Boxing and the Klitschkos are more popular in Europe

[Ben_London.]

The Klitschko brothers' fans need to learn how to nuthug properly.

You need to build up ANY guy that your fighter fights. This way, you can always claim that the fight means more, and that the win matters. This way his resume looks better in the long run, and you don't have to contradict yourself by saying one week... 'This guys a bum.' And the next week you're saying.. 'He fights all the best fighters.'

Who cares if they're bums?

Jesus. Don't these people know ANYTHING?

I've always posted positive comments about Ibragimov, Brewster, Thompson and Gomez who are good fighters. Peter too would be a decent heavyweight if he trained harder and got in shape. And Austin wasn't as bad as some people say he is.

However, I can't say much good about Haye or Rahman without being dishonest. They really are bums.

[THe TRiNiTY]

I've always posted positive comments about Ibragimov, Brewster, Thompson and Gomez who are good fighters. Peter too would be a decent heavyweight if he trained harder and got in shape. And Austin wasn't as bad as some people say he is.

However, I can't say much good about Haye or Rahman without being dishonest. They really are bums.

So Haye didn't unify his division? Haye doesn't have handspeed? Haye doesn't know how to market himself into a fight? Haye doesn't go after the top dog, in his THIRD fight in the biggest division around, knowing he'll be under-sized?

Those aren't GOOD things?

[PittyPat]

So Haye didn't unify his division? Haye doesn't have handspeed? Haye doesn't know how to market himself into a fight? Haye doesn't go after the top dog, in his THIRD fight in the biggest division around, knowing he'll be under-sized?

Those aren't GOOD things?

Evidently all the hallmarks of a useless bum, according to these Klitschko 'fans'.

I use the quotation marks because no true fan of a fighter would think so irrationally and unrealistically about his opponents.

[Ben_London.]

So Haye didn't unify his division? Haye doesn't have handspeed? Haye doesn't know how to market himself into a fight? Haye doesn't go after the top dog, in his THIRD fight in the biggest division around, knowing he'll be under-sized?

Those aren't GOOD things?

He was floored by a super middleweight called Mock. He was stopped by a 42 year old light heavyweight called Thompson.

And this is important: all his opponents except for one had been stopped before. He avoided the durable cruiserweights like Jones, Adamek, and Wlodarsczyk, and he avoided the good technical boxers like Cunningham. Some Haye opponents like Gurov and Maccarinelli are notoriously chinny.

In contrast, Wlad has KOed many opponents who had never been stopped before: Thompson, Brock, Shultz, Barrett in 2000, Mercer, etc.

Haye is a natural heavyweight who weight-drained to get down to 200 because he was afraid he couldn't take a punch. He moved up because he can't make 200 anymore, that's what he said.

[Libido Sanchez]

Hey ~Ironfist, I agree with you that boxing needs to be on free TV over here (it's expensive to be a boxing fan if you buy all the PPVs you want to see each year) and that there needs to be better media coverage in the States.

But what I was wondering was, if in your heart you know the Klitschkos and the other European fighters are better than US fighters (and you don't see any future threats coming from America any time soon, like you've posted in other threads), then why do you even care what American commentators say about European fighters? I mean, like you pointed out, Vitali's last fight had an astounding 11.5 million viewers in Germany, while the much-better JMM vs Diaz fight only got 1.6 million in the USA. It sounds like Europe doesn't even need America as far as boxing is concerned, from the way you write about it.

If the German commentators (who are more fair and exciting in your estimation) are reaching 11+ million viewers and people like Atlas and Kellerman are reaching far less people (granted, Kellerman does, from time to time, some of the bigger HBO fights telecast worldwide), then what's the big deal?

[THe TRiNiTY]

He was floored by a super middleweight called Mock. He was stopped by a 42 year old light heavyweight called Thompson.

And this is important: all his opponents except for one had been stopped before. He avoided the durable cruiserweights like Jones, Adamek, and Wlodarsczyk, and he avoided the good technical boxers like Cunningham. Some Haye opponents like Gurov and Maccarinelli are notoriously chinny.

