Both Pac & Floyd have Two Big Question Marks

[etlux]

I think both Pac and Floyd both have their own big question mark.


For Pac it is the oft quoted argument that Pac has never faced the quintessential 'slick black boxer.'

This leaves a question mark open because if anyone has seen his fights against guys like JMM, he obviously struggles against pure boxers whereas does better against guys that brawl with him like Morales and KTFO them.
Obviously JMM is a poor man's Mayweather and JMM arguably beat Pacquiao twice already all while being 1. slower than Mayweather, 2. not as good defense as Mayweather, 3. not as much punching power as Mayweather. So how will Pacquiao stand up to basically facing a steroided/younger/cybernetic version of JMM?

No one really knows how Pac will do against the king of 'slick black fighters' Floyd Mayweather.


For Mayweather on the other hand, his big question mark is that he has not faced a big VOLUME puncher in a long time if ever. The closest that I can think of that he came to facing one was way back in Castillo and Castillo threw somewhere around 600+ punches per fight in their two meetings whereas Pacquiao threw over 800 against Cotto recently (don't have the stats for the Clottey fight but it could be even more).

There's no saying how Mayweather will be able to deal with someone who throws insane amounts of combos from all angles rather someone like an old Mosley who just stands straight in front of you and throws 5 punches per round. Even in Mayweather/Marquez, JMM only threw about 600 punches which is still several hundred short of what Pacquaio does and Mayweather threw his usual 500 which is generally his output.

So it begs the interesting question of, how will Mayweather outscore someone who throws 800-900 punches by throwing only 450-500 in a fight?

[DR.ORGYY]

i think both pac and floyd both have their own big question mark.


For pac it is the oft quoted argument that pac has never faced the quintessential 'slick black boxer.'

this leaves a question mark open because if anyone has seen his fights against guys like jmm, he obviously struggles against pure boxers whereas does better against guys that brawl with him like morales and ktfo them.
Obviously jmm is a poor man's mayweather and jmm arguably beat pacquiao twice already all while being 1. Slower than mayweather, 2. Not as good defense as mayweather, 3. Not as much punching power as mayweather. So how will pacquiao stand up to basically facing a steroided/younger/cybernetic version of jmm?

No one really knows how pac will do against the king of 'slick black fighters' floyd mayweather.


For mayweather on the other hand, his big question mark is that he has not faced a big volume puncher in a long time if ever. The closest that i can think of that he came to facing one was way back in castillo and castillo threw somewhere around 600+ punches per fight in their two meetings whereas pacquiao threw over 800 against cotto recently (don't have the stats for the clottey fight but it could be even more).

There's no saying how mayweather will be able to deal with someone who throws insane amounts of combos from all angles rather someone like an old mosley who just stands straight in front of you and throws 5 punches per round. Even in mayweather/marquez, jmm only threw about 600 punches which is still several hundred short of what pacquaio does and mayweather threw his usual 500 which is generally his output.

So it begs the interesting question of, how will mayweather outscore someone who throws 800-900 punches by throwing only 450-500 in a fight?

he threw over 1,ooo punches in the clottey fight.......

[etlux]

he threw over 1,ooo punches in the clottey fight.......

well there you go then, that's even more of a question then of what Floyd can do against that.

Yet Pac has faced nothing but stationary guys like Cotto and Clottey who just sit there in their little peekaboo shell and don't do squat. What can Pac do against Mayweather's dynamic offense and ATG/GOAT defense?

[Kagami Taiga]

I think both Pac and Floyd both have their own big question mark.


For Pac it is the oft quoted argument that Pac has never faced the quintessential 'slick black boxer.'

This leaves a question mark open because if anyone has seen his fights against guys like JMM, he obviously struggles against pure boxers whereas does better against guys that brawl with him like Morales and KTFO them.
Obviously JMM is a poor man's Mayweather and JMM arguably beat Pacquiao twice already all while being 1. slower than Mayweather, 2. not as good defense as Mayweather, 3. not as much punching power as Mayweather. So how will Pacquiao stand up to basically facing a steroided/younger/cybernetic version of JMM?

No one really knows how Pac will do against the king of 'slick black fighters' Floyd Mayweather.


For Mayweather on the other hand, his big question mark is that he has not faced a big VOLUME puncher in a long time if ever. The closest that I can think of that he came to facing one was way back in Castillo and Castillo threw somewhere around 600+ punches per fight in their two meetings whereas Pacquiao threw over 800 against Cotto recently (don't have the stats for the Clottey fight but it could be even more).

