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What does it mean to be a champion in boxing today?

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  • #11
    Originally posted by The Big Dunn View Post

    I get your point, but Loma gave away the belt because he wasn’t confident he could beat Haney. A loss would’ve meant no big money Teo fight.

    I get that promoters and sanctioning bodies rank guys that often don’t deserve it, but those same promoters get big names title fights ahead of more deserving guys as well.

    Haney shouldn’t be celebrated as a champ but what Loma and Bob worked out with the wbc should be greatly scorned and criticized.
    Is that your opinion that Lomachenko wasn't confident he could beat Haney? Or did Lomachenko say this?

    Haney had wins over 0 notable fighters. Why would Lomachenko be scared of a weak punching boxer who nobody knew of? Even now, his best win is Linares and that fight is notable more because of Haney's stanky legs and holding than him getting a W over the aging, past prime Linares.

    If anything, stylistically, Gary Russell Jr was a much more difficult fight than Haney. Nicholas Walters was also more dangerous. So was a veteran like Orlando Salido. And no one on Earth would say Haney is better than Lopez. Lopez can box, punch, take a punch, he can go the distance, he can close out fights within the distance. Haney literally couldn't knock down Gamboa of all people, or Linares. You can say Haney is one-dimensional in a way. He can't trade, has to be careful and box, avoid getting hit clean. He's f/cked going forward because that was a past his best Linares. Fighters are going to go for that chin now with no worries of anything hard coming back at them. Gamboa and Linares never even flinched at any of his power shots. And they were put there solely for him to raise his KO profile. Lomachenko would embarrass that kid and you should know better. Networks/Promotional differences made that fight hard to make on top of Haney being unknown.
    Fists_of_Fury likes this.

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    • #12
      Originally posted by -Kev- View Post

      Is that your opinion that Lomachenko wasn't confident he could beat Haney? Or did Lomachenko say this?

      Haney had wins over 0 notable fighters. Why would Lomachenko be scared of a weak punching boxer who nobody knew of? Even now, his best win is Linares and that fight is notable more because of Haney's stanky legs and holding than him getting a W over the aging, past prime Linares.

      If anything, stylistically, Gary Russell Jr was a much more difficult fight than Haney. Nicholas Walters was also more dangerous. So was a veteran like Orlando Salido. And no one on Earth would say Haney is better than Lopez. Lopez can box, punch, take a punch, he can go the distance, he can close out fights within the distance. Haney literally couldn't knock down Gamboa of all people, or Linares. You can say Haney is one-dimensional in a way. He can't trade, has to be careful and box, avoid getting hit clean. He's f/cked going forward because that was a past his best Linares. Fighters are going to go for that chin now with no worries of anything hard coming back at them. Gamboa and Linares never even flinched at any of his power shots. And they were put there solely for him to raise his KO profile. Lomachenko would embarrass that kid and you should know better. Networks/Promotional differences made that fight hard to make on top of Haney being unknown.
      You ever seen some sheeit like this before?
      giphy.gif

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      • #13
        Originally posted by The Big Dunn View Post

        I get your point, but Loma gave away the belt because he wasn’t confident he could beat Haney. A loss would’ve meant no big money Teo fight.

        I get that promoters and sanctioning bodies rank guys that often don’t deserve it, but those same promoters get big names title fights ahead of more deserving guys as well.

        Haney shouldn’t be celebrated as a champ but what Loma and Bob worked out with the wbc should be greatly scorned and criticized.
        he already said he was figthing the commey-lopez winner before haney became mandatory. look it up. now you are just revising history to try and twist things as if haney was some notable fight. he wasnt. loma also said im fighting lopez unless someone makes me a good offer. haney and dazn didnt. this is some weird fan fiction going on where you want loma not to fight the #1 guy and instead fight an unknown with zero top 10 wins. thats just silly and you know it. haney could fight loma right now and guess what? he doesnt want to!
        SplitSecond likes this.

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        • #14
          Originally posted by -Kev- View Post

          Is that your opinion that Lomachenko wasn't confident he could beat Haney? Or did Lomachenko say this?

          Haney had wins over 0 notable fighters. Why would Lomachenko be scared of a weak punching boxer who nobody knew of? Even now, his best win is Linares and that fight is notable more because of Haney's stanky legs and holding than him getting a W over the aging, past prime Linares.

