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The handlers of middleweight champion Kelly Pavlik and Paul Williams, who holds an interim junior middleweight belt but can campaign at welterweight, junior middleweight or middleweight, are trying to hammer out a deal for them to meet in the fall.
So, naturally, they're hammering each other in the grueling negotiating process, which is limping along because of serious differences.
HBO, which is trying to referee the talks, is holding Oct. 3 for the fight, which would be one of the most significant of the year, not to mention a probable crowd pleaser between two of America's best fighters.
It would take place in Atlantic City, N.J., where Pavlik is a proven attraction. Thousands of his loyal followers from Youngstown, Ohio, filled Boardwalk Hall for his three fights there, including his dramatic championship victory against Jermain Taylor in 2007, a blowout defense against unknown Gary Lockett 13 months ago and a nontitle loss to Bernard Hopkins in October.
However, there are vast differences in what each side wants for a fight that already blew up once when they tried to make it last year, mainly because of the acrimonious relationship between Top Rank boss Bob Arum and Williams adviser Al Haymon.
With neither fighter having a more significant opponent available for the fall, they've turned to each other again in an attempt to get it done. I've talked to various folks involved in the fight and am told that HBO is offering a $3.75 million license fee for the bout.
In addition, Arum is not directly involved in the discussions, nor is Haymon. Instead, Top Rank president Todd duBoef is handling the talks with Williams promoter Dan Goossen. Arum told me he was happy to be out of this one and just to get updates from duBoef.
My sources tell me that Top Rank offered the Williams side a package of $1.55 million but Goossen asked for $2.5 million plus 50 percent of the gate. Top Rank countered by raising the offer to $1.75 million plus a lesser piece of the gate.
Back and forth they go.
DuBoef didn't want to go into detail but acknowledged that they are having difficulties coming to terms.
Goossen said he is hopeful the fight will be made.
"It's a good fight for boxing, for the fighters, for HBO and for the fans," he said. "I know everyone will have their opinions on who should get what. This is about doing a fair deal for all sides. If we can reach that kind if accord, it's a fight that will attract a lot of attention. We're sitting here always looking for the biggest fight and something Paul and everyone would like to have. But you're always looking for something that is fair in our eyes, not necessarily what is fair to a reporter or fan.
"This is a tough business and you want equitable deals. We know Pavlik brings a lot to the table, but Paul does also, so it's a matter of hashing out the deal. I believe we are on the right track because both fighters want the fight, which always helps out. Between Top Rank and myself, we are having constructive conversations, which usually leads to getting something done."
Of course, it is good that both sides say they want the fight. However, it seems to me that the onus is on Williams and his team.
They are the ones who constantly cry out that Williams is the most feared man in boxing and that no big names are willing to fight him. Now you have Pavlik, the champion and the proven draw, not only willing to fight him but offering him, by far, the most money he's ever been offered for a fight in his life. It's quite a reasonable offer.
On top of that, duBoef did tell me that Top Rank is not seeking any options on Williams' future fights, only a standard rematch clause, which is the normal course of business in non-mandatory situations.
Haymon certainly should understand about options and rematch clauses. He extracted financial participation in two future Pavlik fights after he knocked out Taylor and even got a rematch clause despite the fact that Pavlik was the mandatory. Because Pavlik was the mandatory challenger for Taylor, Top Rank and Pavlik were under no obligation to give the options or the rematch clause. But they wanted the fight badly and wanted it as quickly as possible, so they gave in.
In boxing, sometimes when the other guy has something you want, you have to suck it up and take a deal you don't love.
If Williams really wants the fight, if he really wants to be middleweight champion and really believes he can win the fight, it's a no-brainer for his team to get the deal done.
Williams is certainly the biggest fight out there right now for Pavlik, but there are other opponents waiting in the wings. Fighters such as Winky Wright (who lost to Williams earlier this year) and Sergio Martinez are at the top of the list and, from what I am told, willing to take the fight for a lot less than what Williams is being offered.
