Boxers... personality counts?

[Guest]

I was thinking today about boxers with personality after reading about Eubank on another thread.

I'm not talking about boxers with personality who were successful (eg. Ali) I'm talking about boxers who don't achieve that much but are liked beyond their ability.

The reason I ask this is I've noticed that a lot of discussion on this board seems very "achievement orientated"... ie. discrediting Tyson's career because of his arguable lack of achievements, and thus not taking into account how debatably exciting Tyson was in his prime (regardless of opposition) and how he kept up boxing profile in the post-Ali era.

I was wondering how widespread this was - that boxers are liked because of how successful they are, particularly amongst close followers of the sport?


In the UK a boxer's achievements can often have little effect on how they are perceived. Probably the most obvious example would be the undisputed Heavyweight champion Lennox Lewis, arguably the most successful heavyweight since Muhammad. Yet the public never took to his aloof personality, and he isn't a fraction as loved as the underachieving - yet much liked - Frank Bruno.

[jack_the_rippuh]

Eubank = The King of the Ring.

With that said, I don't give a freak about personality.

[Guest]

Okay, I think what I was trying to say (because I didn't understand it myself after I'd typed it) is... are people achievement-orientated?

Does it matter if a boxer can't get right to the top? If a boxer could only get to, say, domestic or European level, would you still like him?

[Bombardier]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Hopkins as a counter-example of someone who is elevated because of their personality...and I don't mean that disrepectfully, I just mean that you could argue that his life story and his personality have made him more popular than he might be when you consider his level of opposition and the excitement of his fights...and as you know this is coming from a Hopkins fan .

[Guest]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Hopkins as a counter-example of someone who is elevated because of their personality...and I don't mean that disrepectfully, I just mean that you could argue that his life story and his personality have made him more popular than he might be when you consider his level of opposition and the excitement of his fights...and as you know this is coming from a Hopkins fan .

To be honest, I deliberately avoided Hopkins as I didn't want to sound like a stuck record. Well, more of one than usual, anyway.

But I don't really see Hopkins as having a "personality". Sure, he's been through adversity, but his smugness in the ring really gets up my nose.

The reason I was going to mention him is for quite the opposite reason... he doesn't have much charisma (IMO) and he doesn't do much accept steal rounds (IMO) but still gets respected BECAUSE of his achievements.

That said, I did feel for him last time out, even if, in a way, it was something that was bound to happen sooner or later.

"I ran, then jumped in and hit him once - the round is mine!" - Hopkins's strategy since 2001.

[Bombardier]

To be honest, I deliberately avoided Hopkins as I didn't want to sound like a stuck record. Well, more of one than usual, anyway.

But I don't really see Hopkins as having a "personality". Sure, he's been through adversity, but his smugness in the ring really gets up my nose.

The reason I was going to mention him is for quite the opposite reason... he doesn't have much charisma (IMO) and he doesn't do much accept steal rounds (IMO) but still gets respected BECAUSE of his achievements.

That said, I did feel for him last time out, even if, in a way, it was something that was bound to happen sooner or later.

"I ran, then jumped in and hit him once - the round is mine!" - Hopkins's strategy since 2001.

Still, Hopkins does have a hold on a lot of people, and I didn't really realize how much until the Tayor fight. What I mean is that perfectly sane individuals in the media and elsewhere were so horrified and outraged by the decision. I mean, Hopkins has been a favourite of mine for a while, but to me he clearly didn't do enough to deserve that win! I mean, since when did you have to win the "championship" rounds to win a fight? As far as I knew that was the time when guys with big leads coasted the rest of the way through. That happened just this year in the Mormeck-Braithwaite fight. It's a risky strategy cause it can cost you the decision (just ask De La Hoya) but it's far from uncommon. Okay, rant over.

De La Hoya is a good example of a guy who's popular in the regular world but not that respected in the boxing one. He's had a mystique about him since his amateur days for some reason and the Hollywood world embraced him while boxing fans have been sort of disappointed with the guy. You could make a similar argument for Sugar Ray Leonard, as well.

[Guest]

I think the thing that started this was that I'll often read people discrediting someone as "they'll never be a world champion". But not everyone could be. Are we then to disregard their careers?

And fair points about Hopkins. He actually impressed me that night, and I did think he won... but with the style he's used lately, it was only a matter of time before it cost him. That said, I think Taylor was always destined to win on the cards, if you know what I mean...

[JUYJUY]

Eubank is right on the money with what he says, not everybody can be "Simply The Best" because there aren't enough slots for everybody and time is always ticking, boxing actually has a lot to do with getting lucky breaks more so than people realise. So getting recognised and being your own person with your own style to seperate you from the rest is very important in my opinion - certainly if I was a professional boxer that's what I'd be looking at rather than just actual boxing achievement alone where you are always compared to the rest. Eubank was unique in his own way, and is remembered as a one-off rather than just one of the others because he saw that you need something or some things to bring attention to yourself. Somebody like Joe Calzaghe doesn't fall into this category.