Apologies...The Problem With Criticising Floyd

[abadger]

I do not like Floyd Mayweather. I hate to see the way a boxer of such extravagant gifts runs the sport down and wastes time fighting the Big Show. But...I do think some of his more agressive critics go overboard in attacking his record and choice of opponents.

First, I think that in reality, his much derided bouts with De la Hoya and Hatton, were in fact the two most credible bouts he could have taken at the time. (I saw someone saying something like this in another thread, and it got me thinking). De la Hoya is (or was) considered to be one of the only fighters with the natural gifts to trouble Floyd. Sure he was aging, but his extra size and (presumably) power, meant that expecting him to win was at least realistic. When the fight happened, it was hardly a mismatch and Floyd simply proved to be the better boxer, which was exactly what he needed to do. If he hadn't fought the Golden Boy, then the question of which of these two amazing fighters was the best would never have been answered, and doubts would persist. Floyd made the right choice.

The same, broadly speaking, is true of Hatton, who IMO was an even more credible contender than De La Hoya. I know a lot of US fans don't like him, but he was at the time an undefeated junior welterweight (an ideal weight for Floyd) monster, who had beaten the man in Tsyzu and come up to welter and successfully taken titles. Based on past Floyd fights like Castillo 1, he also appeared to have the style, that if any could, might trouble Floyd. Again, Floyd faced him and beat him easily. Question answered again.

I do not believe that there were another two fighters out there than the gifted, bigger veteran that De La Hoya was and the up and coming unbeatable Hatton, that Floyd could have more credibly faced. In one way, Floyd beat the past, and he beat the future.

Now to the present, Miguel Cotto. I agree Floyd should fight him, but for those who accuse Floyd of ducking, is he really?. Do you honestly, in your heart of hearts belive that Cotto beats Floyd? I do not. IMO, Cotto, talent and style wise, falls somewhere between De La Hoya and Hatton, without actually having the particular gifts of either. He is a pressure fighter like Hatton, but his style is more like that of the aging de La Hoya, come ahead and somewhat predicatable. He doesn't quite have Hatton's speed, but nor does he have (IMO) the power of the larger De La Hoya. I think, in fact, that he is tailor made for Floyd, and we would see a very similar fight to Floyd/ De La Hoya, with Floyd, basically picking off the bigger man from range and getting a wide UD. If anyone has reasons why this is not the case, then I would love to hear it.

So to conclude, I think that basically Floyd believes that he has proved everything he needs to prove, and I think he is right. Sure, it would be nice to see Cotto v Mayweather, but the reality is we've seen it before, and we already know the result. Floyd has been around a long time and those who accuse him of ducking, and being a coward might perhaps benefit from a bit of perspective. Loathsome as he may be, he is by far the most gifted boxer in the world today and to be frank, he looks pretty close to unbeatable. If he wanted to, he could forge an even more impressive legacy, but at the end of the day, that is up to him. It would be great if he did, because we would get to see more of a remarkable talent, but I don't think we need to, because we already know he is the best.
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LOS ANGELES DISPENSARIES

[tito yuca]

Perfect post.

[Miburo]

Nothing that hasn't been noted before (or isn't obvious), but a good summation of all the arguments. However, many criticisms of Floyd relate not to him as a fighter, but to his recent disrespect for the sport (pro-wrestling, rematches to grab the most money, forcing Roger to can Forbes, extreme self-aggrandizement of his promotional value) all of which individually can be overlooked, but together offend the serious boxing fan. Unambiguously retiring would leave many fans wanting, but it is not the same as (and indeed would be better than) the aforementioned course.

[FRKO]

Another good post, abadger. Second one today!

I don't agree 100%, but I like the way you put across your points.

[2501]

if he's proven everything he's needed to proven, then he needs to get out of the way, keep fighting circus acts and let the real fighters fight for what he has given and is taking for granted. as long as he keeps being called the P4P #1 fighter without actually fighting the right competition, he will continue to be criticized. its that simple. i could care less how much money he gets. he can go ahead and fight a gorilla for 34 billion dollars, but if Boxing is no longer a means for him to prove his dominance as the sport's best, then he needs to step aside.

