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Is Manny Pacquiao an All time Great?
Manny Pacquiao has never been more popular. He has never fought better. His string of recent, impressive victories has lifted the tough southpaw to mythical status in his home of the Philippines. But where does Pac Man rate among the all-time great fighters in history.
We asked three experts their opinion. Here they are:
Ronnie Nathanielsz, a boxing journalist and commentator based in the Philippines: I saw him as a scrawny, skinny kid with a consuming desire to achieve and he was totally unafraid. In fact, because he was so badly underweight he loaded his shorts with lead to come in heavier than he really was. He fought as a light flyweight and went all the way up to welterweight to fight Oscar De La Hoya … not just fought him but pulverize him.
But what adds a dramatic dimension to Pacquiao is his deep and genuine religiosity, his belief that his power comes from God and that he uses that gift within him to strengthen himself and his confidence to be able to overcome. He has an abiding faith that if he sets his mind to it, he could beat any fighter in the world because he trains relentlessly and is learning all the time.
As I watch him grow in stature and skill, I agree with Top Rank promoter Bob Arum that Manny is still not at his peak and is a work in progress because he wants to learn his craft and excel not just for himself and his family but for his country and people. When he says he fights for them, you better believe it. Such a young man is hard to find and when you measure his achievements alongside his remarkable humility, decency and innate generosity you begin to realize that he must be the greatest boxer and to borrow the words of the utterly disgraced Floyd Mayweather Sr. – not for your time, my time but for all time!
Never in the history of boxing has a fighter been so admired and loved by his people and served as a single unifying force in a country that regrettably resonates with divisiveness. When Manny fights the guns fall silent, rebels of different persuasions and the military lay down their arms and their anger, to share in the pride and glory of Manny Pacquiao waging war in the ring and then, in an act of supreme compassion, bending down to help the vanquished or embracing his beaten foe like a brother. He is right when he says there is nothing personal.
He has captivated the British media which is not easy to do and indeed the international media like no other. There are no divisions in his world except weight divisions and the admiration, respect and affection for him is universal. Arum, ever the astute promoter and an icon in the sport for over 40 years believes Manny Pacquiao is the greatest fighter who ever lived. Manny Pacquiao is the greatest fighter who ever lived because he came at a time when boxing was dying and he kept it alive and in the process fought his way into our homes and into our hearts, breaking free from the bondage of his childhood poverty and proving to 90 million Filipinos if no one else that they too can redeem their respectability and pride both individually and collectively as a nation “with heart within and God overhead.”
Brian Doogan, Sunday Times of London: I think Pacquiao has shown his brilliance over a significant period of time now but, brilliant as he has been in his last two fights, people are getting a little carried away in my view. Lest we forget, it is only 14 months since he engaged in a war with Juan Manuel Marquez which I thought Marquez won and I wasn't alone. It was a very close fight whichever way you thought the verdict should go. While beating Oscar De La Hoya and Ricky Hatton have added to his legend, my own view is that De La Hoya was shot and Hatton was as good as shot, with his decline having been refernced for quite some time. I'm not trying to put down his accomplishments - I think Pacquiao is brilliant - but perspective is being obscured amid all the adulation and fawning. Hugh McIlvanney and I spoke last night at the Champions League game between Manchester United and Arsenal and Hugh said that he would probably fancy Pacquiao at this stage over Floyd Mayweather, which is very interesting. How Floyd performs against Marquez in July may inform us more but, if Pacquiao were to beat Mayweather, we would definitely have to say that he's an all-time great. As of now, his level of achievement is already formidable.
Mike Silver, author of "The Arc of Boxing: The Rise and Decline of the Sweet Science:" Why should beating an ordinary club fighter have any affect on Pacquio’s historical standing? What does it prove? True, all of us were taken aback at how easily he demolished Hatton, but everyone, it seems, is so quick to elevate a fighter to all time great status without really evaluating or understanding the quality of his opposition. The most overused words in boxing today are “great” and “dominant”. Pacquiao is the best fighter, pound for pound, in the world today but let’s not make too much of this victory. I give him credit for an impressive performance—but it must be placed in context. Hatton is tough and game but he has the skills of a six round preliminary fighter. And it is possible—as often happens when a fighter has taken too many punches—his neurological ability to withstand hard punches has been compromised. When a fighter has been counted out twice with one punch one must suspect this possibility. Mayweather is a decent puncher but he is not a one punch specialist—and neither is Pacquaio.
