Muhammad Ali vs Inoki Before and After

[BattlingNelson]

The Ghosts of Manila - Mark Kram
Herbert Muhammad as his manager was talking around a third, plus Ali had to contribute to various Nation "projects"

Also check out Ali: one punch to many I cant find it on youtube, but I can upload it if you want

So it was not to Nation Of Islam thank you very much.

Herbert Muhammad was his manager and as such he took a cut like every other manager does. And what are these 'projects'? Where they something Ali paid for willingly or did he have to pay? Are they any different than Floyd paying a car-shop to implant diamonds in his wheels?

I guess the statement that 'Nation of Islam took half his purse' is a gross exaggeration. If Mark Kram has said that, then he clearly has another agenda.

[Toney616]

IMO it accelerated the process, but It didn't solely cause it. Also Anoki chose a cowardly way to fight.

Ali's team handicapped Inoki, with all of the clauses they inserted into the fight. I don't think Inoki was even allowed to do takedowns, lol. If they had not put all of those clauses in the contract and it was a boxer-wrestler fight with no disallowed moves, Ali would of got wasted.

[Vadrigar.]

Ali's team handicapped Inoki, with all of the clauses they inserted into the fight. I don't think Inoki was even allowed to do takedowns, lol. If they had not put all of those clauses in the contract and it was a boxer-wrestler fight with no disallowed moves, Ali would of got wasted.

His legs were already getting wasted. Ali was the handicapped one, not Anoki.

[Toney616]

So it was not to Nation Of Islam thank you very much.

Herbert Muhammad was his manager and as such he took a cut like every other manager does. And what are these 'projects'? Where they something Ali paid for willingly or did he have to pay? Are they any different than Floyd paying a car-shop to implant diamonds in his wheels?

I said they took half of his purses, Herbert Muhammad was the son of Elijah Muhammad who appointed him to look after Ali. He knew nothing about boxing, nether did he really have any right to demand a 33% cut.

"His appointed to look after their(The nations) money", is what Ali's father would say in disgust.

It was Herbert who kept on encouraging Ali to stay fighting so long, it was also him that helped to get Belinda out of the way because she wanted Ali to retire.

Also Ali contributed to various projects like donations for the building of new Mosques and Elijah Muhammad's medical bills

I guess the statement that 'Nation of Islam took half his purse' is a gross exaggeration. If Mark Kram has said that, then he clearly has another agenda.

Mark Kram followed Ali through out most of his career, as a reporter for S.I magazine. His interviews with Ali's parents, former friends of Malcolm X, Archie Moore among others is quite revealing

[Toney616]

His legs were already getting wasted. Why would Ali conceded all the clauses?

Leading up to the fight, Ali "sparred" with the karate champion Joe Lewis, who showed Ali, that he had no defense against a wrestlers take down. It was after that incident that Ali's team had all kind of clauses inserted into the contract effectively handicapping Inoki in the ring.

That would be even worse to watch. Ali was the handicapped one, not Anoki.

If Inoki had been allowed to fight his fight, it would of ended with him taking Ali to the mat and pounding on him. Boxers don't know how to defend against takedowns

[BattlingNelson]

I said they took half of his purses, Herbert Muhammad was the son of Elijah Muhammad who appointed him to look after Ali. He knew nothing about boxing, nether did he really have any right to demand a 33% cut.

"His appointed to look after their(The nations) money", is what Ali's father would say in disgust.

It was Herbert who kept on encouraging Ali to stay fighting so long, it was also him that helped to get Belinda out of the way because she wanted Ali to retire.

Also Ali contributed to various projects like donations for the building of new Mosques and Elijah Muhammad's medical bills

Mark Kram followed Ali through out most of his career, as a reporter for S.I magazine. His interviews with Ali's parents, former friends of Malcolm X, Archie Moore among others is quite revealing

Ali was a free man. He chose Herbert as a manager for whatever reason he found mattered. Just like Floyd has chosen Leonard Ellerbe even though he knew zip about boxing to begin with. Ali himself spoke fondly of Herbert in his own book so whatever thirdparties think is right or wrong is really not relevant.

I'm absolutely sure that Ali would have fought Holmes and others with or without Herbert and Nation of Islam (NOI) by his side. Ali couldn't live without the limelight. THAT and money was the reason for him staying to long.

Regarding Mark Kram it's merely the statment that NOI took half his purse I challenge. I'm sure he has made some good to great work as a reporter for SI. The point is that Ali didn't HAVE to pay Elijah's medical bills and he didn't HAVE to pay for mosque's. He just did it because he wanted to. So in no way did NOI take half his purse. You can perhaps say that they GOT half his purse, but that would be an entirely different story.

[Toney616]

Regarding Mark Kram it's merely the statment that NOI took half his purse I challenge. I'm sure he has made some good to great work as a reporter for SI. The point is that Ali didn't HAVE to pay Elijah's medical bills and he didn't HAVE to pay for mosque's. He just did it because he wanted to. So in no way did NOI take half his purse. You can perhaps say that they GOT half his purse, but that would be an entirely different story.

I can agree with this, I should of worded my first post better

[Vadrigar.]

Leading up to the fight, Ali "sparred" with the karate champion Joe Lewis, who showed Ali, that he had no defense against a wrestlers take down. It was after that incident that Ali's team had all kind of clauses inserted into the contract effectively handicapping Inoki in the ring.

If Inoki had been allowed to fight his fight, it would of ended with him taking Ali to the mat and pounding on him. Boxers don't know how to defend against takedowns

Oh yeah, I understand what your saying now. There is an interesting article that explains this in more detail:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2009/nov/11/the-forgotten-story-of-ali-inoki

[Toney616]

Oh yeah, I understand what your saying now. There is an interesting article that explains this in more detail:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog...y-of-ali-inoki

DW Forum - Can you tell the forum what exactly happened the time you demonstrated Martial Arts on Muhammad Ali?

Joe Lewis - Muhammad Ali was getting ready to fight the wrestler, Inoki, from Japan. He was at the Olympic Auditorium in Los Angeles doing a press conference in the boxing ring. I simply asked him what he would do if a wrestler did a fake punch at his head and shot for his leg to take him to the ground. He told me to step in the ring and demonstrate. The press pushed me between the ropes, and I found myself face to face with Ali. We were both in street clothes, and he had his hands up shuffling side to side using lateral footwork movements against me. I did a shoulder fake, which he reacted to, and shot for his leg. The instance I hooked his leg, I froze. I was too embarrassed to dump him on his butt. He bent forward and wrapped his arms around my waist, and I heard everybody in the place laugh. I picked him up, did a fireman’s carry takedown, dumping him on his back, and pinned him on the mat. Everybody grabbed me and pulled me off quickly. I jumped up, telling everybody we were just playing. Ali stood up next to me and put his arm around my shoulder. At the time, I was only about 180 pounds because I was pursuing acting not fighting, and my weight was really down. Ali’s first comment to me was, “You lifted weights when you were younger, didn’t you?” I’m sure he could tell I was extremely strong and hard as a brick. Then we did the same movement again, and I pinned him again a second time in a row. That’s when he showed me how he was going to fight Inoki with his back constantly against the ropes.

http://www.bruceleedivinewind.com/joelewis.html

[Vadrigar.]

http://www.bruceleedivinewind.com/joelewis.html

Thanks. It was a good read.