[FRKO]

as long as he keeps being called the P4P #1 fighter without actually fighting the right competition, he will continue to be criticized.

... And that's what I didn't agree with in the original post. In my opinion, he isn't the P4P #1 / best fighter in the world. He's very good, but in order to keep that title he needs to put more effort in.

[abadger]

In response to all the replies posted so far...

It is a strange situation isn't it. You are absolutely right that if Floyd wants to continue to be regarded as the p4p #1, he should get on with being a boxer. I have absolutely no doubt that if he wanted to he could clean out welter, and maybe even go down again and face Pacquaio, and then anyone else with talent between (at a push) 135 and 154. If he did that he could realistically (although by no means certainly) claim to be the GOAT. It would be an incredible achievement.

The problem is that he isn't going to do so, he clearly doesn't love boxing enough to do that, and that is a shame. I think he knows that he doesn't actually have to. From where I stand it is patently obvious that he is more talented than anyone else, and the bottom line is that until he either retires or has a shaky, over the hill performance, let alone a defeat, he knows that he is going to be regarded as the p4p #1. Even if he relinquishes his welter belt, even if he doesn't fight again for the next two years, that is how he will continue to be regarded. Say he relinquishes, cotto gets his welter title and beats everybody else, is Cotto then p4p #1? No. Floyd is. Is Pacquaio? Calzaghe? No. Its still Floyd. Its a sad state of affairs, but that is I think, the reality. Floyd is such a class apart that he can do whatever he wants without anyone being able to claim (with any real seriousness) that there is a better boxer than him in the world, which is what the ephemeral title of p4p #1 really means.

It is annoying, on so many levels, it shouldn't be that way, but unless Floyd changes, or (I think more importantly) boxing changes and becomes more of a sport than a business, then I think that's the way it stays.

Any thoughts?
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Ass teen

[Horus]

3 things are going to happen...

1. People are going to accept your post ...And Still Feel the way they do about Floyd
2. People are going to not going to accept your post. And tell you Floyd is an *******.
3. People are not EVEN going to Reply because they can not Rebuttal your argument... In an educational Manner... Instead resort to name calling and call you a Nutthugger...

That's how it works With the Floyd Haters, they will always find a way to Hate...That's just how it is...No kind of Logic or Facts or Argument is going to change this Circle of Hate...

Nothing in this world, Can Stop a hater from hating...
Especially a FLOYD hater or a Cotto Fan...

THIS POST made perfect sense and look how nobody has nothing to say about it...Look how many views this thread gets compare to a FLOyd hate Thread.... People don’t want to hear the Truth... It's an old fact about Life...

It's like the old saying goes :

Would you like to hear a Pretty Lie?
Or
The ugly Truth...!

And this Thread is the Ugly Truth....

Nonetheless when they POST something about Floyd Terrible Resume YOU will get 50 people all posting and Agreeing That FLOYD sucks and he never fought anybody good....

That's a pretty Lie...


Unless Floyd loses these Haters will never be satisfied NEVER...

That’s THE UGLY TRUTH...

[abadger]

3 things are going to happen...

1. People are going to accept your post ...And Still Feel the way they do about Floyd
2. People are going to not going to accept your post. And tell you Floyd is an *******.
3. People are not EVEN going to Reply because they can not Rebuttal your argument... In an educational Manner... Instead resort to name calling and call you a Nutthugger...

.......

Actually, I'm surprised it hasn't happened yet....
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Saltillo Engine

[2501]

Actually, I'm surprised it hasn't happened yet....

its really because about 10% criticize Floyd's resume, 20% criticize Floyd's antics outside of the ring, and 70% criticize Floyd's decisions as a Boxer/"Businessman".

When you become a "business man" above a "boxer", you let money dictate the quality of fights you engage in and at THAT isnt P4P behavior.

Its a shame that politics and money are so intertwined with this that Floyd prolly wouldnt get stripped of his title or status even if he were to rematch Baldomir again which at this point, I wouldnt be surprised if he did.

"We're not fighting to prove to the fans who the best is." - The #1 P4P fighter in the world.