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  • #21
    Originally posted by Smokin' View Post
    Dude, this guy was skilled though. Threw straight shots, nice footwork, incredible speed. He just threw punches in bunches and got hit alot which is why people classify him as such.
    He also jumped in throwing six to eight straight hooking body shots without throwing a jab, and led with the right hand often abandoning defense while getting hit flush. He was a mobile slugger.



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    • #22
      Originally posted by Smokin' View Post
      All those guys with the exception of Jackson were super skilled enigma's. Guys who generally get reps for being 'brawlers' but in essence these guys were super skilled guys who liked to fight and thrived off of getting hit. Jackson was just exciting as hell with that punch of his.

      I think you like those iron chinned, skilled, warrior types. All of the guys you mentioned had big hearts.

      Hagler, especially, is mistaken as a brawler/arrior type. He won a great deal of fights by boxing. He'd paste guys with that awesome jab, rake them with combos, & not take much back in return. Once he hurt them, though, he turned up the heat & finished the job. He brawled more against certain opponents (Hearns, Obel, Mugabi).....
      He also boxed a little too much against both Duran & Leonard. He needed to get on their asses earler & more than he did.

      Larry Holmes was definitely a boxer. He rarely fought on the inside. He didn't have much of a left hook. But, he did not lay back & wait. He made the guy punch. He also had as much heart as any fighter I have ever seen.


      I like what you said about both Pryor & Duran, smokin'......very true.

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      • #23
        Originally posted by jabsRstiff View Post
        Hagler, especially, is mistaken as a brawler/arrior type. He won a great deal of fights by boxing. He'd paste guys with that awesome jab, rake them with combos, & not take much back in return. Once he hurt them, though, he turned up the heat & finished the job. He brawled more against certain opponents (Hearns, Obel, Mugabi).....
        He also boxed a little too much against both Duran & Leonard. He needed to get on their asses earler & more than he did.

        Larry Holmes was definitely a boxer. He rarely fought on the inside. He didn't have much of a left hook. But, he did not lay back & wait. He made the guy punch. He also had as much heart as any fighter I have ever seen.


        I like what you said about both Pryor & Duran, smokin'......very true.
        I hear ya. I think the main reason Hagler is known for being a warrior of sorts is because of his training habits. I mean, the guy trained year round and excluded himself from everyone. Alot like Hopkins...both of these guys are extremely skilled infighters and guys who knew every little trick. Just because they arent in the same mold as guys like Leonard, Ali, they kind of get a bad rep and get underappreciated. **** that. I do have him losing to Leonard, by the way.

        I agree with you about Larry. He was just a crazy athlete. I honestly believe he would be made for any sport. I heard he started boxing really late...to have the skillset he had (which wasn't exceptional but was still very good) was pretty amazing. That jab is the best I have ever seen...and yes better then Ali's.

        I just watched Arguello - Pryor I the other day for the first time in a long, long time. Was it just me or was Pryor actually BOXING later in the fight. Proves my point that the best fighters are the fighters who can adapt..fight inside, fight outside, fight as a slugger not just one dimension (guys who just stay on the inside, guys who just fight on the outside).

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        • #24
          Originally posted by Smokin' View Post
          Brawlers get a bad rep. Pryor and Duran were both extremely skilled athletes. They aren't just "brawlers" who look for that one big shot.
          Good point. I might add that while Duran came to prominence as a "brawler" he pretty much deployed all 4 basic styles as the situation or opponent dictated. The fight that best exemplified his brawling style was (aptly named) "The Brawl in Montreal" which kept Sugar Ray Leonard back on his heels...

          Aaron Pryor's epic battles with Alexis Arguello also best exemplified his brawling style. As Nostromo said, all it takes is one "brawler" to guarantee and exciting fight. When both fighters decide to brawl in one fight, you get toe-to-toe epic battles like Gatti/Ward and Barrera/Morales.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by RunW/Knives View Post
            He also jumped in throwing six to eight straight hooking body shots without throwing a jab, and led with the right hand often abandoning defense while getting hit flush. He was a mobile slugger.
            Yeah he threw shots without abandon but I mean they were straight and it wasn't like he was throwing wild ass hooks. He threw with the intention of scoring. Boxer puncher to me but I respect your opinion.

            Duran..what's your opinion on him. He is in my mind a puncher boxer. Dude was straight up skilled. One of the best I have ever seen. His bout with Leonard the first time sends shivers up my spine.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by Panamaniac View Post
              Good point. I might add that while Duran came to prominence as a "brawler" he pretty much deployed all 4 basic styles as the situation or opponent dictated. The fight that best exemplified his brawling style was (aptly named) "The Brawl in Montreal" which kept Sugar Ray Leonard back on his heels...