          If anything, stylistically, Gary Russell Jr was a much more difficult fight than Haney. Nicholas Walters was also more dangerous. So was a veteran like Orlando Salido. And no one on Earth would say Haney is better than Lopez. Lopez can box, punch, take a punch, he can go the distance, he can close out fights within the distance. Haney literally couldn't knock down Gamboa of all people, or Linares. You can say Haney is one-dimensional in a way. He can't trade, has to be careful and box, avoid getting hit clean. He's f/cked going forward because that was a past his best Linares. Fighters are going to go for that chin now with no worries of anything hard coming back at them. Gamboa and Linares never even flinched at any of his power shots. And they were put there solely for him to raise his KO profile. Lomachenko would embarrass that kid and you should know better. Networks/Promotional differences made that fight hard to make on top of Haney being unknown.
          Actions speak louder than words. I base my opinion on the fact when Crolla wasthe mando was an easy fight, he took it. With Haney, he instead dropped the belt. Why not just dust him off like Crolla and make the easy payday? Because that payday wouldn't be so easy.

          Styles make fights, not previous opponents or who you beat. Haney has the attributes-size, speed, height, athleticism-to make it a difficult fight. triangle theories also don't work. So it doesn't really matter who Haney has fought or defeated before a possible Loma fight. You of all people should understand this.

          Russell has much shorter arms than Loma so I didn't think he would stylistically be tougher. Walters was out for about 1 year, mitigating that danger. You don't have to knock someone out or down to win a fight.

          What you posted isn't wrong in theory. Lomachenko was a 7-1 favorite over Teo and was supposed to embarrass him as well but that didn't happen.

          You make salient points but you are only talking about Haney. Loma hasn't looked great at 135. Haney is big and fast at this weight. His length will allow him to fight at a distance that a Russell couldn't.

          Sorry Kev but I am not giving Loma a win until they fight. If I'm proved wrong then I will say so. As for now all we can go on are the actions.

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          • #15
            Originally posted by daggum View Post

            he already said he was figthing the commey-lopez winner before haney became mandatory. look it up. now you are just revising history to try and twist things as if haney was some notable fight. he wasnt. loma also said im fighting lopez unless someone makes me a good offer. haney and dazn didnt. this is some weird fan fiction going on where you want loma not to fight the #1 guy and instead fight an unknown with zero top 10 wins. thats just silly and you know it. haney could fight loma right now and guess what? he doesnt want to!
            He waited a year daggum. Plenty of time to get rid of the easy mando like he did Crolla. I never said I didn't want Loma to fight the #1 guy so stop with that BS. I reacted to him dropping the belt and working an emeritus deal. These are the exact same things I said when Canelo did this to GGG.

            Loma lost now and has no belt. Why should Haney treat him any differently than Loma treated him?

            It was a cowardly move that you would label it that had it been the other way around.

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            • #16
              To a young fighter means the world. To me, nothing, it's devalued with garbage trinkets. The ring magazine belt is the most prestigious and does not get the merit it deserves. Are held it as the ww and MW champion. Gene Tunney and so on. As more weight classes been created, it's become worthless owning an abc trinket.

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              • #17
                17 weight classes, 10 belts per weight class,. Sanctioning organizations in the pockets of promoters.. . I wouldn't say calling yourself a champion is quite the accomplishment it was 40-50 years ago..
                Last edited by buddyr; 06-21-2021, 08:20 AM.

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                • #18
                  Originally posted by The Big Dunn View Post

                  He waited a year daggum. Plenty of time to get rid of the easy mando like he did Crolla. I never said I didn't want Loma to fight the #1 guy so stop with that BS. I reacted to him dropping the belt and working an emeritus deal. These are the exact same things I said when Canelo did this to GGG.

                  Loma lost now and has no belt. Why should Haney treat him any differently than Loma treated him?

                  It was a cowardly move that you would label it that had it been the other way around.
                  Lomachenko has proven his stripes and Haney has not. THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE .

                  Dude, I don't get why you always need to pretend you don't have an agenda when you always do. And there is no other way around. Instead of fighting all the top guys like Lomachenko, Devin Haney has instead chose to run his mouth rather than get in the ring calling everyone else duckers and fighting no one.

                  There's no other way around because Devin Haney hasn't grown the balls despite his talent. He's no different than the other boogeyman who doesn't want to fight the best at all. TANK DAVIS.

                  Even now, without a belt, near damn everyone still regards Lomachenko as a better more proven fighter than Devin Haney career wise and at 135lbs.

                  Devin Haney should be looking forward to fighting Lomachenko like he's pretended he's wanted to this whole time to prove he's better.

                  BUT NOOOOOO. DEVIN HANEY SHOULDNT FIGHT LOMACHENKO BECAUSE LOMA WAS MEAN TO HIM.

                  LMFAO.

                  Guys like you created the term "mental gymnastics " but no one likes to do that more than you.

                  Here's the best part too.

                  If Devin Haney isn't fighting Lomachenko next who's he gonna fight? Who brings more value and the most money to the table who isn't Teofimo Lopez or Lomachenko?

                  Oh, dudes such a killer doe!

                  If Lomachenko wins next weekend and I'm Devin Haney I would want that fight. It makes sense legacy wise and it makes sense money wise.. What name is better on your resume and who will make you the most money?

