were both Ali v Liston fights fixed ?

[Dynamite Kid]

were both Ali v Liston fights fixed or just the second one or none ?

i am always overly critical of Liston as a fighter but maybe its because he put in such a lifeless performance against Ali

[Silencers]

I don't think so although the second fight was su****ious.

[Derranged]

I dont know.. I mean the second fight he DID land a punch but it it didnt look that hard.. How hard was Liston's chin?

[Dynamite Kid]

I dont know.. I mean the second fight he DID land a punch but it it didnt look that hard.. How hard was Liston's chin?

exactly how much did Liston want to get up is what i look at

[Silencers]

Not long after the fight Liston said he could have gotten up but couldn't hear the count from Walcott.

He also said some years later that he could have gotten up but didn't because he didn't want to deal with the Nation of Islam.

I tend to believe the first because it was said not that long after the fight, him saying the thing about the Nation of Islam could have just been him trying to get himself back into the headlines because his career had fallen flat.

[TheGreatA]

I don't think anyone can say that this was a legitimate knockout but it may have been a flash knockdown that went wrong with Walcott's refereeing, Ali's showboating and Liston for whatever reason not wanting to get up and continue.

At the end both were on their feet throwing punches until a spectator from the crowd (Nat Fleischer) yelled at Walcott that Liston has been down for more than 10 seconds.

The fight was then stopped without Liston ever receiving a count.

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=215898

[KESSLER]

It was definitely a right hand that dropped him.