              Aaron Pryor's epic battles with Alexis Arguello also best exemplified his brawling style. As Nostromo said, all it takes is one "brawler" to guarantee and exciting fight. When both fighters decide to brawl in one fight, you get toe-to-toe epic battles like Gatti/Ward and Barrera/Morales.
              Yeah but Duran was a skilled brawler. He had the art of infighting to a tee. Used alot of feints, head movements, angles, this guy was the perfect infighter. Extremely skilled alot like Toney. Both of these guys really learned the craft to infighting and making a foe miss but slipping or taking the sting off shots. He also fought a little on the outside against Leonard. Picking his shots against the younger and seemingly more talented foe.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by Smokin' View Post
                I hear ya. I think the main reason Hagler is known for being a warrior of sorts is because of his training habits. I mean, the guy trained year round and excluded himself from everyone. Alot like Hopkins...both of these guys are extremely skilled infighters and guys who knew every little trick. Just because they arent in the same mold as guys like Leonard, Ali, they kind of get a bad rep and get underappreciated. **** that. I do have him losing to Leonard, by the way.

                I agree with you about Larry. He was just a crazy athlete. I honestly believe he would be made for any sport. I heard he started boxing really late...to have the skillset he had (which wasn't exceptional but was still very good) was pretty amazing. That jab is the best I have ever seen...and yes better then Ali's.

                I just watched Arguello - Pryor I the other day for the first time in a long, long time. Was it just me or was Pryor actually BOXING later in the fight. Proves my point that the best fighters are the fighters who can adapt..fight inside, fight outside, fight as a slugger not just one dimension (guys who just stay on the inside, guys who just fight on the outside).
                Yes, he was......& that was what really helped him win the fight. He was overwhelming Arguello with early activity, but Arguello hung in & was starting to land a good amount of power shots. When Pryor switched to boxing, he shut Arguello down, cut him, & took some starch out of Alexis.
                Of all the experts polled back in the day.....Steve Farhood was the only person who picked Pryor to win. He actually felt that if Pryor boxed, he could definitely befuddle Arguello, who was slow-footed (as shown when he was upset prviously by Vilomar Hernandez).
                Pryor showed a little of everything in that fight.

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by jabsRstiff View Post
                  Yes, he was......& that was what really helped him win the fight. He was overwhelming Arguello with early activity, but Arguello hung in & was starting to land a good amount of power shots. When Pryor switched to boxing, he shut Arguello down, cut him, & took some starch out of Alexis.
                  Of all the experts polled back in the day.....Steve Farhood was the only person who picked Pryor to win. He actually felt that if Pryor boxed, he could definitely befuddle Arguello, who was slow-footed (as shown when he was upset prviously by Vilomar Hernandez).
                  Pryor showed a little of everything in that fight.
                  Yeah i mean I read alot about Pryor years ago and they all said how he was like a human windmill. Just threw a bunch of punches. I watched some of his fights (to be honest only the sparring with Hearns, Cervantes, and Pryor) and this guy was a beast. One of those guys in training who could basically do whatever he wanted. If he wanted to box he would clown the **** out of you. If he wanted to brawl you would be on the ropes covering up. This guy was a beast. He is extremely underappreciated.

                  I mean, imagine this guy vs. Floyd at 135 or 140. I chuckle because he is basically Floyd on wheels.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by Smokin' View Post
                    Yeah but Duran was a skilled brawler. He had the art of infighting to a tee. Used alot of feints, head movements, angles, this guy was the perfect infighter. Extremely skilled alot like Toney. Both of these guys really learned the craft to infighting and making a foe miss but slipping or taking the sting off shots. He also fought a little on the outside against Leonard. Picking his shots against the younger and seemingly more talented foe.
                    You won't get an argument to the contrary from me...

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by Panamaniac View Post
                      Good point. I might add that while Duran came to prominence as a "brawler" he pretty much deployed all 4 basic styles as the situation or opponent dictated. The fight that best exemplified his brawling style was (aptly named) "The Brawl in Montreal" which kept Sugar Ray Leonard back on his heels...
                      Wait a minute, u talkin about the same fight where mister 4 styles kept sayin' "No Mas"?????? He was good but like the next guy said, he was skilled Brawler, he knew how to setup his wild shots with feints & head movement! U Can Dig it?!?!

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