Most skilled fighters past & present

[Azteca]

Ray showed more skills.

Monster difference between Corrales and Hearns. One of them being huge disparities in skill.

As for the thread:
Louis, Dempsey (he was skilled for his time), Hagler, Toney, Nunn, Curry, Leonard, Hearns, Benitez, Duran, Arguello, Sanchez,

[El Termible]

Past: Pernell Whitaker, I was never really a fan of him but he did some things I've never seen any other fighter do. Great defensive fighter.

Present: Juan Manuel Marquez. His boxing abilities are second to none. Great counterpuncher and unlike other "boxers" he doesn't run.

[wpink1]

Everyone on here knows I am rays biggest fans..But name the skills that Ray showed that Mayweather hasnt. Defense is a skill and Mayweather has a much better defense.

I will agree that Leonard has 4 top tier fighters that Mayweather can not list, but Mayweather at 130 has Corrales, then Castillo, at 135, then lets look at his success at 17 pounds to 24 pounds vs Leonards.... Judah, Baldimer, DLH, possibly Cotto....vs Ray's Lalonde, SD victory over hagler, draw with hearns, older Duran, then stopped vs Norris. Yes Ray was older and retired often at the time, but fact remains we have to judge consistently.

Ray my favorite does not have the consistent success at higher weights that Mayweather has. At their original weights I dont think you can list a skill that Ray had shown that Mayweather didnt, and I can name one that Mayweather shown to be better at than Leoanrd ...Defense. Also as much as I love Ray, I dont think you would see a smaller fighter move up 2 weight classes and beat Mayweather, like you did see Duran beat Leoanrd.

[pbftxrs316]

Too anyone who doubts Mayweather skills think back to the skills he showed at 130...when early on he was beating EASILY champions. I suggest you all identify what you define as skills as in my box, boxing, defense, usinng speed to gain advantageous angles, pivot and not get hit, power (which mayweather had at his original weight,, 5 knockdowns of Corrales who was much bigger fighter and undefeated ko artist..at the time).

Look at youtube for mayweather at 130....What he did to a peak Corrales, undefeeated Corrales....We give Ray Leonard credit for his great fight vs hearns when had ot comeback and stop hearns..but Hmmm Corrales who was 33-0 at the time (28 kos) (Hearns was 32-0 30 kos)...simply was destroyed from the start. Who showed more skill....I say Mayweather..I think what Ray showed was an ability to change stills and heart.

Don't discredit fighters because they are simply too good for their opposition and they show tremendous skill doing.

Look at Mayweather at 130...Dammmm Leonard himself never had a showing this good vs a top fighter like Corrales...We are talking a great fighter who was undefeated at his peak...Corrales that fought in the best fight over the last 10 years with Castillo, a brawl and won...but got outboxed, outslugged, out everything vs Mayweather. Remember this fight was toughted as their version of Hearns-leonard at the time of the buildup.

thank you. great post.

[Ryn0]

Everyone on here knows I am rays biggest fans..But name the skills that Ray showed that Mayweather hasnt. Defense is a skill and Mayweather has a much better defense.

I will agree that Leonard has 4 top tier fighters that Mayweather can not list, but Mayweather at 130 has Corrales, then Castillo, at 135, then lets look at his success at 17 pounds to 24 pounds vs Leonards.... Judah, Baldimer, DLH, possibly Cotto....vs Ray's Lalonde, SD victory over hagler, draw with hearns, older Duran, then stopped vs Norris. Yes Ray was older and retired often at the time, but fact remains we have to judge consistently.

Ray my favorite does not have the consistent success at higher weights that Mayweather has. At their original weights I dont think you can list a skill that Ray had shown that Mayweather didnt, and I can name one that Mayweather shown to be better at than Leoanrd ...Defense. Also as much as I love Ray, I dont think you would see a smaller fighter move up 2 weight classes and beat Mayweather, like you did see Duran beat Leoanrd.