I admire Goossen, Haymon and Williams for trying to get the best deal possible. There's nothing wrong with hard negotiating. I just hope they don't overplay their hand.
- Dan Rafael ESPN
So, naturally, they're hammering each other in the grueling negotiating process, which is limping along because of serious differences.
HBO, which is trying to referee the talks, is holding Oct. 3 for the fight, which would be one of the most significant of the year, not to mention a probable crowd pleaser between two of America's best fighters.
It would take place in Atlantic City, N.J., where Pavlik is a proven attraction. Thousands of his loyal followers from Youngstown, Ohio, filled Boardwalk Hall for his three fights there, including his dramatic championship victory against Jermain Taylor in 2007, a blowout defense against unknown Gary Lockett 13 months ago and a nontitle loss to Bernard Hopkins in October.
However, there are vast differences in what each side wants for a fight that already blew up once when they tried to make it last year, mainly because of the acrimonious relationship between Top Rank boss Bob Arum and Williams adviser Al Haymon.
With neither fighter having a more significant opponent available for the fall, they've turned to each other again in an attempt to get it done. I've talked to various folks involved in the fight and am told that HBO is offering a $3.75 million license fee for the bout.
In addition, Arum is not directly involved in the discussions, nor is Haymon. Instead, Top Rank president Todd duBoef is handling the talks with Williams promoter Dan Goossen. Arum told me he was happy to be out of this one and just to get updates from duBoef.
My sources tell me that Top Rank offered the Williams side a package of $1.55 million but Goossen asked for $2.5 million plus 50 percent of the gate. Top Rank countered by raising the offer to $1.75 million plus a lesser piece of the gate.
Back and forth they go.
DuBoef didn't want to go into detail but acknowledged that they are having difficulties coming to terms.
Goossen said he is hopeful the fight will be made.
"It's a good fight for boxing, for the fighters, for HBO and for the fans," he said. "I know everyone will have their opinions on who should get what. This is about doing a fair deal for all sides. If we can reach that kind if accord, it's a fight that will attract a lot of attention. We're sitting here always looking for the biggest fight and something Paul and everyone would like to have. But you're always looking for something that is fair in our eyes, not necessarily what is fair to a reporter or fan.
"This is a tough business and you want equitable deals. We know Pavlik brings a lot to the table, but Paul does also, so it's a matter of hashing out the deal. I believe we are on the right track because both fighters want the fight, which always helps out. Between Top Rank and myself, we are having constructive conversations, which usually leads to getting something done."
Of course, it is good that both sides say they want the fight. However, it seems to me that the onus is on Williams and his team.
They are the ones who constantly cry out that Williams is the most feared man in boxing and that no big names are willing to fight him. Now you have Pavlik, the champion and the proven draw, not only willing to fight him but offering him, by far, the most money he's ever been offered for a fight in his life. It's quite a reasonable offer.
On top of that, duBoef did tell me that Top Rank is not seeking any options on Williams' future fights, only a standard rematch clause, which is the normal course of business in non-mandatory situations.
Haymon certainly should understand about options and rematch clauses. He extracted financial participation in two future Pavlik fights after he knocked out Taylor and even got a rematch clause despite the fact that Pavlik was the mandatory. Because Pavlik was the mandatory challenger for Taylor, Top Rank and Pavlik were under no obligation to give the options or the rematch clause. But they wanted the fight badly and wanted it as quickly as possible, so they gave in.
In boxing, sometimes when the other guy has something you want, you have to suck it up and take a deal you don't love.
If Williams really wants the fight, if he really wants to be middleweight champion and really believes he can win the fight, it's a no-brainer for his team to get the deal done.
Williams is certainly the biggest fight out there right now for Pavlik, but there are other opponents waiting in the wings. Fighters such as Winky Wright (who lost to Williams earlier this year) and Sergio Martinez are at the top of the list and, from what I am told, willing to take the fight for a lot less than what Williams is being offered.
I admire Goossen, Haymon and Williams for trying to get the best deal possible. There's nothing wrong with hard negotiating. I just hope they don't overplay their hand.
- Dan Rafael ESPN
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