Pacquaio’s victory over a dehydrated, over the hill and inactive De La Hoya should also be placed in context. What I mean is that it was similar to Larry Holmes’ victory over a dehydrated, over the hill and inactive Muhammad Ali. Nobody thought Holmes’ historical standing should be measured by that awful fight. We got a much better handle on Holmes’ ability in his fights vs. Norton, Shavers and Cooney.
Pacquiao has improved—rare for a fighter today. He is a better fighter than he was just six months ago, and definitely is punching harder. And trainer Freddie Roach’s excellent coaching has helped him to become a smarter fighter. Is there still room for more improvement? Perhaps, but he is 30 years old and is only fighting twice a year. I stick by my previous assessment that Manny is somewhat of a throwback but at this stage he could not beat fighters the quality of an Antonio Cervantes, Wilfredo Benitez, Nicolino Loche, Carlos Ortiz, Eddie Perkins, Dulio Loi or Aaron Pryor (what a war that would have been!). There is no one around today even approaching the skill level of these fighters. I wish there were fighters of that quality to test Manny because I think he has greatness within him but the competition and activity today precludes him from ever reaching his utmost potential—as it is the same for every other contemporary fighter whose collected a zillion synthetic alphabet belts.
Hatton reminds me of Davey Boy Green, another aggressive glass jawed English welterweight, who was bombed out by Sugar Ray Leonard in four rounds over a quarter century ago. Green was a better technical fighter than Hatton. But Leonard’s knockout over him did not create any buzz about Leonard’s historical standing—and rightfully so. Leonard had already beaten Wilfredo Benitez but no one was placing him among the all time greats until he fought and defeated the likes of Roberto Duran and Tommy Hearns. And there’s the rub. There is no one in that category to test Manny Pacquiao. That’s not Manny’s fault. But you cannot truly measure a fighter’s greatness until he beats other outstanding fighters. Will Manny fight Mayweather Jr.? It is a contest that would give us a better handle on his skills but you can fuggedaboudit. After Floyd saw what Manny did to Hatton you can bet he probably wished he had stayed retired.
Manny Pacquiao has never been more popular. He has never fought better. His string of recent, impressive victories has lifted the tough southpaw to mythical status in his home of the Philippines. But where does Pac Man rate among the all-time great fighters in history.
We asked three experts their opinion. Here they are:
Ronnie Nathanielsz, a boxing journalist and commentator based in the Philippines: I saw him as a scrawny, skinny kid with a consuming desire to achieve and he was totally unafraid. In fact, because he was so badly underweight he loaded his shorts with lead to come in heavier than he really was. He fought as a light flyweight and went all the way up to welterweight to fight Oscar De La Hoya … not just fought him but pulverize him.
But what adds a dramatic dimension to Pacquiao is his deep and genuine religiosity, his belief that his power comes from God and that he uses that gift within him to strengthen himself and his confidence to be able to overcome. He has an abiding faith that if he sets his mind to it, he could beat any fighter in the world because he trains relentlessly and is learning all the time.
As I watch him grow in stature and skill, I agree with Top Rank promoter Bob Arum that Manny is still not at his peak and is a work in progress because he wants to learn his craft and excel not just for himself and his family but for his country and people. When he says he fights for them, you better believe it. Such a young man is hard to find and when you measure his achievements alongside his remarkable humility, decency and innate generosity you begin to realize that he must be the greatest boxer and to borrow the words of the utterly disgraced Floyd Mayweather Sr. – not for your time, my time but for all time!
Never in the history of boxing has a fighter been so admired and loved by his people and served as a single unifying force in a country that regrettably resonates with divisiveness. When Manny fights the guns fall silent, rebels of different persuasions and the military lay down their arms and their anger, to share in the pride and glory of Manny Pacquiao waging war in the ring and then, in an act of supreme compassion, bending down to help the vanquished or embracing his beaten foe like a brother. He is right when he says there is nothing personal.