We are not talking about opponents but skill but point taken. Leonard however had power moving up in weight whereas mayweather hasn't that is why he has perfected his boxing technique and defense at welter. His offense is a hit and run style at welter which suits him an i find it good to watch others find it boring. If he managed to carry his power in welter then i think he would fight in a much different way. Leonard beat hagler (he think hagler won but it's the judges that count) and it was close enough to not be robbery that alone should give him advantage over mayweather's opponents as well as Stopping Hearns and making Duran quite those 3 fighters are better than any single figghter on mayweathers lidt in my eyes.

Other skilled boxers
Robinson
Azumah Nelson
Duran
Hagler
JMM
PBF
Calzaghe
Whittaker
Ali

[wpink1]

Ryno113...your post is great, but it actually solidifies exactly my point. Mayweather does not have power that a leonard has or carried, or at least we tend to say..More of that later...But due ot his lack of power at welterweight and jr middleweight, what we see is a figher that relies on skills. defensive, maybe boring, but still ring generalship, clean effective punching, movement, very calculating offensive repitoire....This all at weight class much higher that he has a effective career at with good solid fights vs a fight or two.... Much differnet than ray...

As for power, I think that Ray again my favorite fighter of all time, on fighter that I will go down to the grave defending,,,gets some unearned points for that at higher weight vs Mayweather. Lalonde if you recall had to shed weight down to a weight LESS than the lightheavyweight floor, due to a negotiating agreement which required Lalond to weight in less than 168. Unheard of...that I can not support ray for. He did ko Lalond with a beautify combination, ala a Ray leonard late round flurry..Which allows us to again point out his heart, finishing skills, and crowd pleasing style, but keep in mind Lalond could have been weakened due to the agreement before the fight. Also, Ray was again dropped, and do we sometime awards more points to a fighter that has to tough it out to win, vs a fighter who utilizes great defensive skills to avoid getting hit and thus not having to tough it out and easily win a fight vs hmmmm a Baldimir.....19 pounds higher for mayweather who stared at 128....21 pounds higher for ray who stared at 147...Hmmm I think Mayweather showcased much more all around skills in his one sided beating of Baldimir defensive, hit and not get hit..vs Ray comefrom behind victory vs Lalond.

Ray at middleweight recorded no stops, he did stop Kalule at Jr...did stop Lalond as we pointed out. Mayweather hasnt had any stops at 147 or 54 either except for Gotti...So I simply can not say Leonard carried his power up the ranks better than Mayweather.

We simply always discredit Mayweather because he is not giving to us what we dream for a Castillo corrales fight, or Duran Leoarnd, or hearns leonard....No mayweather simply shuts down his very very good opposition with a skill to minimize punishment, and get this, he moves less than ray did vs Duran or Hagler......He does move but compare Leonard in those two fights and then Mayweather. Also look at Mayweather vs Corrales and his movement and total dominance, and compare it to Ray vs Hearns.. I am not saying Corrales is a Hearns, but Corrales was a great fighter that went on to win championships north as well, and was undefeated, iko artist who had the height advantage on Mayweather. In fact is was billed as their Hearns vs Leonard fight. Again Maywether did not have to come from the brink of defeat, he simply used movement and defense and outboxed Corrales, the outslugged him and made him look horrible. Ray my favorite beat many many top fighters but neve dominated a fighter that good that way....NEVER!

So in summary appreciate Mayweather. I hate his attitude, I hope he loses too, because in a way I will have to move my favoirte down a notch from the top all time if Mayweather goes on and beats Hatton and Cotto.. No he does not have a Hearns, Hagler or duran on his resume, but he also doesnt have any losses on his resume, he did not let a smaller man come up and beat him. He did nothave to lose a fighter to realize who he was and get tougher and smarter, he came in the boxing game with that. he beat very good and great fighters early on and through out his career ...EASILY. Never negotiated any suble advantages in the terms of the fight, beating Gotti in his back yard, beating DLH on cinco demayo in his homeaway from home wiht Dlh ring and glove requirements, and weight requirments.

Mayweather is the real deal!