                  Lmfao. Maybe Haney needs to wait Lomachenko out a few more years like Tank Davis is still doing eh? Dudes so ****ing afraid of fighting anyone legit he won't fight anyone legit champions at 130-140. Maybe he should pick up a secondary strap at 147 too off a complete no one too lmfao.

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                  • #19
                    Originally posted by R-Hand Southpaw View Post

                    Lomachenko has proven his stripes and Haney has not. THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE .

                    Dude, I don't get why you always need to pretend you don't have an agenda when you always do. And there is no other way around. Instead of fighting all the top guys like Lomachenko, Devin Haney has instead chose to run his mouth rather than get in the ring calling everyone else duckers and fighting no one.

                    There's no other way around because Devin Haney hasn't grown the balls despite his talent. He's no different than the other boogeyman who doesn't want to fight the best at all. TANK DAVIS.

                    Even now, without a belt, near damn everyone still regards Lomachenko as a better more proven fighter than Devin Haney career wise and at 135lbs.

                    Devin Haney should be looking forward to fighting Lomachenko like he's pretended he's wanted to this whole time to prove he's better.

                    BUT NOOOOOO. DEVIN HANEY SHOULDNT FIGHT LOMACHENKO BECAUSE LOMA WAS MEAN TO HIM.

                    LMFAO.

                    Guys like you created the term "mental gymnastics " but no one likes to do that more than you.

                    Here's the best part too.

                    If Devin Haney isn't fighting Lomachenko next who's he gonna fight? Who brings more value and the most money to the table who isn't Teofimo Lopez or Lomachenko?

                    Oh, dudes such a killer doe!

                    If Lomachenko wins next weekend and I'm Devin Haney I would want that fight. It makes sense legacy wise and it makes sense money wise.. What name is better on your resume and who will make you the most money?

                    Lmfao. Maybe Haney needs to wait Lomachenko out a few more years like Tank Davis is still doing eh? Dudes so ****ing afraid of fighting anyone legit he won't fight anyone legit champions at 130-140. Maybe he should pick up a secondary strap at 147 too off a complete no one too lmfao.
                    Tank has no bearing in this discussion so I don't know why you brought him up.

                    You can't prove your stripes if the champ drops the belt when you're the mando.

                    If I had an agenda, which I don't, if Loma doesn't drop the belt and Bob doesn't make the emeritus thing with the WBC then there would be nothing for me to discuss. I am discussing Loma's actions. Since you can't refute my post, you have to make it race driven. Fine. Race card is all you have because if it were any other fighter doing this you'd be killing them, and rightfully so.

                    Loma has no belt. Why should Haney fight him instead of trying to fight the money fight in Teo? You are literally criticizing Haney for doing the exact same thing Loma did. Haney should treat Loma the way Loma treated him. It isn't Haney's fault Loma failed to secure a rematch clause or dropped the belt rather than fight him.

                    I never claimed Haney was a killer. I posted-and stand by -the fact styles make fights. Haney's attributes would make a fight at 135 difficult IMO. As I posted, if they fight and Loma beats him, I will say I was wrong. Also as I posted you and others told me Loma was going to dust off Teo. What happened? Sorry but I am not giving Loma a win until he proves it in the ring. Until that time I will judge his actions.

                    All we can go on is a man's actions. When the mando was the easy Crolla, Loma made the defense. when the mando was Haney, he dropped the belt, worked with his promoter to be named franchise champ, sat out for a year, and then fought Teo. If Haney had done the exact same thing you'd be criticizing him regardless of his resume.

                    Whatever Haney does from here on out, the fact is Loma dropped the belt rather than fight him. You are justifying the move. You are defending Loma for doing the same thing you criticized Canelo for doing to GGG. care to explain why?

                    Last edited by The Big Dunn; 06-21-2021, 09:15 AM.

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                    • #20
                      Originally posted by Fists_of_Fury View Post

                      You ever seen some sheeit like this before?
                      giphy.gif
                      In my 25 years of watching boxing, that is definitely one of the most pathetic moves i’ve seen in a live boxing match for sure. Number 1 is that dude who punched his opponent after the fight when his opponent came to hug him. But that Haney hugging BS is also up there.

                      I am not a pro boxer but I have sparred countless times for years, and have been stopped by a bigger dude than me. I never hugged even when I should have. You get in the ring, you fight. Or else go do something else with your life. Being all pathetic like that on live TV. Never lol, I have never done anything like that. If you’re going to KO me, then go ahead and try your best and i’ll try my best too. But i’m not hugging anyone like that. Anyone can call me an armchair warrior, but I swear on my mother I have been hurt badly in sparring and never done anything like that. And honestly that’s rare to see any fighter do it like that, like Haney did.
                      Fists_of_Fury likes this.

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