He has captivated the British media which is not easy to do and indeed the international media like no other. There are no divisions in his world except weight divisions and the admiration, respect and affection for him is universal. Arum, ever the astute promoter and an icon in the sport for over 40 years believes Manny Pacquiao is the greatest fighter who ever lived. Manny Pacquiao is the greatest fighter who ever lived because he came at a time when boxing was dying and he kept it alive and in the process fought his way into our homes and into our hearts, breaking free from the bondage of his childhood poverty and proving to 90 million Filipinos if no one else that they too can redeem their respectability and pride both individually and collectively as a nation “with heart within and God overhead.”
Brian Doogan, Sunday Times of London: I think Pacquiao has shown his brilliance over a significant period of time now but, brilliant as he has been in his last two fights, people are getting a little carried away in my view. Lest we forget, it is only 14 months since he engaged in a war with Juan Manuel Marquez which I thought Marquez won and I wasn't alone. It was a very close fight whichever way you thought the verdict should go. While beating Oscar De La Hoya and Ricky Hatton have added to his legend, my own view is that De La Hoya was shot and Hatton was as good as shot, with his decline having been refernced for quite some time. I'm not trying to put down his accomplishments - I think Pacquiao is brilliant - but perspective is being obscured amid all the adulation and fawning. Hugh McIlvanney and I spoke last night at the Champions League game between Manchester United and Arsenal and Hugh said that he would probably fancy Pacquiao at this stage over Floyd Mayweather, which is very interesting. How Floyd performs against Marquez in July may inform us more but, if Pacquiao were to beat Mayweather, we would definitely have to say that he's an all-time great. As of now, his level of achievement is already formidable.
Mike Silver, author of "The Arc of Boxing: The Rise and Decline of the Sweet Science:" Why should beating an ordinary club fighter have any affect on Pacquio’s historical standing? What does it prove? True, all of us were taken aback at how easily he demolished Hatton, but everyone, it seems, is so quick to elevate a fighter to all time great status without really evaluating or understanding the quality of his opposition. The most overused words in boxing today are “great” and “dominant”. Pacquiao is the best fighter, pound for pound, in the world today but let’s not make too much of this victory. I give him credit for an impressive performance—but it must be placed in context. Hatton is tough and game but he has the skills of a six round preliminary fighter. And it is possible—as often happens when a fighter has taken too many punches—his neurological ability to withstand hard punches has been compromised. When a fighter has been counted out twice with one punch one must suspect this possibility. Mayweather is a decent puncher but he is not a one punch specialist—and neither is Pacquaio.
Pacquaio’s victory over a dehydrated, over the hill and inactive De La Hoya should also be placed in context. What I mean is that it was similar to Larry Holmes’ victory over a dehydrated, over the hill and inactive Muhammad Ali. Nobody thought Holmes’ historical standing should be measured by that awful fight. We got a much better handle on Holmes’ ability in his fights vs. Norton, Shavers and Cooney.
Pacquiao has improved—rare for a fighter today. He is a better fighter than he was just six months ago, and definitely is punching harder. And trainer Freddie Roach’s excellent coaching has helped him to become a smarter fighter. Is there still room for more improvement? Perhaps, but he is 30 years old and is only fighting twice a year. I stick by my previous assessment that Manny is somewhat of a throwback but at this stage he could not beat fighters the quality of an Antonio Cervantes, Wilfredo Benitez, Nicolino Loche, Carlos Ortiz, Eddie Perkins, Dulio Loi or Aaron Pryor (what a war that would have been!). There is no one around today even approaching the skill level of these fighters. I wish there were fighters of that quality to test Manny because I think he has greatness within him but the competition and activity today precludes him from ever reaching his utmost potential—as it is the same for every other contemporary fighter whose collected a zillion synthetic alphabet belts.
Hatton reminds me of Davey Boy Green, another aggressive glass jawed English welterweight, who was bombed out by Sugar Ray Leonard in four rounds over a quarter century ago. Green was a better technical fighter than Hatton. But Leonard’s knockout over him did not create any buzz about Leonard’s historical standing—and rightfully so. Leonard had already beaten Wilfredo Benitez but no one was placing him among the all time greats until he fought and defeated the likes of Roberto Duran and Tommy Hearns. And there’s the rub. There is no one in that category to test Manny Pacquiao. That’s not Manny’s fault. But you cannot truly measure a fighter’s greatness until he beats other outstanding fighters. Will Manny fight Mayweather Jr.? It is a contest that would give us a better handle on his skills but you can fuggedaboudit. After Floyd saw what Manny did to Hatton you can bet he probably wished he had stayed retired.
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