Lennox Lewis vs Muhammad Ali

[Simurgh]

Because of TKO6, An old Lennox Lewis stops his heir to the throne. He broke the trend of old aging champion being overtaken by his heir; Louis-Marciano, Moore-Clay, Ali-Holmes, Holmes-Tyson etc. Special Stuff.

Well which great HW Lennox beat to become a champion?

[B-Bomber]

Well which great HW Lennox beat to become a champion?

Uhm, he was declared WBC Champion after defeating Ruddock (since Bowe vacated/refused to fight)

If you mean linear champion then Shannon Briggs (who defeated Foreman).

Lewis went from underrated to terribly overrated imo.

[Simurgh]

Uhm, he was declared WBC Champion after defeating Ruddock (since Bowe vacated/refused to fight)

If you mean linear champion then Shannon Briggs (who defeated Foreman).

Lewis went from underrated to terribly overrated imo.

I agree with this.

It wasn't Lennox's fault but he didn't beat 'the man' either. He is top10 overall and top5 H2H, great big champion, but he is no where near GOAT.

[damuttz112]

Evander Holyfield was the greatest fighter of his era (Unified the division) but Mike Tyson in was deemed more relevant in relation to the public esteem. Only then at the end of his career did he become appreciated by many reports and such because he defeated everyone. Watch the post Tyson interviews etc. Everybody is giving him praise as the Undisputed Heavyweight Champion of the world.

[Simurgh]

Evander Holyfield was the greatest fighter of his era (Unified the division) but Mike Tyson in was deemed more relevant in relation to the public esteem. Only then at the end of his career did he become appreciated by many reports and such because he defeated everyone. Watch the post Tyson interviews etc. Everybody is giving him praise as the Undisputed Heavyweight Champion of the world.

I am not arguing with that. He is GREAT!

[damuttz112]

I agree with this.

It wasn't Lennox's fault but he didn't beat 'the man' either. He is top10 overall and top5 H2H, great big champion, but he is no where near GOAT.

Only Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis and Larry Holmes beat more rated Heavyweight contenders/champions, and arguably Lewis' opposition was better than both Louis and Holmes.

Great Heavyweights vs Top 10 Opposition (sorted by wins):

Muhammad Ali: 32-5
Joe Louis: 30-3
Larry Holmes: 20-5
Lennox Lewis: 15-2-1
Mike Tyson: 13-4
Rocky Marciano: 11-0
Evander Holyfield: 11-7-2
Joe Frazier: 10-4
Sonny Liston: 8-4
George Foreman: 7-5

He's nowhere near 'overrated'.

[Simurgh]

Only Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis and Larry Holmes beat more rated Heavyweight contenders/champions, and arguably Lewis' opposition was better than both Louis and Holmes.

Great Heavyweights vs Top 10 Opposition (sorted by wins):

Muhammad Ali: 32-5
Joe Louis: 30-3
Larry Holmes: 20-5
Lennox Lewis: 15-2-1
Mike Tyson: 13-4
Rocky Marciano: 11-0
Evander Holyfield: 11-7-2
Joe Frazier: 10-4
Sonny Liston: 8-4
George Foreman: 7-5

He's nowhere near 'overrated'.

You need to take into account when Lennox fought them. Beating Tyson at that point means nothing. Beating Holyfiled after Bowe did it much convincingly 5 years prior to that doesn't get you full credit.

He is not overrated when is is put in top10 or top5. But when he is put with Ali he is damn overrated.

P.S. I didn't get what these numbers represent.

[B-Bomber]

Only Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis and Larry Holmes beat more rated Heavyweight contenders/champions, and arguably Lewis' opposition was better than both Louis and Holmes.

Great Heavyweights vs Top 10 Opposition (sorted by wins):

Muhammad Ali: 32-5
Joe Louis: 30-3
Larry Holmes: 20-5
Lennox Lewis: 15-2-1
Mike Tyson: 13-4
Rocky Marciano: 11-0
Evander Holyfield: 11-7-2
Joe Frazier: 10-4
Sonny Liston: 8-4
George Foreman: 7-5

He's nowhere near 'overrated'.

You need to take into account a few things though.

Back in the day there used to be one champion, not 10. If we stick to the lineal title, Lewis only defended 6 times prior to Rahman and 2 more times after the rematch.

Louis lost twice after his come back (due to financial reason). To Marciano in 1951 and to Charles in 1950. I don't think one can use those defeats to discredit Louis, unless you want to judge RJJ or Holyfield overall talent by their recent performances. Untill 1949 (the date of his official retirement) Louis only had one loss (avenged) and defended his title 25 times.

I find Lewis overrated, also H2H to be honest, he's not the first tall man in the history of boxing, nor is his reach something completely unheard of before.

An 84' reach is surely useful for an outside fighter, but if we look at Ali's opponent we find Foreman (82') , Norton (80') , Bugner (82') . Now I doubt those 2 inches would make such a huge difference.

As for weight, before McCall I, at the age of 29 Lewis never weighed in at more than 235lbs, which was probably his idea weight.

[FkDaHtrs]

Muhammad Ali without a doubt!

[pedro1098]

i would like to say ali for who he is & everything about him,ali did so much for the sport we love,LL would pose such a threat to ali in so many ways,i think LL COULD ko ali,ali best chance of winning would be picking off the rounds & try for a points win but LL was a very good boxer for his size. for me i think ali could not last 12rds with LL..LL BY KO ROUNDS 7-10