There's no saying how Mayweather will be able to deal with someone who throws insane amounts of combos from all angles rather someone like an old Mosley who just stands straight in front of you and throws 5 punches per round. Even in Mayweather/Marquez, JMM only threw about 600 punches which is still several hundred short of what Pacquaio does and Mayweather threw his usual 500 which is generally his output.

So it begs the interesting question of, how will Mayweather outscore someone who throws 800-900 punches by throwing only 450-500 in a fight?

i think the answer to your qestion with mayweather is he's leared really well how to neutralize his opponents speed since the castillo fight. if you beat them to the punch, they cant hit u and they become more hesitant. thats one of the reasons why all of his opponents experience a dip in punch stats and activity.

[etlux]

i think the answer to your qestion with mayweather is he's leared really well how to neutralize his opponents speed since the castillo fight. if you beat them to the punch, they cant hit u and they become more hesitant. thats one of the reasons why all of his opponents experience a dip in punch stats and activity.

Has nothing to do with speed though, Mayweather has faced speed before and it's not too much of a problem. Mosley is fast and Judah is one of the p4p fastest boxers in the past 10-20 years if not ever. But the thing both Mosley and Judah lacked direly is OUTPUT. Neither of them threw more than a small handful of punches per round.
For example Paul Williams doesn't really have exceptional speed yet it's his sheer nonstop output same as slow ass Margarito, that people always postulate would give Floyd problems.

[Swag Hustla]

Has nothing to do with speed though, Mayweather has faced speed before and it's not too much of a problem. Mosley is fast and Judah is one of the p4p fastest boxers in the past 10-20 years if not ever. But the thing both Mosley and Judah lacked direly is OUTPUT. Neither of them threw more than a small handful of punches per round.
For example Paul Williams doesn't really have exceptional speed yet it's his sheer nonstop output same as slow ass Margarito, that people always postulate would give Floyd problems.

Seeing is believing. I didn't believe Mayweather would actually hurt Mosley or recover after being rocked, but he did.

Everyone knows Pac has never faced anyone quite like Floyd, even Marquez. In all fairness, Floyd has never faced anyone quite like Pac, even Judah.

[trk]

For Mayweather on the other hand, his big question mark is that he has not faced a big VOLUME puncher in a long time if ever. The closest that I can think of that he came to facing one was way back in Castillo and Castillo threw somewhere around 600+ punches per fight in their two meetings whereas Pacquiao threw over 800 against Cotto recently (don't have the stats for the Clottey fight but it could be even more).

There's no saying how Mayweather will be able to deal with someone who throws insane amounts of combos from all angles rather someone like an old Mosley who just stands straight in front of you and throws 5 punches per round. Even in Mayweather/Marquez, JMM only threw about 600 punches which is still several hundred short of what Pacquaio does and Mayweather threw his usual 500 which is generally his output.

So it begs the interesting question of, how will Mayweather outscore someone who throws 800-900 punches by throwing only 450-500 in a fight?

Most fighters throw less against Mayweather than they do against other opponents. Mosley threw more in a little over 8 rounds against Margarito than he did in 12 against Floyd, and he threw almost 800 punches against Cotto. Marquez, Hatton, De la Hoya, Baldomir, Castillo, etc. can each throw around 800 punches in a fight if they are going up against a brawler type opponent. Pacquiao's work rate might be a little higher than any of those fighters, but it shouldn't really that much higher.

[trk]

Another thing I should point out is that everyone throws more than usual against Clottey since he often goes into his shell and does not throw that many punches back. Remember, Clottey was the opponent that Margarito was fighting when he set the all-time compubox record for most punches thrown(1675), so Pacquiao throwing 1200 punches against him shouldn't make people expect Pacquiao to throw that many punches against everyone.

An interesting comparison can be made if you compare Mosley's performance against Cotto with Pacquiao's performance against Cotto. Pacquiao and Mosley both threw about the same number of punches. The biggest difference between their offensive output was that Mosley throws a lot of "rangefinder" jabs that connect at a low rate, while Pacquiao replaced half of those wasted jabs with more effective power punches that were connecting at around 50% for both Mosley and Pacquiao. Defensively, Cotto threw slightly fewer punches against Pacquiao (mostly because his punch output declined later in the fight when he was close to being stopped) and landed at a lower percentage (probably because Pacquiao's speed and movement makes him more difficult to hit than the stationary Mosley).

[ModernTalking]

Yea...in your dream though. PAC is an extraordinary fighter. Ask Floyd and he will tell you.

[trk]

Yea...in your dream though. PAC is an extraordinary fighter. Ask Floyd and he will tell you.

Did anyone say he wasn't? Pac is clearly better than Mosley or any other WW except Floyd.