In contrast, Wlad has KOed many opponents who had never been stopped before: Thompson, Brock, Shultz, Barrett in 2000, Mercer, etc.

All right. I'll entertain you. Sure, Haye's opponents suck. Now answer the rest of my question.

Does he not have speed? Does he not know how to market him/a fight? Does he not have good footwork? Regardless of the quality of his opponents, did he not have the guts and the courage to unify his division?

[PittyPat]

He was floored by a super middleweight called Mock. He was stopped by a 42 year old light heavyweight called Thompson.

And this is important: all his opponents except for one had been stopped before. He avoided the durable cruiserweights like Jones, Adamek, and Wlodarsczyk, and he avoided the good technical boxers like Cunningham. Some Haye opponents like Gurov and Maccarinelli are notoriously chinny.

In contrast, Wlad has KOed many opponents who had never been stopped before: Thompson, Brock, Shultz, Barrett in 2000, Mercer, etc.

And yet you conveniently leave out the fact that Wlad has been stopped no less than 3 times, and was down multiple times against Peter. Their calibre has nothing to do with it - by your skewed logic, he is as glass-chinned as Haye, if not more so purely on the amount of times he's been down on the canvas.

[Ben_London.]

Hey ~Ironfist, I agree with you that boxing needs to be on free TV over here (it's expensive to be a boxing fan if you buy all the PPVs you want to see each year) and that there needs to be better media coverage in the States.

But what I was wondering was, if in your heart you know the Klitschkos and the other European fighters are better than US fighters (and you don't see any future threats coming from America any time soon, like you've posted in other threads), then why do you even care what American commentators say about European fighters? I mean, like you pointed out, Vitali's last fight had an astounding 11.5 million viewers in Germany, while the much-better JMM vs Diaz fight only got 1.6 million in the USA. It sounds like Europe doesn't even need America as far as boxing is concerned, from the way you write about it.

If the German commentators (who are more fair and exciting in your estimation) are reaching 11+ million viewers and people like Atlas and Kellerman are reaching far less people (granted, Kellerman does, from time to time, some of the bigger HBO fights telecast worldwide), then what's the big deal?

Because I live here, not over there. I don't know very much German.

I'm always downloading fights in the German language - I wish I could watch them in English with decent commentary. I do enjoy the UK commentary.

There's a lot of good American commentators too like Kenny, Tessitore, Steward, Ricardo, and Lampley. But sadly, on virtually every broadcast I need to put up with an idiotic, bigoted Euro-hater like Atlas or Kellerman.

[Ben_London.]

And yet you conveniently leave out the fact that Wlad has been stopped no less than 3 times, and was down multiple times against Peter. Their calibre has nothing to do with it - by your skewed logic, he is as glass-chinned as Haye, if not more so purely on the amount of times he's been down on the canvas.

Wlad was stopped by BIG men like Ross Purrity, who weighed 25 pounds more than him or BIG punchers like Corrie Sanders and Lamon Brewster. Sanders was not a greatly talented fighter, but he was one of the hardest punchers of the past twenty years. Rahman said Sanders had the hardest punch he ever felt - Sanders has early KOs over boxers like Bert Cooper who went into later rounds with top heavyweights like Mercer and Holyfield.

The fighters who knocked Haye down were smaller than him: Mormeck, who fought much of his career at 190, Thompson, at 175 and Mock, who still fights at 168.

[THe TRiNiTY]

Wlad was stopped by BIG punchers like Ross Purrity, who weighed 25 pounds more than him. Corrie Sanders was not a greatly talented fighter, but he was one of the hardest punchers of the past ten years. Rahman said Sanders had the hardest punch he ever felt - Sanders has early KOs over boxers like Bert Cooper who went into later rounds with top heavyweights like Mercer and Holyfield.

The fighters who knocked Haye down were smaller than him: Mormeck, who fought much of his career at 190, Thompson, at 175 and Mock, who still fights at 168.

Not trying to egg you on but, are you ignoring my questions purposely?