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Originally posted by Ravens Fan
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His next fight is April 10th vs. Cintron.
Tune in.
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Hes the only fighter from 154 or 160 thats ranked in EVERY Top 10 P4P List.
His next fight is April 10th vs. Cintron.
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Ok, this is your chance to convince me why Paul is so great. Was it when he struggled and many thought lost to Margarito? Or was it when he actually did lose to Quintana? Or was it when he struggled with a 34 year old blown up jr. middleweight in Martinez? And again many believe Paul lost. Or did he achieve greatness when he beat up two old men in Wright and Phillips? I only ask because when Calzaghe beat up two old men it seemed to work against him. Or was it when he dominated the welterweight division. Oh wait, I am sorry he only fought in three welterweight title fights and lost one of them. So there was no domination in that division. So, can I ask what division was it that Paul actually dominated? And far as Paul fighting so much. He has fought 39 fights and Pavlik has fought 37 since they both turned pro in 2000. And as far as comparing Williams and Pavlik. Somehow, Williams struggles with Margarito and Quintana and Martinez get dismissed when discussing his career. Yet Pavlik's lone lose was to one of the greatest fighters of the last quarter century and it seems to have doomed his career in the eyes of many boxing fans. Please tell how does that happens? And with all that said I believe that I am a very open minded individual and I am open to all opinions on why you believe Williams is so great.Originally posted by -Reflexes- View PostComment
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i think people give pavlik way too much credit...he's not that great...his wins are not that big...paul has more names under his belt and more accomplishments in my eyes...it should be 50-50 to me...cause paul really deserves 60-40...Comment
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So I guess Cotto is underrated on here then. LMAO.Originally posted by Ravens Fan View PostComment
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Originally Posted by Ravens Fan View PostOriginally posted by -Reflexes- View PostJAT
Ok, this is your chance to convince me why Paul is so great. Was it when he struggled and many thought lost to Margarito?
Who thought he lost to Margarito go find them. He didn't win more the 4 rounds in that fight. Lets not get crazy. That was a CLEAR victory.
You wanted the list so here it is.
Unofficial Scores
Williams-vs-Margarito
Harold Lederman, HBO: Williams, 116-112
Kevin Iole, Yahoo! Sports: Margarito, 116-112
Tim Smith, New York Daily News: Draw, 114-114
Steve Springer, Los Angeles Times: Draw, 114-114
Bill Dwyre, Los Angeles Times: Margarito, 115-113
Steve Kim, MaxBoxing.com: Margarito, 115-113
Doug Fischer, MaxBoxing.com: Margarito, 115-113
Jerry Magee, San Diego Union-Tribune: Williams, 116-112
Robert Morales, Los Angeles Daily News: Williams, 115-113
Carlos Arias, Orange County Register: Williams, 115-113
David Avila, Riverside Press Enterprise: Draw, 114-114
Francisco Salazar, *********.com: Draw, 114-114
Margarito-4 Williams-4 Draw-4
He lost ONE time. So what. He was preparing for Cintron Feb 2nd then he pulled out leaving Williams to have to change his camp with little time to prepare for the slick southpaw which is why he came out flat. How many loses does Cotto, Pac, Hopkins, Mosley, Klit, Hatton and Morales have?
Came out flat? It is one thing to struggle but he got whopped by a fighter that is rated around 40th in the world, and props to Paul for the KO in the rematch. But that KO obviously looks like more of a fluke than anything else. And as far as wins and loses are concerned. There are those that believe Paul should have three loses on his record. And I don't know what that has to do with anything because there are plenty of bad fighters who have no loses and plenty of great fighters who have five loses. So, you lost me on that one.
How did he struggle if it was the fight of the year? He put on a show. He aso had little time to prepare for Martinezs style since he was prepping for Pavlik.
How did he struggle? Lets see he got hurt and knocked down and hurt again on several occasions by a fighter that moved up in weight and has a 50%ko ratio. I also believe that Martinez did what he wanted when he wanted to do it and therefore I believe that he won the fight. In other words I believe Martinez was much more dominate in the rounds that he won then was the slap happy Williams in the rounds I gave him. By the way you should be on Paul's payroll because you sure do make an awful lot of excuses for him.
Instead of Phillips and Wright who shold he have fought??? This will be fun.
