Can people make up their mind about P4P criteria?

[Martin (Top Knowledge)]

Yes, but people were putting Pacquiao way too high before he lost to Morales...you don't know how good a fighter is until he has been tested, which is why people usually go for the veterans first then they're making these lists.

I'm not saying you have to agree that Hopkins is #1, but he has done more to proove that he can be consistently successful in the ring than Pacquiao has.

I understand what you're saying Bombardier... But I tend to think that level of opposition has more to do with it than anything else.

That's why I think so highly of Morales/Barrera/Pacquiao.

Hopkins doesn't fight top teir fighters, He could chase the big fights and go down in history by proving himself as a modern day great, by moving up to Super-middleweight and beating the champion (Calzaghe)... Then moving up to Light-heavyweight and defeating the champion (Tarver). But he seems to be more content waiting for welterweight names to move up and challenge him.

Morales has moved up and up and up in weight winning titles and taking on the best along the way... And that means a lot more to me.

(+ when there IS a fighter at the same weight as Hopkins that is skillfull and coming off a great win (Winky Wright) Hopkins refuses to fight him.

You know, I don't think Hopkins is doing himself any favours.

[Bombardier]

I understand what you're saying Bombardier... But I tend to think that level of opposition has more to do with it than anything else.

That's why I think so highly of Morales/Barrera/Pacquiao.

Hopkins doesn't fight top teir fighters, He could chase the big fights and go down in history by proving himself as a modern day great, by moving up to Super-middleweight and beating the champion (Calzaghe)... Then moving up to Light-heavyweight and defeating the champion (Tarver). But he seems to be more content waiting for welterweight names to move up and challenge him.

Morales has moved up and up and up in weight winning titles and taking on the best along the way... And that means a lot more to me.

(+ when there IS a fighter at the same weight as Hopkins that is skillfull and coming off a great win (Winky Wright) Hopkins refuses to fight him.

You know, I don't think Hopkins is doing himself any favours.

I hear you, Morales is probably a better example to use than Pacquiao, since he never backs down from a big match and almost always comes through. In fact were it not for the losses to Barrera he would probably be #1 on most lists as we speak. Pacquiao is exciting but he blew a big lead against JMM and couldn't adjust his gameplan to beat Morales.

Hopkins has fought his fair share of quality opponents, though. Glencoffe, Echols, Mercado, were not slouches. A lot of great fighters are criticized for not taking on every great opponent available to them, but you make some good points.

[Martin (Top Knowledge)]

You know what... It's funny you say that, because Barrera is my P4P No.1 fighter right now regardless of his losses.

That's based on the competition he's fought. The way he's beaten the guy's he's fought.

I used to be a big Naseem Hamed fan a few years back... And I know this is almost impossible to do with boxing fans... But Barrera's victory over Hamed switched me from being a Hamed fan to a Barerra fan.

It was the way that Barerra took no **** that night... And beat the Prince at his own game!

[Bombardier]

You know what... It's funny you say that, because Barrera is my P4P No.1 fighter right now regardless of his losses.

That's based on the competition he's fought. The way he's beaten the guy's he's fought.

I used to be a big Naseem Hamed fan a few years back... And I know this is almost impossible to do with boxing fans... But Barrera's victory over Hamed switched me from being a Hamed fan to a Barerra fan.

It was the way that Barerra took no **** that night... And beat the Prince at his own game!

I bet he'd beat Pacquiao in a rematch, as well. Hope that fight happens.

[Manny_P]

I bet he'd beat Pacquiao in a rematch, as well. Hope that fight happens.

you got it!


cept in this fight, Pac will win, but I'll give you points. I'll give ya a couple of milion of points if ya want.

[Bombardier]

you got it!


cept in this fight, Pac will win, but I'll give you points. I'll give ya a couple of milion of points if ya want.

heh heh, I'll put a couple of million down, sure. I'm not much into the points thing, but I have enough to make a few bets. Get back to me if/when the fight happens.

[Martin (Top Knowledge)]

I bet he'd beat Pacquiao in a rematch, as well. Hope that fight happens.

I think he would too... He just didn't look right that evening, I'm not sure what it was but he didn't look focused.

I remember that there was a lot of problems with the Nevad State athletic commision in the run up to that fight, (About Barrera having a steel plate in his forehead).

And there was a big forrest fire in Big Bear, and Barrera and crew had to relocate right in the middle of training because of it.

Maybe all these things added up, + Pacquiao is a great fighter too.

Pacquiao get's a lot of stick for being one-dimensional, but I say... "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!". Ok he lost his last fight, but even then it was by only two rounds and it was his 1st fight at 130lbs AND it was against Morales!

So I say, "credit where credit's due!".