[b]I truly respect your opinions and thoughts. Personally I'd like to know more about B.P.A. I am a strong advocate of "best practices" in the business of the sport. The good news? People have voiced the discontent with the sport, and that they want to better the sport. Objectively, there should be a group of people that can create a governance. Organizations like BPA is a good start. I agree with Dibella's stance on the matter and that is, the organization (BPA) must establish policies and procedures to govern the org and sport accordingly before it is deemed effective. You just can't shoot something down when it hasn't even been enacted. My bad if there are some typos or grammatical errors...

1) I posted my reply to you on December 11. You made the above-quoted reply only a few minutes ago. When you spoke of my taking three days to "proofread", are you sure you were not speaking of yourself?

2) You keep on insisting that my first post was "poorly written" without even hinting at the reasons why you consider it to be so. On the other hand, I have taken the time to specify the flaws in yours. Had you done so, it would have been of much help to me.

3.) While you freely criticize others for their prose, you seem to think that you are exempt from the rules that you want others to religiously follow. (I notice you quickly edited your current post).

4.) As far as I know, enactment is not required to form an organization that is not part of and/or funded by government. And, as far as I can tell from this thread, it is an organization that is the topic. The underlined portion above makes little sense especially if one considers that the organization is--in both intent and purposes-- a fait accompli, i.e., it is already in existence and that is why GBP is joining it.(Edit: Jake Donovan's article which started this thread explicitly states that the organization was founded last year).

5.) If you meant the promise of enacting rules...Well, such promises have been made, nay, trumpeted before when all those alphabet bodies announced their existence. To date they have managed to enact such things as "Silver Belt", "Gold Belt", etc. that defy comprehension but little, if any, of the substantive ones that were promised.

6.) I do not consider myself in any position to propose means by which the sport can be improved for as long as the ones playing the game are the very same people--or, are people of the same ilk--as the ones who have done what they did to the game.

7.)The US Congress has conducted hearings towards the goal of making the fight game fairer and safer for fighters. But it has not found means beyond enacting the "ALI ACT".

I cannot think of myself as better than those respected legislators.

8.) What little I know about boxing's history in the four decades of being a fan of the sport has made me cynical. My cynicism, however, has not been coupled with any pretension to know better than others. If that is found unhelpful, then, I'll take the criticisms resulting from that while bearing in mind that I am a consumer and not any part of the production of the product. I have the option to buy or not buy, producers have the responsibility to provide a product I am willing to buy.

I love the fight game but that love has not lent me any illusion that anything I can think of can help where better minds have failed.

When I encounter a sick person, I won't pretend to be a doctor and propose cures. I'll have a doctor see him. Granting that I can find a doctor.

Edit/Add: No disrespect meant by any of the foregoing comments, as well.