Wait I am confused? Paul could not get fights at the lower divisions so he moves up and wants to challenge for the Middleweight Championship of the world. So, what does he do? He fights Wright who spent most of his career at Jr. Middle and had only fought once in almost three years and that was a lose to Hopkins. And that lose was almost two years before he fought Paul. He also fights another career Jr middleweight that was pushing 40 and way past his prime in Phillips. By the way neither of them have fought since. He also fought some dude name Kolle and then a pumped up Jr Middleweight in Martinez and this somehow puts him in line for a shot at the Middleweight Championship of the World? And you mean to tell me Paul could find no better competition in two different weight divisions to fight then two dudes pushing 40? And not only in line for a shot but a 50/50 split? If I was Team Pavlik I would have laughed at Paul and told him to go earn his shot.
He tried to get fights with Floyd, Mosley, Clottey, Cintron, Berto, Cotto and a Marg rematch ALL AT WW. They all declined so he moved up
I have no idea why those fighters would not fight Paul. However, I can say if they watched him slap his way through a fight it surely cannot be because they are afraid of him. And if I had to ponder a guess I would most likely suspect that Paul is hard to negotiate with. After all he wants a 50/50 split for a world middleweight title fight when he has never fought a legit in his prime middleweight. He also never dominated a lower division or for that matter he has never dominated a world class fighter in his prime at any division. And if he is that hard to negotiate with in a division were he has earned nothing, that being middleweight, I cannot imagine how hard he would be to deal with in a division where he actually was a champion.
He cant get fights so he campaigns at 3.
So I don't repeat myself see my last statement. And at least you admitted that he has not dominated any division so that is step in the right direction.
Wait you lost me what the hell does this have to do with anything??? Williams fought 4 times in 2006. 4 Times in 2008. and twice in 2009.
I said it because Williams fans are also spouting off about how often he fights. So. I figured I would pick one fighter to compare him to and it happened to be Pavlik. And go figure Paul has fought ten times since 2006 and so has Pavlik.
What are you talking about? Williams goes after guys with the style that can beat him he has always had a harder time with southpaws. Who doesnt? What does this mean last I checked Hes beaten every southpaw hes face including Quintana.
So, I get it now or at least lets see if I understand. Paul does not dominate fighters because he always picks fighters that he knows can beat him. So, did he really believe two old men could beat him? That also must mean that the real reason that Paul has not fought Mayweather or Mosley is because he figured he would beat them easily so why bother, is that right?
After Pavlik got butt ****d by a 44 year old he was favored to beat he went on a bum tour with Espino and Rubio not to mention Rubio before Hopkins. And he also managed to pull out 2 fights with Paul Williams. Once in October and in December.
I assume that you meant Lockett before Hopkins? And I am not going to say that I know all the ins and outs of boxing. With that said I would venture a guess that the Lockett and Espino fights were mandatory fights. And if Williams ever decides to stay in a weight division for more then a week and wins another title he will have to fight his share if he wants to keep his belt. As far as Rubio is concerned he was ranked in the top ten, around 6th or 7th, by Ring Magazine when Pavlik fought him. An as far as Pavlik 's lose to Hopkins. What would look better on a resume a lose to Hopkins, who happens to be one of the greatest fighters in history, or a lose to Quitana?
Hes ranked in the TOP 10 P4P by EVERY MAJOR site and publication. Hes the number 2 ranked 160 Pounder in the world by the ring. HesWBO belt. So that mean he iss a Champion in two divisons. With his eyes set on a third soon at 160. HesQuintana loss. And has avnged his ONLY loss by First Roud KO. Hes been ducked by damn near ALL of boxing and is one of boxing brightest and most exciting fighters.ranked Number 1 at WW for the undefeated since his last
No doubt he was ranked high in most rankings but so was Hatton so mistakes are made. And as far as why he is ranked 2nd at middleweight is anyone's guess since, in my opinion, he has done nothing to deserve it. And I must have missed when Paul won his second championship, so please explain.
In closing I would like to say that I really am not a Williams hater. I just believe the greatness label has been attached to him long before he has earned it, at least in the ring that is. And what I see is a very flawed fighter who stands flat footed and wings a lot of arm punches with little power who gets hit a lot. And I don't understand how most of Paul's fans can't see the flaws that I see? After all I am a Pavlik fan and I will say it he is a very flawed fighter who has done well with the skills that he has and I surely would not classify Kelly as one of the greats. With that said if they fight, and I was a betting man, and Paul decides to go toe to toe with him I would bet the house on Pavlik by easy KO.Comment
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